welding hole in pistol frame

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I have two holes I want to close up on a pistol frame. The goal of course would be to end up not being able to tell there was a hole there after rebluing.Whats the best way to close these holes? Can it be done with a stick welder? Oxy acetylene?If possible with a stick welder what type of rod? AC or DC? This is simply cosmetic and would only need to be able to take blue.any questions/comments??Last edited by Texan4Life; 12-02-2009 at 08:21 PM.
Reply:I've got an acquaintance in Illinois who is a restorative welder. I'll query him and get back to you. As a gunsmith, I reference him from time to time. Good luck!-MarcusThermal Arc 250 GTSWMiller Maxstar 200Lincoln SP125 PlusVictor JourneymanHuntsman VXL 4X4Metabo grinders (9", 6", 5")
Reply:I would tig that myself.. Definitely tig.That seems to thin for stick welding.It seems to be aluminum with a black oxide coating.
Reply:It appears to be a Polish Tokarev TTC. Century Arms ( the CAI on the slide) imported a lot of TTC pistols, but most of them were not Polish (Romanian, I believe). Any case, the TTC has a steel frame with a carbon content around .30. Preheat and TIG will probably be on the menu. I'm trying to get you a better guess than just mine. Another source of information on this might be Doug Turnbull Restorations.His contact info is at: www.turnbullrestoration.com He'd know what filler to use so the bluing will take evenly. Best of luck with this.-MarcusThermal Arc 250 GTSWMiller Maxstar 200Lincoln SP125 PlusVictor JourneymanHuntsman VXL 4X4Metabo grinders (9", 6", 5")
Reply:wow you guys are fast... Yeah its a polish Tokarev and the hole is where the safety that the importer added. Original Tokarevs don't have a safety and the one that was added is very crude. All Tokarevs coming in now have the crude safety's added to meet import regs. I'm still researching if removing the safety is legal. And if I do try this (assuming it is legal) I might buy a Romanian one as they are more common than the polish ones... In case it turns into a paper weight. But i have high hopes...The wall thinkness on both sides is roughly 0.25 in. and where the two notches are is 0.10 in.Im leaning more toward Oxy/acet as I could reduce the chance of blowing a bigger hole in it. lol... Do they make any arc welding rods smaller than 3/32?I was thinking maybe cutting a circle of steel as the main filler and weld around the edge instead of trying to spiral inward welding on top of welds.
Reply:I really doubt that unless in some of the most skilled hands all your going to do with stick or oxy/acy is make a mess.  Give it to someone to TIG, should only take a few moments if you prep it.Have we all gone mad?
Reply:They make 1/16" stick rods, but I'm with everyone else, here.  Fine someone who can TIG it, or don't bother.As for removing the safety.  I don't think you would have a legal issue.  What can be imported, and what can be owned are two vastly different things.
Reply:Removal of that safety will make that hangun non complient with BATF rules. If it was added to comply with import regs it is what it is. My understanding is when a firearm is imported it is almost like it is time stamped and then marked with the importers info. That firearm has to comply with all the rules and regs at that time and is then considered manufactured by the importer and will always be subject to all complience rules at the time of import.There are lots of little loops in these BATF regs. Here are just a few: some rifles imported before such and such date can have a flash supressor and the same rifle but after that date the importer had to chop saw them off and weld on a front sight. Or this certain firearm must have a certain number of new US made parts but just a few years ago the whole rifle was and still is ok with all foreign parts. The list goes on and on.Will you get caught and raided by the BATF for this? Probally not but if you ever use that handgun in a defensive action they will run the numbers and may catch the non complience. For the cost of those handguns I would just order a Romainian that was imported before the safety was required and not look back.Regards,Mundy
Reply:One of my friends can help you chose the right weld or you can send it to him.http://www.turnbullrestoration.comCo-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:I don't understand the nay sayers on A/O. Any one familiar with a torch can weld it just as easily as with TIG. Since it has a lower operating temperature than TIG it just might make it easier than using TIG. Gives you a little more time to keep from making a boo boo.  I wouldn't even consider using stick.
Reply:Don't do it.  If you remove that safety you could be charged with manufacturing a illegal firearm.  That would be a nasty fine and prob jail time.
Reply:i dont know much about guns except you probably dont want it to distort.  why not just take it apart, put a piece of tape on the inside, and fill it with bondo or jb weld?OMG, i cant believe i just recommended jb weld in a welding forum
Reply:Yep removing the safety is considered a felony as all fire arms are required to have them so no modding of the pistol in that regards just like its illegal to cut the barrel down on a shot gun along with the stock.
Reply:Texan4Life,The Firearms Technology Branch of the BATFE is where to get definitive answers to your question about the safety. Their number is:BATFE Firearms Technology Branch (304)260-3414They make the rulings that impact our guns. This branch is administrative, they do not do code enforcement (this means you can speak freely about what you want to do). The person I speak to is Richard Vasquez. He is very easy to talk with (not like the last time I asked OSHA for help)! I got a definitive answer to your question in less than 5 minutes. Rather than confirm my suspicions here, I would encourage you to call and ask them yourself. As you well know, ignorance or the opinions of us "benchlawyers" are no defense against legal action. It does not matter what someone else says their (or their cousins, etc.) experience was. The buddy I needed to query is Peter Nagel and he runs a restorative welding business, serving museums as well as the collector. As for the procedure to weld this:Plug the hole, preheat to 300, Argon back-gas, TIG the outside with a low carbon MIG wire, draw at 400. Run about 80 amps and get it done and get out fast. There is no reason to weld the inside of the frame.Peter actually recommends that if you haven't done this type of job before, find a tool & die welder somewhere near you. Since this can fall under the heading of "manufacturing" (by BATFE standards), technically he will have to do it while you wait, or he will need an FFL (and put it in his A&D book). Again, call the Tech Branch. Please don't take my, or anybody else's word on this. My buddy is Peter Nagel at: Restorative Welding401 S. Ninth StreetOregon, IL. 61061Peter is not an FFL holder, so you cannot send it to him. He would be willing to help clarify the procedure for you or your welder of choice. If you need further assistance, let me know. I'll PM you his # and/or email.As I mentioned in post #4 (and specter mentioned in post #9), Doug Turnbull is a very credible and competent resource. He can weld this up and refinish it for you. I feel there is nobody more qualified than him.http://www.turnbullrestoration.com/ There is also Hamilton Bowen at http://www.bowenclassicarms.com/. He is highly regarded in his field. Please let us know if we can be of further service... and good luck with your Polish Tokarev!-MarcusThermal Arc 250 GTSWMiller Maxstar 200Lincoln SP125 PlusVictor JourneymanHuntsman VXL 4X4Metabo grinders (9", 6", 5")