Newbie wants to know the differences in wire sizes

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I just ran out of wire in my welder. I didn't know what size was in it (purchased used) but assumed it was .035 as that's what the manual mentions for flux-core and the tip was a 0.9mm one. The spool was blank. Well, when I pulled the spool I saw the label was on the inside   and the wire was .030. Well, at least it was flux-core -- kills my blaming the wire for my welds though. So now I'm wondering several things:1. Did having .030 wire running through a .035 tip affect the welds (I was just running beads so no biggie)?2. I've read posts from people suggesting that others use this or that size for better penetration and I'm not sure how such a minor difference in the size of the wire would affect penetration. Can someone help me understand that? )A link would be fine.)3. I was told that this unit will not take the 10-pound/8” spools of wire. Something about needing a different spindle and hub, etc. Well, removing the old spool revealed that this unit does have the larger hub capability and seems to have the piece for it, too. So I'm going to look for a bigger spool and would like suggestion on either .035 or .030 as a general purpose flux-core wire (with appropriate tip)?Thanks.Warning: I have been wrong before!New small workshop, small MIG, oxyacetylene set with a DHC-2000 that I'm learning to use and really like. Life is good!Typos are there for those that look for them. I try to do something for everybody.
Reply:1. Did having .030 wire running through a .035 tip affect the welds (I was just running beads so no biggie)?
Reply:With the thinner wire, the actual electrons of energy are more condensed, it will not really burn all that hotter, but it does melt the wire better, and the energy transfers to the base metal much better. It's similar to running a 20A circuit on a #14 wire. It can handle it, but the wire will get hotter, and can overload and burn. So, we use a #12 wire instead. It stays cooler, and can handle more amps.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyProbably not. If the .035 was really egged out bad (wore) then maybe some. Lots of folks run a .035 with .030 flux core just so they don't have feed problems. I match the tip to the wire but on the other hand run a tip till it's toast.
Reply:Originally Posted by RojodiabloWith the thinner wire, the actual electrons of energy are more condensed, it will not really burn all that hotter, but it does melt the wire better, and the energy transfers to the base metal much better. It's similar to running a 20A circuit on a #14 wire. It can handle it, but the wire will get hotter, and can overload and burn. So, we use a #12 wire instead. It stays cooler, and can handle more amps.
Reply:Really? In the 1-pound spools they're both $10 at Home Depot. Saw some "kits" on ebay that included a 10-pound spool, new liner, plastic nozzle and tip for $61. Wire alone from the same seller is $55, so $6 seemed like a decent price for the extras.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyYou can get 10lbs of .035 nr211 from lowes for around $35-$38 plus tax. Even at an LWS .035 in a name brand will run $38 to $45. TSC has good prices, just not always in the wire you want. Just watch for deals and get it when you see it instead of in a panic on Sunday afternoon. No way I'm gonna pay $9 to $10 a pound.
Reply:The welding supplies places here kind of bother me in that nothing is ever marked (like buying metal which confuses me, too) and I hate to have to ask how much everything is before I decide to buy it. They seem put out as they have to look everything up in the books or on the computer and that's too much work.
Reply:Sandy, is there a good way to say get a 44 pound spool and wind it to a 10lb?Various GrindersVictor Journeyman torch200cf Acet. 250cf oxygenLincoln 175 plus/alpha2 gunLincoln v205t tigLincoln 350mpEsab 650 plasmaWhen you can get up in the morning, Its a good day.Live each day like its your last.
Reply:The .030 will tade less amperage to melt therefore it is better to use small wire on thinner gauge material. A lot of autobody guys run .023 becuse it puts less heat into the panels causing less warpage. I run typically use the correct size contact tip for the wire unless I'm running in a spray transfer, because I find that the tip distort fast at the high amperage. Or if I'm running dual shield.... I sometimes run the next size tip with that as well.For the most part a grooved roller gets used for solid wires and a knurled roller gets used for inner shield or dual shield wires.... I'm not saying this is the way it has to be but by design the knurled is better to use with any cored wire._________________Chris
Reply:Prices are not marked at Welding Supply stores because most of the people that shop there don't care what it costs. Just pick it up cause they need it, pay for it and out the door. At our local supply they look at you like you are a rookie or just stupid because you don't want to spend twice what you can buy elsewhere.He who dies with the most tools wins
Reply:Originally Posted by lorenzoFor the most part a grooved roller gets used for solid wires and a knurled roller gets used for inner shield or dual shield wires.... I'm not saying this is the way it has to be but by design the knurled is better to use with any cored wire.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyUnfortunately there is one terrible price difference price difference between the .030 and .035..  The .035 is easier to make and generally cheaper. Not that you can't get good deals on .030, they are just not as easy to find nor as frequent.
Reply:Originally Posted by PitalplacePrices are not marked at Welding Supply stores because most of the people that shop there don't care what it costs. Just pick it up cause they need it, pay for it and out the door. At our local supply they look at you like you are a rookie or just stupid because you don't want to spend twice what you can buy elsewhere.
Reply:Originally Posted by VisorblueIt wasn't listed in the main part of the manual but in the maintenance section on the drive roller R&R it mentioned that it was made for .023 - .025 and .030 - .035 wires and that the .030 - .035 side was knurled. I'll have to play with the pound of .035 I just installed to see if I see a difference between it and the .030 I was using -- I doubt I will due to my low experience level.
Reply:Originally Posted by lorenzoI think the welding stores don't pricing anything just to see what they can charge..... it's a bit different with the companies on acct but for the everyday Joe who has wandered in for the first time may leave a lighter in the wallet than others.
Reply:Sandy, is there a good way to say get a 44 pound spool and wind it to a 10lb?
Reply:I think I discovered the price variance in .030 and .035, the .035 is a 10# spool and the .030 is a 12# spool. The .030 is about $6 more at Lowes, $38 vs. $44. However, I don't see the .030 flux listed on Lincoln's site, just the .035:
Reply:I've got a bad habit of calling them all 10# ers. Sorry bout that. They're 8 inch spools and sort of vary in weight wire to wire and brand to brand. I think the big box stores can afford to put stuff out there at some pretty decent prices, they just aren't reliable in keeping what you want in stock.
Reply:Should match your wire to your roller size and your tip.  If you have rubber rollers then  match your tip. Rubber Rollers are adjustable  About the only problem I know of that might crop up using a .035 tip on .030 wire is it may start dragging after a while because the wire may arc on the larger tip as it passes thru.  But unless your doing some real serious stuff, I wouldn't worry about it.If you want to do some beautiful FC work, hook a gas bottle behind it and buy some dual shield wire.  It goes in like butter but it's hot as hell and you will need to change gloves regularily.DonM > ASME High Pressure Vessel
Reply:Originally Posted by donmIf you want to do some beautiful FC work, hook a gas bottle behind it and buy some dual shield wire.  It goes in like butter but it's hot as hell and you will need to change gloves regularily.
Reply:Now that I've decided on an 8" spool of .030 I just found out Lincoln doesn't make .030 in 8".
Reply:I think you are 100% right,welding supply stores have different prices for different people.I wanted 44# roll of ER70S6 wire.cheapiest I could find on ebay was $1.18 per #(that was shipping included) I called shop I use alot and he said they could give me the prefered customer price .82# so out the door I payed $38.24 for 44# of wire.now if I can get that pricing all the time.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyWhat you want to zero in on at an intro level is flux core in E71T-11 or E71T-GS. You can probably find some decent prices using these criteria first and branding second.
Reply:WELDING STORE WOESas much as i like to support the small business guys,I truly hate walking into the welding store and ty to find other sources for as much as possible.PROS of welding store: Usualy have the nice little supplies that are impossible to find anywhere else,Occasionaly you get lucky and one or two of the guys actualy weld(helps avoid that glassy eyed stare so prevailent at "big box"stores), Usualy high qaulity stuff,can order most of anything they dont have on stockCons:exspensive as hell repeat expensive,Rarely open other then standard business hrs(same time you are usualy at work)Most are particularily brand specific and will downplay the merits of a machine or product they dont carry.Want attention at a welding store go hang out and check out the options and build of one of their biggest floor or mobile units...ull get help even if they gotta run over small children to get to ya!!And by the way anyone who ever and i mean ever buys grinding or wire wheels or discs at a welding store needs to get kick me tatooed on their forehead!Sorry bout the rant.not much i can add that hasnt been said and ive been trying to get to the welding store for one of those impossible items for 2 weeks now but they r closed on the weekends and by the time i get off work!Originally Posted by ridgerunnerWELDING STORE WOESas much as i like to support the small business guys,I truly hate walking into the welding store and ty to find other sources for as much as possible.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyWhat you want to zero in on at an intro level is flux core in E71T-11 or E71T-GS. You can probably find some decent prices using these criteria first and branding second.
Reply:Did a few searches and found some people on the Hobart forum that like the Blue Demon E71T-GS wire so I decided to go ahead and take a few minutes and try it tonite.The hole in the spool is smaller than Lincoln's which is a minor hassle for my toy mig as the spindle is plastic and almost the same diameter as the spool hole. So, it was a bit snug. I coated the spindle with silicone and that seemed to help -- I know I want some friction for braking, but it was a bit too snug. The wire fed fine and the arc is bright which took me by surprise and made me stop and check to make sure my auto-helmet was functioning okay. The arc color is more yellow-gold than what I've seen, too. Ran a bunch of quick beads and it flows nicely. Could be my imagination but the puddle seemed easier to see and control. WAY nicer, for my newbie taste, than the Lincoln .035. Maybe I'll like .035 when I have more experience, for now I like .030 and this Blue Demon wire as my general purpose wire.And at $11.72 for a 2-pound spool, vs. $10 for a 1-pound spool of the Lincoln wire, I'm real close to getting 8" spool prices without the weight and possibility of the wire going bad before I use it. I'm happy. Warning: I have been wrong before!New small workshop, small MIG, oxyacetylene set with a DHC-2000 that I'm learning to use and really like. Life is good!Typos are there for those that look for them. I try to do something for everybody.
Reply:I'm not overly clear on the difference between E71T-11 and E71T-GS, other than some material says that E71T-11 can be used for multi-pass and E71T-GS should only be used for single pass.
Reply:Happy Welding Store Experience!As it seems this thread has morphed into a discussion of welding supply stores I want to tell you a good news story.  I visited my local Praxair store  (I was a little intimidated about going in as I knew I didn't know very much) The counter sales guy I spoke to acted like he had nothing better to do than chat with me. We talked about TIG vs MIG, Fluxcore Vs, MIG 120V vs 230V pros and cons of different brands and models. He even gave me a brochure showing the sale they had on Lincoln SP 135 and 175. So I decided on a SP175 plus and put it on my Christmas list.When my wife went Christmas shopping things got even better, they couldn't get an sp175+ so they gave her a new180c for 50 bucks more than the sale price on the 175. Then they cut her a deal on two welding hemets and because she had to make two trips to pick stuff up because of a shipping problem he threw in 2 pairs on gloves and a couple of welding caps for free!You can bet I will be going back there!
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyYeh sometimes ya get a snoot full of the things handed out from the guy behind the counter. I rely on them for good and accurate info and sometimes feel pretty cheated when some obvious crap comes across instead. Basically---------and on the humerous side, IF E71T-11 and E71T-GS were the "same wire" then they wouldn't have different labels. Even a dumby like me can pick up on that.
Reply:Originally Posted by Ed WWhen my wife went Christmas shopping things got even better, they couldn't get an sp175+ so they gave her a new180c for 50 bucks more than the sale price on the 175.
Reply:well if you are welding thin material then go .030 if welding lager then go .035 as it will deposit more filler.
Reply:Originally Posted by TIGBOYwell if you are welding thin material then go .030 if welding lager then go .035 as it will deposit more filler.
Reply:Originally Posted by VisorblueGoing slower with .030 would do that, too, right? It's a newbie thing, I know, but I seem to have gotten comfortable with the way .030 works in this welder. I was amazed that 5/100th of an inch difference made that much of a difference in how it worked. While this Blue Demon stuff is different from the Lincoln .030 I'd been using for two weeks it's a lot closer than the Lincoln .035 wire. The .030 wire seems more forgiving. Or, have I been inhaling too many flux fumes?
Reply:Originally Posted by RojodiabloI TOLD you the thinner wire will work better for the smaller welder...The .035 takes a good bit more power to get it to flow like you can get the .030 to.