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last week one of my co workers brought in a trailer for me to fix the trailer wasnt in the best of shape. so i done the work that i was told and the fender was severly cracked so i cut it off and patched it it didnt look pretty but it held then i ran outa mig wire i was in a hurry and bought sum stuff that was cheaper same wire different dist. and way this fender was rusted pretty good so i ground to bare metal tacked it up and preceded to make 2 weldments i got done inspected em looked good called him and told him it was done . today i come into office and hes not happy he says he was drivin down the hiway and the fender came off. i suspected that if someone got hurt or any damage was done i would heard about it by now. i feel terrible and i gotta work with this guy and i suppose the word will get around the local watering holes and locals and there goes busniees any suggestions or has any one been in this predica mentmiller maxstar 150 hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:Keeping fenders welded on old trailers can be a chore. Fix it good next time or give them back their money and all should be well. Junk jobs often turn out that way.Some jobs just need to be refused if they are not wanting to pay to get it fixed correctly.OH, keep your day job in the mean time.
Reply:No one remembers all the good welds you made or favors you did. It like the old joke about the bridge builder.
Reply:couple of thoughts...do you have insurance??Also, do you know for a fact that it was your weld that let go? What was the parent metal thickness? If you were welding anything over 1/8 inch thick with that little mig tsk..tsk..um don't do it. I don't care what the internet experts say, it isn't enough welder.
Reply:Fenders are cheap.I can buy double axle fenders by the pair for 30.00 wholesale. Easier to replace the whole thing.I'd find out exactly WHERE it came off. It may not have anything to do with your weld.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:Insist on seeing it first, then, if it was your weld, make it up to them. If it wasn't, point out the real cause and explain to them why it broke and that it wasn't your fault. If they still bitch, Roshambo them for it. You go first.This is why I don't work on any auto stuff. And if your in the US, ****, that could have been a $10,000,000 boo boo.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Not really sure how to respond to this one...I've re-wrote my post 3 times and STILL sound like a Jerk...If you are a "Hobby" Welder, I'd say that you need to go back to the books, and LEARN more about welding...If you are in fact, a "Professional" Welder.... Then I would have to guess that you have developed some VERY Poor Habits, and they are NOT doing you any favours.I'm not buying the "Same Wire - Different Distributor" line.... ER70S-6 (for example) is ER70S-6, no matter WHO makes it.... Subtle differences, Yes, but either you can weld, or you can't.And Yes, you're gonna be sucking slough water at work for a while, your co-workers ARE gonna talk, and make comments, and there isn't much you can do about it.... I would ASK the co-worker with the trailer if he/she is willing to bring it back to you for another shot at it PRO-BONO... if in fact, the trailer failed elsewhere, then I guess you are off the hook for shoddy welding, but I would still hold you responsible for not looking closely enough to see the flaw, while making the initial repair.1) Get the trailer back2) Install a NEW fender Pro Bono3) Try to build back some credibility with your co-workers.4) Seriously consider NOT putting yourself in this situation again.Good LuckLater,Jason
Reply:Jason makes a good point of installing a new fender. If you can get the trailer back, indeed put a new fender back on PRO BONO as Jason put it.I would weld it with a stick using that maxstar 150. It is the only real machine you have for the task. When you weld it on, LOOK for other problem areas on the other side. If there is any, put a new fender on it. At the most you are only looking a $100 dollars out of your pocket in material. I would consider the labor as education.NOW, If you don't have INSURANCE....GET IT. If I was driving behind said trailer and the fender came off and hurt my family or worse.....I would own you.
Reply:mn welder,Not to pile on, but Jason makes some very valid points.Looking at your "equipment list" I would have to suspect that you're relatively new to welding and pursue it as a "hobby" rather than as a profession.What you experienced is exactly why many of the oldtimers strongly recommend foregoing working on equipment that travels on the highway. Mig welding can be deceiving. Often times, what looks like a decent weld really isn't. Best to pass on these type jobs until you are sure you know what you're doing.In the meantime, you're probably going to catch some heat from your coworkers. Best to grin and bear it. Hopefully, you've learned a valuable lesson without someone else getting hurt because of your lack of expertise.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:believe me i learned my lesson well very well i am semi retired now if anyone asks and im gonna be careful to pick and choose my projects and "no favors " anymore i guess its just a good business practice a lesson that was learned the hard way but coulda turned out really bad i hope all the people just startin out and just gettin into a portable weld biz heed my warning and advice.miller maxstar 150 hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:I think them mig welders are for clean, new metal. Want to weld on junk then stick weld it.
Reply:Fluxcore is a good wire for welding on 'junk'. Solid wire and gas doesn't do so well with 'impurities' in the weld metal.I agree about asking to have the trailer back to fix it for free. I would have the customer pay for the fenders though if new fenders are to be used. Sounds like new fenders should have been spec'd to begin with, in which case the customer would have had to pay for them anyways.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:im just gonna fix it and dont forget it chock it up as learning exp and never ever forget it. its like part of reputation is used up and you can never get that back no matter what you do or how hard you try thanks for the helpmiller maxstar 150 hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:mn welder,First, I'd like to commend you for the attitude you've displayed on the board.Next, don't feel too bad. Most welders will never admit to an "oh sh1t", but we've all had it happen. You were lucky in that the impact was minimal.Experience is the best teacher.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:yeh dont do any work you wouldnt sign, goes for a lotta things, especially when its structural steel, because your the welder and its all on you
Reply:just a follow up i tried to talk to the guy and work on trailer pro bono and i quote "you are reckless carless and somebody coulda got hurt dont touch my stuff " not a word was spoken today but last night called boss and put a week notice that i was done and couldnt work with him no more sure hate to see a good freindshipgo down toilet like thatmiller maxstar 150 hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:as a welding engineer, I must mention that there's more to welding than just patching it up and calling it a day. I have my own little personal hobby shop, and people always ask me to come do the favor jobs, or do small jobs on the cheap. First thing I always ask is "will this carry weight" and will this be on a moving vehicle? if it does I usually won't take the work, even though I have a career worth of skill and the engineering know how to design welds properly. I don't know what forces go in that and it's more hassle than the 30 minutes worth of welding to figure out and certify that it will be a sound weld. In fact just the other day I had a weld break on a cap plate I welded for a coworker, he wasn't mad, when I welded it I told him the metal was dirty and I doubt the weld would hold more than as a water/sand barrier. He was fine with that and sure enough vibration and shock eventually snapped the weld off. Luckily he wasn't mad and he's planning on milling a new proper cap and having me reweld it.I guess my original point is that if something is broken there's probably a good reason it broke. either it was under-designed or over-loaded. In either case it's likely to happen again. I don't do a lot of repair work on broken whatevers because I find they tend to break again no matter how perfect the weld is, and then who ever grumbles that I'm a failure of a welder. Also as an aside I've found that everyone who has a little bit of experience welding wants to buy a portable welder and make a killing under cutting the big guys and doing all the small jobs. Ther'es a lot that goes into a portable or custom weld shop business and a lot of those guys scrub out pretty fast. To get the RIGHT equipment for those types of shops takes more money than most would want to pay and once you have everything you need you'll find yourself hard pressed to run a shop without charging $50+/hr and you'll only get to pocket $15 of that if even The guys who survive doing the portable welding business all have a career's worth of experience welding or were top notch before they started, because it takes a special type of welder to be able to handle everything that comes in the door.Welding EngineerCertified Scrap Producer
Reply:MN Welder,To add to what Metarinka said (very well I may add).Doing welding repairs is one case where the owner/user is almost never right.The quickest way for an owner to get me to reject a job, "is to tell me how to do the repair".Just last week a good friend brought me a boat transport trailer to repair. This trailer started life as a trailer designed for hauling a high performance boat used by Navy SEALS in Norfolk, VA. Extremely heavy build with little consideration for cost (like many govt. contracts). Main frame consisted of 8" C Channel (.220 web thickness). A gooseneck was later added to the main frame. Modification welds were questionable at best.Anyway, the main frame had flexed, and cracked the top and bottom flanges about 3' forward of the axles. Someone had welded the flanges as a "repair". The welds did not hold. His comment to me was, "Can you just grind those welds down and redo them?".My response was NO, but I can fix the trailer if you just stay away and come back when it's done. Deal.Ground the old welds out (they were bad). Rewelded the flanges top and bottom, inside and out. Faired the welds top and bottom. Added fish plates to both flanges (both sides of trailer). Fish plated the web with .25 stock. Primed the whole repair.Long story short. His projected "15 min repair" ended up taking about 4 hours. His comment when he picked the trailer up, "wow, didn't realize it was going to take that much work". My comment to him, "not going to guarantee that the trailer won't fail from fatigue somewhere else, but it's not going to fail anywhere near where I did the repairs."When dealing with equipment that travels over the highway, there's no such thing as a repair that's "too good"..I much prefer to be safe rather than sorry.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:as mentioned above, if you are not carrying insurance you should not be doing anything more that decorative or hobby type of things. If it has moving parts, has any type of vibration or shifting loads, and especially if it goes down the road it should only be done by experienced and insured welders.I apparently lost out on a job two weeks ago, the guy never called me back at least. It was one of them dreaded 15 minute jobs. I looked at it, decided there was risk of fire and damage to furnishings and wall coverings so I bid it to cover time to put up blankets and other provisions to make sure that I didn't damage anything. At first I kicked myself for quoting it too high and letting a few hundred easy bucks slide by but after a few minutes I was glad that I bid it the way I did. A $200 job could end up costing me $10,000 in the blink of an eye.Sometimes it's better to let your friends get their work done elsewhere
Reply:dont be so hard on yourself man. you were doing the guy a favour. just learn the lesson. ive ran my own welding buisness since 97 and i wont do peoples vehicle's, friends or not. if they arent welders they just dont understand its not just a quick little job of colouring in between the lines and sticking it together...... welding is easy right.
Reply:Originally Posted by Hank33 A $200 job could end up costing me $10,000 in the blink of an eye.
Reply:I think the true measure of a professional is not that you make every weld perfect and without defect, but knowing when you screwed up something and it needs to be cut apart and redone. If you have any doubt about something you have welded or are about to weld think would I trust my family to be riding in the car behind this thing traveling down the road? That being said you learned a valuable lesson we all make mistakes chalk it up to that and don't beat yourself up over it..
Reply:Originally Posted by Metarinkaas a welding engineer, I must mention that there's more to welding than just patching it up and calling it a day. I have my own little personal hobby shop, and people always ask me to come do the favor jobs, or do small jobs on the cheap. First thing I always ask is "will this carry weight" and will this be on a moving vehicle? if it does I usually won't take the work, even though I have a career worth of skill and the engineering know how to design welds properly. I don't know what forces go in that and it's more hassle than the 30 minutes worth of welding to figure out and certify that it will be a sound weld. In fact just the other day I had a weld break on a cap plate I welded for a coworker, he wasn't mad, when I welded it I told him the metal was dirty and I doubt the weld would hold more than as a water/sand barrier. He was fine with that and sure enough vibration and shock eventually snapped the weld off. Luckily he wasn't mad and he's planning on milling a new proper cap and having me reweld it.I guess my original point is that if something is broken there's probably a good reason it broke. either it was under-designed or over-loaded. In either case it's likely to happen again. I don't do a lot of repair work on broken whatevers because I find they tend to break again no matter how perfect the weld is, and then who ever grumbles that I'm a failure of a welder. Also as an aside I've found that everyone who has a little bit of experience welding wants to buy a portable welder and make a killing under cutting the big guys and doing all the small jobs. Ther'es a lot that goes into a portable or custom weld shop business and a lot of those guys scrub out pretty fast. To get the RIGHT equipment for those types of shops takes more money than most would want to pay and once you have everything you need you'll find yourself hard pressed to run a shop without charging $50+/hr and you'll only get to pocket $15 of that if even The guys who survive doing the portable welding business all have a career's worth of experience welding or were top notch before they started, because it takes a special type of welder to be able to handle everything that comes in the door.
Reply:There isn't a subsititute for doing MANY hours of practice, and preferably under professional supervision. Becoming a weldor is as much work as becoming a mechanic (speaking as a hobby weldor and professional mechanic) so be ready to be dead serious or stick to foo jobs. Do bend/break tests, weld lots of scrap, take classes where available, and listen to those who share their experience. Learn exactly what you can weld properly, and learn it long before duplicating that weld for another person. Learn about metal, and if you repair machinery know that machinery like the back of your hand because you need to have an understanding of the machine to understand how to repair it.I think them mig welders are for clean, new metal. Want to weld on junk then stick weld it.
Reply:You have to REMEMBER that on repairs such as this?YOUR "IT"You are the last one to touch it so that makes you IT..Keep this in your mind next time.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.I believe you got the picture...most don't. Now go practice and follow your dream. I think you have the makings of a great welder. You know why? You are teachable. There are men who think they know everything and won't listen. They try to prove everyone wrong. They have an overly inflated opinion of themselves, their skills, and their worth. You have demonstrated you are willing to work, make mistakes, learn from them, receive criticism, make amends, and strive to improve yourself. These qualities will take you far in becoming a great welder or anything else you set your mind to doing.
Reply:Don't work on Junk, and if you do its cash only. I have worked on plenty of junk, well junk when it started, decent project by the time it was done. If its junk when it starts out I make sure to bid in plenty of money to fix it all. I also have a license and insurance to do it
Reply:Originally Posted by Hank33I apparently lost out on a job two weeks ago, the guy never called me back at least. It was one of them dreaded 15 minute jobs. I looked at it, decided there was risk of fire and damage to furnishings and wall coverings so I bid it to cover time to put up blankets and other provisions to make sure that I didn't damage anything. At first I kicked myself for quoting it too high and letting a few hundred easy bucks slide by but after a few minutes I was glad that I bid it the way I did. A $200 job could end up costing me $10,000 in the blink of an eye.
Reply:ha! I remember one customer years ago go ballistic over a bid. He needed a complete resheathing and roof . Half of the cost was in demo and debris removal. He then decides to do the demo and debris portion himself and have us resheath and roof. Well I get a call in wee hours of the night and he is frantic. Seems he was able to tear all the sheathing and roof off and cover his house in plastic, but a storm shredded his plastic and now it is raining in his house.Just so no one here does the same thing. You are suppose to do this type of work in stages so as not to get caught exposed......Yep, He really didn't like the bill he got next.
Reply:well on a pos note a med size welding and fab shop just started about 6 mos ago and turns out there lookin for 2 welders helpers so im crossin my fingers and hope i get a weld test and a interview i would rather weld and learn than pound hubs and stakes and learn nothing but a paycheckmiller maxstar 150 hobart handler 210 w mig conversion hobart 250 arc force plasma cutter boston ind cutting torch miller performance auto darkening helmet milwalkee 14in chop saw 10,000 watt generator huge drill press and industrial band saw
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungI believe you got the picture...most don't. Now go practice and follow your dream. I think you have the makings of a great welder. You know why? You are teachable. There are men who think they know everything and won't listen. They try to prove everyone wrong. They have an overly inflated opinion of themselves, their skills, and their worth. You have demonstrated you are willing to work, make mistakes, learn from them, receive criticism, make amends, and strive to improve yourself. These qualities will take you far in becoming a great welder or anything else you set your mind to doing.
Reply:Originally Posted by 4on12A good friend of mine asked me to help him with a repair on the roof of an old movie theater. It was an emergency repair on the marquee support structure. The theater owner cried continuously about the high cost of the job, but my friend's small welding company was the only one that guaranteed a crew (him and me) onsight within 12 hours. The bid for the repair covered the cost of 10 high dollar welding blankets.Long story short, we are wrapping it all up after a successful and uneventful weekend of work and three fire trucks, sirens blaring, go screaming past the theater and on up the road. My friend then gets a frantic cell phone call from the theater owner, turns out he lived nearby and heard the trucks too. Visions of his beloved, old theater burning to the ground almost gave him a heart attack. It didn't help that you could hear the sirens in the background of the phone call. After that he cut the check with a smile |
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发表于 2021-9-1 00:31:19