snow plow reapir

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ive got some local TOOLBOX who wants me reair a snow plow, i havent seen it yet but he says its a SMALL REPAIR now i have a AC225 BUZZ BOX  and my hoFART 135 WITH FLUXCORE  i feel more comfortable with the mig but im leary that the machince wont have enough NUT for this repairand helpful hints as far as preheat or beveling or peening  or what ever,  thanks brian ?hes three towns over, i was thinking $25 just to check it out and then $25 hour ?????????????????
Reply:You most likely will not have enough power in the 135 unit. I would not hesitate to go with the stick. $ 25.00 per Hr. sounds pretty low, but if it works for you both go for it.J P Streets Welding LLC
Reply:thanks for the quick reply, but i feel more capable with the mig, and its easier to transport , ive got fluxcore .35 wire and need to know if multi pass beads are a option, thanks again  brian
Reply:I thought you were a "Welding instructor
Reply:yeah dude i teach a tig welding class, dont  jump on a thread to beat your chest...
Reply:A tig class huh!You posted this over on the dark side. (quote from arcdawg)i consider myself a pretty good tig welder. the problem that i face is all of the buttons and switches, polarity really gives me headache. i know about ac is aluminum dc negitive is for steels but on certian machines its worded funny, like dc straight and dc reverse. why is that, i believe that dc reverse is for smaw but its just to g.d. confusing, what ever happend to those olde lindes........ now im using a syncrowave and i feel like you need to be a rocket scientest to run the welder............... helps or hints would help me out so much thanks brianI would be hesitant to pay money for a class, where the instructor didn't understand a simple thing like polarity!
Reply:your right jim, its stupid to ask for helpful hints.i thought that these boards are here to help each other? if you dont want to help i would ask you not to reply to my threads.and if you READ my polarity question it states the i do know about the settings, i was just asking for easy way of rembering them.i would like to see you have 10 guys asking you 10 diffrent questions at the same time and be able to HAVE ALL OF THE AWNSERS
Reply:I was a certified instructor in the Navy. I taught a six week maintenance course. I've taught Florida DEP approved regional short schools on maintenance. And I've taught the Florida concealed weapons permit course. The key to being a successful teacher is to be intimately familiar with your subject matter. By reading your posts it's obvious that your not. For the odd question that I couldn't answer, I'd tell the student that I would research and get back to them.
Reply:Must be he's a NEA card carryin Union Public School "teacher".Probly wears a neck tie and a lab coat too.Seems like if he was hooked to the proper equipment he could power a small subdivision.Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:I don't think that anyone should be put down or insulted for asking a legitimate question. No one is so smart that he/ she can't learn something new. Egos and self back-patting should be left at the door. There are always helpful hints that can help someone retain information.Last edited by Scott S; 01-31-2004 at 10:38 PM.
Reply:sorry guys the only time i wear a tie is to a wedding or a funeral,and just to let you know i work as a welder full time and the n i teach a class one night a week and if i have to sub i will. if i was such a BAD teacher i  doubt that i would get the chance to keep coming back. last semester i had around a dozen guys in the class and after the saftey lecture i had all of them welding the first night.  these guys pay to WELD. they are given a book that we  read thoughout the class, but my main focus is for them to WELD,you dont learn hoe to drive a car by reading the book do ya ?
Reply:oh and this had nothing to do with my TEACHING abilities. it had everything to do with i needed some ideas on a PROJECT.
Reply:Wihtout more details on what exactly needs to be repaired, its pretty hard to offer advice on process selection or any good hints. Unless he wants you to fix the sheet metal housing of the hydraulics, you probably are going to have to use the stick. Get some pics, or details of the repair, for better advice.What fluxcore wire are you running? If its E71T-GS you cannot multipass with it.
Reply:i just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to reply, i really have no idea what this repair is going to consist of. i was talking to this guys employee on fri night and he said oh my boss has a small repair, i always look for side work..... in my mig right now im runnig FABSHEILD21B IS THIS OK, i was thinking multi pass if its a frame or somthing over3/16 and should i preheat? is the metal that the frame made up of heattreated or work hardened ?  thanks again brian
Reply:Here is a link to that wire's specs: http://www.hobartbrothers.com/produc....asp?prodID=18As you can see, its rated for multipass.Without seeing the part, its impossible to even guess if its hardened or not. Preheating can cheat your way into having a little better fusion and penetration, but if its just normal steel, its not required beyond bringing it into the 200F range to drive out moisture (or at least room temperature). If its the frame or bracket that bears signifigant wieght, and its over 1/8th, you would be doing a great injustice to your customer by not using the stick. In the long run, its better to tell a customer 'i don't have the equipment to do this thick of a repair', than to do a repair that will fail due to poor fusion or poor technique. You might not make the money from this job, but if you repair it, and the weld tears out, you've lost the customer for life, and probably some badmouth to his friends.
Reply:really 1/8 in STICK IT  ? i thought that i could get pretty good BITE  with my 135, i really didnt want to break out the ac225, 50 lb mig comapred to the 100lb stick ahh my poor back........... thanks for the link,
Reply:I have and use snow plows and they really take a beating. I would heavily suggest you give your back a work out and use that stick welder. I have repaired and modified (3rd trip spring) my plow several times and once had it repaired by a plow service shop (i happend to be plowing at the time of breakdown, what luck!). My A frame broke at pivot and head mechanic beveled it and reweled it with stick welder. Only hardened part of plow I know of is cutting edge and you replace not repaire that.
Reply:Arcdawg;Take this for what it's worth. But from your posts, you don't have the skills, or knowledge to do this Job. Do the plow guy a favor and decline it. It would be safer for both you and him. The plow guy won't have his equipment fail`, and possibly cause damage or injury. And you won't have that on your conscience, or face litigation.I mean this in good will. You seem like you have a lot of pride. Causing a serious injury would probably devistate you.
Reply:hey buddy, i am more than able to do this job... the line of work that i do my welds get inspected by the fire marshall of the town im working in, i have currently  installed over thirty hoods and have run a few lenghts of duct in my day AND EVERYTIME I PASS THE INSPECTION, the reason why i posted this tread was to get some feedback on the plowframes them selves and to see if my mig would be powerful enough,i have built trailers, rebuilt and hardfaced buckets, put floor pans in cars,built kitchen hoods and whatever comes my way s oa little repair doesnt scare me however you make a valid point about people being SUE happy, i will give you that much....i would say that i have more skill and knowledge then you THINK.i dont think that its a good idea to discourage someone from a good work experience.....ill bust out my stick machine and lay some sweet beads that will be there longer than the truck itself....
Reply:I do not reply much here but I would not use a 135 machine for plow frames, moldboards and such. I have fixed, rebuilt, fabricated and welded many plow frames and the like. I have fixed other "welders" work who have welded with 135 machines and it had minimal penetration and always broke again. Why do you have to go to the plow. As for the plow, you did not give details on the repair. Is it the frame or plow or uprights. Have the customer come to you if you have a shop. If you do not have a larger machine then I would also pass on it. Cause he will be M/Fing you at 3 am when it breaks again and he is trying to plow and make money.   T.J.www.tjsperformance.com -- if it does not exist we can make it...
Reply:If I were you I would think about using someones machine to complete this type repair. I too have made many repairs to snow plows with my Ranger, you see the problem is these guys get in the truck and tear things apart with them. And when something you repaired fails due to them trying to be a hero plowing into something like a stone wall at 40 mph thet tend to get mad. I have always added more materail to the repair so something else will fail before the repair does. Go heavy on the welds, I hust think a 135 will look good but will not take what they will do too itBernie
Reply:yeah i think that ill stick it, just to be on the safe side.guess i just have to charge more............ but i have seen how those plow guys drive WHAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply:Hey Arcdawg, where are you from in CT. I am from FFLD and have a shop in Milford. Also what school do you teach TIG welding at.  T.J.www.tjsperformance.comDynasty 300 DXHTP 240HTP Microcut 380Hyperthem 85JD2 Hyd Bender and HF Hyd Ring Roller all in one =(Frankenbender)Bpt. Mill/DRO4' x 8' CNC Plasma TableInstagram: tjsperformanceYT: TJS Welding and Fabrication
Reply:well i went out around 6  this morning with stick welder in car. drove out to the guys garage set up my grinder, welder and started grinding(that took the most time)so i cleaned up the whole area around the repair. disconnected the battery in the truck too.i beveled the area out (old reapair) it as clean as possible and went to town, it was a flat postion repair nice and easy. i used 1/8 7018 running around 120amps  did a root pass then a really nice cover passthis was much easier than i had thought. when i was done i hooked up the guys battery and loaded up my car. sprayed some rustoleum  paint on the repair and collected my $50.00thanks to the guys that steered me in the right way the stick was the way to go....brian
Reply:Originally posted by arcdawg  but i have seen how those plow guys drive WHAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Originally posted by pjslawncare/Landscap Hey now, I resemble that remark   [/QUOTE]   Ain't our fault you have no idea what the lo range in that transferr case is there for.  In the intrest of your safety, it is recommended you wear your seat belt and cinch it up good when plowing in hi range.Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:PJ you don't scrap cutter edges, you wear them in to get the proper corner releif, and then run a pass of Stoody or other abrasoweld across the bottom to triple the life.  When the abrasoweld wears off, you just run another pass across the edge.The same rod will dramaticly extend the life of shoes as well.Jim, about that Florida CCW course, just how many seconds after shooting the hole in the paper ballot to eliminate the chad problem, and realizing you calculated windage wrong and accidently removed the head of the idiot holding the punch card in front of the TV camera are you required to say OOPSIE within for it to be a legal shooting?1/8 7018 on a snow plow, am I the only one thinking hydrogen embrittlement?Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:Franz,I have some of that Stoody hard surfacing rod, but I can't make as nice a weld with it  as I want.  I can make a lot of different rods lay down a good bead, but the 5/32 Stoody rod seems to elude me.  I am wanting to hardface the 8' cutting edge on our Cat loader, as it costs $400 bucks to replace.  Any suggestions on how to run that rod?  It is real hard for me to keep a good arc going with it.  Thanks.
Reply:HS rod likes to run HOT, and it don't really lay down pretty unless you use TIG to place it.  It also works best in flat position, so you want to plan the job and have appropriate lifting equipment to orient the work.It also doesn't want to build up worth squat, so you pretty much want to lay it on in a single pass and do the buildup with something like 7018 or even 6013.If you have to work to a shaped edge, run up to a carbon block.I've never had much luck restarting HS rods either, so you just figure on tossing some long stubs.Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:arc dawg im interested along with fla jim, about what welding school you teach at and wether or not yiu have any aws certs??
Reply:He won't answer! Probably just Bs'ing about teaching His posts don't have any basis of  real knowledge of welding procedures.
Reply:i teach at the local craft center, i have a 1080 hour genral welding course, 36 hour stuck welding course, and a 40 hour tig course....
Reply:What's a local craft center, is it a government sponsered school?What's "STUCK Welding"?
Reply:yeah jim your right, i forgot that this is your board.
Reply:I just asked a reasonable question. What kind of school is a Craft center?
Reply:no jim you didnt,  you respond to my threads thinking that i have no idea about welding, and its a craft center, they offer a bunch of diffrent classes from painting to welding
Reply:I admit I find your skills suspect, do to lack of information of your posts. I've been in this field off and on for over forty years. Your posts seem to be lacking is substance.Is this craft center an accredited facility? Do the students get credit for the course, Either CEU's, or college credit? Is this a private, or state sponsered school?
Reply:its a private school, for people that want to pick up another hobby , or better their skills, i run a class one night a week and i have been for 3 semesters now. so i really dont care WHAT  YOU THINK, you ahave singled me out eversince i have been on this board, and thats fine,  i just dont understand why you keep harassing me ? this is suposed to be a way to learn from others, i try to help out when i feel that i can, do you get off on putting other people down? some one with your SKILL LEVEL ?  should support the young welders and not critize them
Reply:According to my calculations, using the information you have supplied, it will take  2.77 years to complete one cycle of the classes you teach, this assumes an 8 hour class day. do I have that right?
Reply:Originally posted by FSC According to my calculations, using the information you have supplied, it will take  2.77 years to complete one cycle of the classes you teach, this assumes an 8 hour class day. do I have that right?
Reply:Originally posted by arcdawg ive got some local TOOLBOX who wants me reair a snow plow, i havent seen it yet but he says its a SMALL REPAIR now i have a AC225 BUZZ BOX  and my hoFART 135 WITH FLUXCORE  i feel more comfortable with the mig but im leary that the machince wont have enough NUT for this repairand helpful hints as far as preheat or beveling or peening  or what ever,  thanks brian ?hes three towns over, i was thinking $25 just to check it out and then $25 hour ?????????????????
Reply:Jim, read this description of the "repair" Arcdawg made."i beveled the area out (old reapair) it as clean as possible and went to town, it was a flat postion repair nice and easy. i used 1/8 7018 running around 120amps did a root pass then a really nice cover pass"I don't see any mention of preheating, but I do see indicia of hydrogen embrittlement in the weld, witch is probably why the first "repair" failed.Pound for pound, snowplows take a worse beating than the pusharms on a D-8 or dipper stick with bad bushings, and yet the operators seem to think a halfassed repair weld will hold up.  The primary criteria for selecting the weldor to make the repair is how cheap the guy will hang birdcrap on the steel.Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:Here's my little input about some of the things discussed in this thread. I have tools, have had very little formal schooling in welding (3 levels of credit night school classes) to advance my welding skills for my personal hobby (cars) and job (various fab needs). Probably the best thing I learned is know what you can't/shouldn't do. While I have the tools to build or repair something that could severly injure someone, I won't. If a quarter panel falls off a car probably no one will die. If one of my little fab jobs at work fails, no one will get hurt. If the possiblity of my "poor" craftsmanship can hurt someone I say no in a hurry and call in the certified welder I use at work for such a job. A smart man knows what he doesn't know.An arts and crafts welder should not be building bridges. Odd example but you know what I mean.MillerMatic 175Thermal Dynamics Drag-Gun PlasmaAirco Bumblebee AC/DC SMAWVictor Super-Range II oxy/act
Reply:Arcdawg:  I'm not going to jump on any bandwagon, but you kinda asked for it when you touted your "teaching" and then all your early posts were full of horrible grammar and spelling, admissions of not knowing basic welding controls and terms, and a prideful attitude.  If I may make a suggestion, I recommend asking legitimate questions, and discussing the answers, as you tried on this thread.  DON'T answer questions to which you don't know the answer.  Don't bring up your teaching as some kind of certificate.  Use your helpful advice on the subjects for which you are knowledgable to speak for you.  In time, the others will forget about your hasty indoctrination and you will be welcome to ask more questions and post about what you do know.  Apparantly, you do have some experience.  Don't tell us about it.  Let us see it come through in the quality of your postings.Everyone else:  Let's give him another chance and see how it goes.  He can either be a welcome addition, or I'll not stand in front of him again.
Reply:some people on this board  really enjoy pointing their fingers and think that they are the only people in the world that have any idea about everything.as far as my spelling goes.... is it really a big dealmy views on illegals is just that, my viewhow quickly some people are to defend undocumented workers, maybe cause they employ them....when i asked this question it was for help, i dont do much repair work and wanted some advise, not my stones broke...as far as my teaching goes,  i fell into this and i love doing it, i might not have all of the awnsers but i TRY THE BEST THAT I CAN,to get everyone welding and show them the safe way of doing thingsi might have come across as a know it all when i first signed up but i think that if you looked at my more recent post you would see that i do have something to offer this board.and if you dont like my post or my replies  you dont have to respond, really its that easythanks to the people that gave me adviseTREAD DEAD, BRIAN
Reply:Brian, I'm gonna try this one more time, clearly and succinctly, in the hope you get it.You come across like a 15 year old kid, who might own a welder and has read some pamphlets, and if that's what you are, fine, but you ain't a weldor.  You ain't a fab weldor, and you sure as all hell ain't a repair weldor, and I assure you there are guys here who are both.You came up bragging on how you "repaired" a snow plow, and frankly, the job you did was NOT a repair.  The best part of your work was squirting Rustoleum on top of an improper weld.The sad thing is you didn't even realize you were making an improper weld.  Your rod selection, 7018, was a LH rod, and you used it on a cold piece of steel, so you certainly created hydrogen embrittlement in the weld zone.You went on to state you ground out a previous repair.  That should have told you that you were in over your head, but you lack the skill to recognize that.  The degree of difficulty goes up tremendously when you're trying to remediate somebody's prior screwup, and you damn well better know what you're doing.Now, that might not seem like an issue to you, cause you got paid, and you can get paid again to redo the halfassed job when it fails, but to me, you created a ticking time bomb, completely unnecessarily, and you have placed in danger the lives of people you may never meet, unless it's in a courtroom in the future.I sure hope your weld wasn't in a criticale area, like the A frame or the Quadrant, because when welds fail inthose areas plows come off.  Even that might not be a problem if the plow is pushing snow in a parking lot, but if a plow breaks loose at 50mph, it is a disaster.I've seen too damn many close calls, from trailer hitches coming apart to stairway collapses, cause somebody thought they knew how to weld.  This craft ain't rocket science, but it does take some time to learn, and a lot more to master, and those of us who have been at it a while know we will never master the entire spectrum of welding.  It's not just a matter of piling crap on layer upon layer, it's about knowing what the he!! you are doing before you hook up the ground, or walking away from the job.On things like plow frames, you generally not only have to replace the original weld, you have to reenforce the frame to compensate for the structural defect developed by the original failure.  You didn't do that, you didn't even know you had to do that, and you shouldn't have done the job.This craft isn't about putting the money in your pocket and driving away, it's about seeing your work 10 years later, and being proud you did it right, and it's still performing.Those of us here who see it that way are more than willing to help younguns who are trying to learn, and we'll bust *** to help, but don't expect a pat on the back when you screw up, this craft simply doesn't award points for trying.Appreciation Gains You Recognition-
Reply:Franz, I've been reading your posts here, and for a longer while back at the dark side.  I don't always agree with what you say or how you say it, but I have to admit you're always fair.  More than that, it's clear you been "ridin this rock" for a while and know when to speak up, and perhaps more importantly when not to.  I thank you for your contributions and insights, even when it's not what I want to hear or read. You nailed it with your last post, and I hope that the intended recipient takes it to heart and doesn't get all beside himself again trying to justify or defend. I think you (and others in this thread) have offered him some good advice.  It's important that you and the other experienced folk are here; and it's good of you to treat some of the more ignorant folks on these boards as well as you do.
Reply:Franz, your last reply was well stated and your your patience is admireable can anyone relate to this? Attached Images
Reply:I just ran across this thread and I am wondering why, when someone was asking for knowledge to be shared, that so many were so stingy with advice.  If you had an inclination that the person was not up to speed on stick welding (having to borrow a stick welder is a good hint), wouldn't it of been better to give him the knowledge to do the job correctly to prevent the possibility of injury to equipment or personnel (as many now claim to be so worried about after the fact)?  I lucked out in this life and have been blessed with having an outstanding welder to be my teacher for three years in college, and to having  equally outstanding welders in my town who will come to my aid if I have questions or need help.  Too bad arcdawg doesn't have that in his town, or as it seem, on this board(not an indictment of all, just a few).  As the trades seem to fall by the wayside in our schools, where do we think people who want to learn these skills are going to go?  Since arcdawg has assumed the mantle of trying to teach others these skills, wouldn't it be more productive to make sure that he is given the knowledge to do this properly? Or is it just more fun to break his chops?  Dog1
Reply:[QUOTE], wouldn't it be more productive to make sure that he is given the knowledge to do this properly? Or is it just more fun to break his chops?  Dog1 [/B][/QUOTEdog, thanks for replying  to my post. i have decatated the past five years of my life working and learning in the welding feild.i dont really get many repair jobs and if i do its not stick welding.i think that what happened on this board is that i probably came on as a smart @## or a know it all, which is far from who i am.and after this post blew up in my face no one will respond to my post so i look for post where i feel that i can give some good advice and some helpful ideas, which is all i would expect in return.thank god that there were some GOOD GUYS  that dint have to bust my stones and gave me the advise that i needed, books and schools are great but real world advise works best for me.thank you again for taking the time to respond and possibly see it the  way i saw it,brian