Vertical TIG: Up or Down?

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Could someone describe the benefits of TIG welding up or down?  Im working on this, and made a mess of a weld while trying...ThermalArc 185MillerMatic 180 w/ AutosetVictor Cutskill Oxy/AcetyleneThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38and spite!
Reply:Uphill is best.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Also vote for uphill.Gravity pulls the puddle down.  In downhill the puddle will tend to flow down in front of the arc unless it is keep cold enough to prevent this.  When the puddle is infront of the arc, the puddle gets hotter and runs more.  The arc is not melting the base metal so penetration is shot.  Pulsing, as in orbital welding will allow downhill welding.In uphill, the welding heat can be substantially higher because you are contiually moving away from the puddle as the puddle sags in the opposite direction, allowing the puddle to solidify and form a shelf helping to support the ongoing pool.  The arc is melting the base metal ensuring good penetration and fusion.
Reply:I was told to never do downhill with any process on anything thicker than 1/8.  You just dont get the penetration.  What do you guys think?Various GrindersVictor Journeyman torch200cf Acet. 250cf oxygenLincoln 175 plus/alpha2 gunLincoln v205t tigLincoln 350mpEsab 650 plasmaWhen you can get up in the morning, Its a good day.Live each day like its your last.
Reply:Originally Posted by DoolittleI was told to never do downhill with any process on anything thicker than 1/8.  You just dont get the penetration.  What do you guys think?
Reply:Never say never, but it makes sense.360 degree orbital tube welding is done without wire on stuff less that 1/8", but thicker material that requires a joint, wire feed, and multiple passes is done "double-up", start at the bottom and go to the top, then go back to the bottom and do the other side.If I recall correctly, I think the root pass on pipe is sometimes done downhill with stick (E6010).I've seen machine cladding of SS downhill with pulsed MIG, but it had to travel around 60 ipm, while oscillating side to side,  to stay ahead of the puddle.
Reply:Originally Posted by pulserIf I recall correctly, I think the root pass on pipe is sometimes done downhill with stick (E6010).
Reply:Originally Posted by pulserAlso vote for uphill.Gravity pulls the puddle down.  In downhill the puddle will tend to flow down in front of the arc unless it is keep cold enough to prevent this.  When the puddle is infront of the arc, the puddle gets hotter and runs more.  The arc is not melting the base metal so penetration is shot.  Pulsing, as in orbital welding will allow downhill welding.In uphill, the welding heat can be substantially higher because you are contiually moving away from the puddle as the puddle sags in the opposite direction, allowing the puddle to solidify and form a shelf helping to support the ongoing pool.  The arc is melting the base metal ensuring good penetration and fusion.
Reply:I was taught verticle up is the strongest weld.  This was stick, but I think its the same for TIG and MIG or FCAW.  If I want the strongest weld, I turn the piece so it has to be welded up.Verticle down has its place.  DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.