Hourly rate?

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What is a general hourly rate for welding?  I'm new to all of this stuff, so I'm not real familure with pricing. Someone asked me to do a small welding job for them, and I have ZERO idea what to charge them for it.www.thefusionsolution.com
Reply:What will it cost you to do the work? Who much profit do you want to make? How long do you want to take to amortize your capitol investment?What will the market bare. When you have answered some of the basic business questions, you will have the answer to "What is a general hourly rate for welding?"
Reply:Originally Posted by Fat BastardWhat will it cost you to do the work? Who much profit do you want to make? How long do you want to take to amortize your capitol investment?What will the market bare. When you have answered some of the basic business questions, you will have the answer to "What is a general hourly rate for welding?"
Reply:Originally Posted by speedfreak87 I was told by someone going hourly rate was roughly $75/per hour.
Reply:I'll second Boostinjdm. Adding that good karma is priceless and so is good word of mouth. Until you get a lot of gear and overhead and a shop of your own, don't sell yourself short, but be reasonable.  I do most of the, "hey my kids trike broke, can you fix it, if I bring it to you at your convenience" job for free or bring me a Tim's, one and one. Sure 9 out of ten you never see them again, but the one that comes back with a real job makes  the 9 five minute jobs pay off. IMHO PS- It's safer to do these kinds of jobs up here. We don't seem to be as hair-trigger, sue-happy as some in the US. har har harLast edited by bert the welder; 04-11-2010 at 02:30 PM.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmThat's about what shops get around here, but they have lots of overhead.  To charge somebody that when you are using somebody elses shop, equipment, and materials, is just dishonest.  If all you're bringing to the table is your time, I'd ask for a $20 bill and be happy.  That's if you produce satisfactory results.
Reply:IMO if you get more than 1/2 the jobs you quote then you are more than likely too cheap.You don't wanna be a doormat and you've already felt what it is like to feel screwed.I am not cheap but still get nice fat tips. Just do awsum work and price becomes way less important to everyone. You feel compensated and they see the value.Miller Dynasty 700Miller 350P with Aluma-pro push-pullMiller 280 Dynasty with expansion card Dynasty 200 DXMigMax 215 Enuff power and hand tools to create one of anything..... but mass produce nothing!!!
Reply:that's what I'm hoping. get business because of my quality of work, not because I'm cheap.www.thefusionsolution.com
Reply:Your houly rate should based on your skill set, since your still in shool and have no professional experience will have to say your skills are low.  Maybe you should quote more by the project rather then by hourly rate and as you skills improve your speed will become faster.  For example if someone wants a wiggit built and you think it will take you 8 hours to build then work on your price.  You want $30 an hr so that $240 in labor and then add all other addition cost.  Quote the customer a total price for the project don't break it down.  Now this is where you will learn to estimate your time because if you go over on hours then your losing money and if your under then your making more money per hour. For the time being don't give out the amt time it take you to do a job.
Reply:Originally Posted by Jay OYour houly rate should based on your skill set, since your still in shool and have no professional experience will have to say your skills are low.  Maybe you should quote more by the project rather then by hourly rate and as you skills improve your speed will become faster.  For example if someone wants a wiggit built and you think it will take you 8 hours to build then work on your price.  You want $30 an hr so that $240 in labor and then add all other addition cost.  Quote the customer a total price for the project don't break it down.  Now this is where you will learn to estimate your time because if you go over on hours then your losing money and if your under then your making more money per hour. For the time being don't give out the amt time it take you to do a job.
Reply:"Because I'm not some greedy jerk, it's always hard for me to spit out a price for anything I do no matter what it is. I've screwed myself a couple of times"- speedfreakYep, same here. I find it's scaled too. Bigger job = more variables= bigger chance of getting screwed by myself. Guess that would explain the pain in my back after a big job.....I try to price my semi-production work at a price that more people can afford. Custom gets into more premium price. But then some people look at one of my semi-production pieces that is "similar" in their eyes to what they ask for and $hit when I tell them it's 50% more. Just cause it quacks like a duck...... Sometimes you just can't win. Sometimes I price to low then other times I think I'm way too high and the darn thing sells in two days after going in the gallery. Right piece, right place, right person. There's no predicting it. The more experience you get the easier it becomes( sort of....). I try to break jobs into there "parts" and picture myself doing the parts and how long it will take. I don't mark up materials. Also, every ones work habits are different. My good friend sometimes gets, what seems to be a bee in his arse, and is practically running in the shop. To me this just isn't how "normal" people work, and jobs shouldn't be priced at this pace. And one of my favourite sayings is "your panic is my profit". Just cause you didn't "get around to getting it fixed, and now need it in two days" doesn't mean squat to me. Your going to pay for me staying late or having to push back another job. That's just fair in my book. Take some pic's of the project and let us see and know what you charge.Good luck B200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:One way to figure what to charge when using the schools shop would be just to forget what welding shops are charging and figure what you would get as an employee.  Prolly somewhere between $12-$20 an hour.  I'll be straight with ya, I'm only getting $35 and I own thousands of dollars worth of equip and shoulder all the risk.  I know I'm low for what I do, but I also know that shops in the area are better equiped than I am and because of that, can charge more.  IF I thought I was equiped at thier level, I would charge what they charge.  Being cheap as I am has it's advantages though.  I can take my time and end up with a better finished product for the same price as the local shops for a so so product.  This keeps customers happy.  I also get a lot of repair work that would otherwise not get done.  That keeps me busy.  If I have a lull in the work load, I can call up my customers and they will find me something to work on.Some food for thought....sometimes the small jobs can be the most profitable.  Sure big checks are nice, but they require lots of time and materials.  I can make a weeks income in one day doing small jobs for several people.  I usually just throw out a price for them and don't bother keeping track of time.  $10 for this, $20 for that, and so on.  Customers are happy and it may only take me a few minutes per job.  Hell, a couple weeks ago I made $20 in under a minute.  All I needed was a punch and a hammer.  If I had just one hour of those jobs, that would be $1200. LOLMy name's not Jim....
Reply:Originally Posted by bert the welderAnd one of my favourite sayings is "your panic is my profit". Just cause you didn't "get around to getting it fixed, and now need it in two days" doesn't mean squat to me. Your going to pay for me staying late or having to push back another job. That's just fair in my book. Take some pic's of the project and let us see and know what you charge.Good luck B
Reply:Just to add, with regards to what Boost was saying about tools. It's often the small guy that does the better job for cheaper, sometimes because he has fewer tools.We did a job for the provincial museum years ago. They had gone around to to big boys in town and gotten quotes. More than they had the budgeted for and they couldn't get them done on time because they had to make up the dies for the presses and get the drawing entered into the CAD, blah blah blah. So they came to us after seeing our bending work in a restaurant. We got the job next day. It was for these branch looking things to hold up rope to to block of displays. A more interesting version of the velvet ropes at bank line-ups. Had the 50 base plates sheared that afternoon. I bent the corners on them the next days as well as bent up all 300 1/2" rebar pieces.  Next day I welded them up and they got shot with clear after that. "press" and "dies" were a steel wheel rim on my bending jig  table and my gut pushing against it and a slot in my table for the corners of the base plates. Welded the first one, traced it with soap stone and kept going from there. They later told us we where a third to a quarter of the price of the big shops. They were actually nervous that we didn't understand what they wanted or the number of pieces. We made nothing but money on that job too.My point being, is that sometimes lots of equipment can be a handicap in that some can't think beyond their tools. I love coming up with jigs and sneaky-bastard ways of doing things. It's more fun than the job sometimes  When I get my shop together again, I'll post a pick of my clam-shell jig for bending repeating scrolls out of 1/2" hr, no heat and no Haussfeld-whatcha-ma-call-it! 200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:no one here is mentioning the main thing that kills small businesses.  TAXES.  Gotta account for big brother coming in and cleaning you out.  That is if you don't keep your finances together 12 months per year.
Reply:I think most that have small businesses have a small cash of ideas as to how to deal with taxes.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Yeah, get paid in cash. lol!www.thefusionsolution.com
Reply:Originally Posted by speedfreak87Yeah, get paid in cash. lol!
Reply:im just getting into welding now, ive done some research into all this though and from what i have seen it all depends on what sort of welder you are, if you have overhead like equipment/etc then youll get paid more but i dont think that really counts, i think you are questioning about your personal hourly pay you get before taxes, well all depends again, there are stable 9-5 type jobs that usually pay 12-25 bux or so, and there are unstable, or out in the middle of nowhere jobs that pay 30-50/hr but your income is unstable and less regular than a stable job and you gotta work out with the polar bears for months or yearsbut ya, personally ill probably get into a shop or a business that does production welding of some sort and get a regular paycheck, it might cap out at 20-25/hr untill i become a welding supervisor but its still good moneyguys that say they get paid 60-80/hr are either lying, are underwater welders, or work in the middle of nowhere, or got crazy overhead, or its a seasonal job or something where they arent working the straight 12 monthslotta ways to weld, depends what suits your lifestyleanyone feel free to correct me if im wrong on anything
Reply:Originally Posted by bert the welderI think most that have small businesses have a small cash of ideas as to how to deal with taxes.
Reply:Originally Posted by Hank33the statistics say otherwise.  I was just talking to an accountant yesterday who lost a customer because they lost their biz.  Not welding but another service business.  They made and spent a bunch of money, the problem was they didn't track their expenses and didn't count on paying taxes at the clip they needed to.  They spent their money on the wrong stuff and tried to over deduct pickups and other items.  They ran out of cash.
Reply:Originally Posted by Hank33the statistics say otherwise.  I was just talking to an accountant yesterday who lost a customer because they lost their biz.  Not welding but another service business.  They made and spent a bunch of money, the problem was they didn't track their expenses and didn't count on paying taxes at the clip they needed to.  They spent their money on the wrong stuff and tried to over deduct pickups and other items.  They ran out of cash.
Reply:I have tried ti several ways. I have had some experiences with the Canadian version if IRS. Here is how you should spend money from the BUSINESS.Pay suppliersPay Tax (business, personal and sales) - send it in monthly. Do you actually believe that if you get behind a miracle will occur next month and you will be able to catch up?Build cash balances.Buy some equipment or stock.Pay yourself.The most important thing is that paying yourself is fourth. If it has to go higher you have made one or more of the common mistakes.You started without a proper personal bank balance - you will always be living hand to mouth. You are robbing the business of what it needs for flourish and succeed.You are underpricing.You are living in a fantasy world where customers never stiff you, or equipment never breaks, or everything is perfectly quoted.You believe that magically you will have money to finance growth. The business must become financially strong before you can reap the rewards. For example, you are deluding yourself to believe you will find a job that will pay for a nice ironworker. You get the ironworker and then the jobs come not the other way around.I am sure many will disagree, but, as I said I've tried it lots of ways and this one works.
Reply:Rancher bill brings up some very good points.Another thing to consider is that your shop rate is not your personal pay scale.My shop's labor rate is $60/hr. in shop, and $85/hr. on site. I also add around $25/hr more per person when adding help doing site work.That sounds crazy high if you think it's actually what you'll get paid, but it's not what I get paid it is what my business gets paid.Out of that rate comes:Payroll.Taxes, somewhere between 20 and 35 percent of payroll is withholding tax. So if I'm paying a welder $15/hr it costs me over $20/hr after taxes.Insurance, even if I don't pay any help on a job I still have to keep general liability, product liability, and a few other types to keep my butt covered. Plus to even be able to walk onto a commercial job site I have to keep workers comp. The premiums for WC are based on payroll and billed at a rate from as low as 11% to over 50% depending on job risk. So if I paid you $15/hr I have to pay up to $7/hr in WC insurance.Overhead, you have to have a facility or rig, or both and power and phone and office supplies and shop supplies and all those costs involved in just being available and ready to work.This doesn't cover materials or sales tax or delivery or shipping costs and any other direct cost to do a given job. All those are figured and added to an estimate on contract work, or added to the invoice on T&M work.I do mark up materials by the way. You have to figure what it took to: 1) figure out what materials are needed, 2) source and order those materials, 3) get them delivered, unloaded, put away, and put into production. Not to mention on many jobs you'll have to pay for those materials and wait till the job is done, or at least till the next draw, before yo see a dime of it back. In effect you'll be used to finance a job. Not marking up materials IMHO is not sound business.After all that I'm lucky to pocket $25/hr from any job. And as has already been stated, no work = no pay.On the plus side I do get to sleep with the boss' wife.Brian LeonardAppalachian Ironworks L.L.C.434 Long Branch Rd, Marshall, NC 28753828 649 9966828 702 [email protected]
Reply:Some great info guys, thank you. I'm learning something here.www.thefusionsolution.comOriginally Posted by app-ironworksllcOn the plus side I do get to sleep with the boss' wife.
Reply:btw, random addition to the thread, welding trade is massively over saturated so its impossible to find a job, especially if you do, and even if you do youll get 12-14/hr.. lotta manufacturing is moving to mexico and such, just being honest with ya
Reply:Originally Posted by snappy101btw, random addition to the thread, welding trade is massively over saturated so its impossible to find a job, especially if you do, and even if you do youll get 12-14/hr.. lotta manufacturing is moving to mexico and such, just being honest with ya
Reply:Originally Posted by speedfreak87This particular job wont cost me anything but time. My home welder isn't strong enough to do the work, so I'm going to do it at school (free materials). Also this is a reweld, because the original weld cracked.. (someone else's work)I'm not a money guy so making even $20 on a job 'm happy with. I was told by someone going hourly rate was roughly $75/per hour.  I figure that is the MINIMUM I'll be working on this job. Other projects I do it's easy for me to price out, material costs, plus labor.. Since I have done stuff mostly for friends my labor isn't that high if I charge for it at all. (I've only done a couple of small jobs) this is my first "non-friend" job I'm doing. and don't want to price myself out.