butting round stock together

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i need to butt some 1/4 " round stock in a tee..round end to long end if thatmakes sense. my 110v lincoln  fluxcore does a decent but not pretty job..im thinkin braze but not having any luck..got some silversolder to flow in but no strength ..my tigmachine is buried under at least 4 hours of moving stuff before i could use it..suggestions?
Reply:If you can braze it, you must have a torch, right??If thats the case, you could just o/a weld it... With or without filler probably.[Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:This is the kind of weld I do all the time. I MIG it. Solid wire/ gas though. I do lots of 1/4" to 1/2". I wouldn't hang a car off it, but it's plenty strong for it's use.Brazing, you'll need it real clean and probably need a little cope on the end of the 1/4" round so the joint is tight.TIG......... start unpacking!200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Just how 'pretty' and how strong does it have to be?  And what does it all have to do or be?  Pass x-ray for use as a hanger bracket in a nuke power station or just a coat hanger for your welding jacket?  Braze you have to fit it pretty close, welding you can 'fill the gaps' a bit more than when brazing.Maybe grind a little 'flat' on the 'long piece' and butt the end of the other piece to that flat?  Or go all out and notch the butt-end with a 1/4 inch diameter cutter in a milling machine to get a fit within a few thou.Probably more than one way to skin the cat.  Your call as to how to get there.    The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:I agree with O/A weld with or without filler.I used to repair  much lawn art for a dealer who acquired it from Mexico.  When you figure out what you are doing then no filler will the way to to.
Reply:That's not a good joint shape for silver solder.  Silver solder requires a close fitup, and large contact patch.Nickel-silver braze would be much stronger, or bronze as a second choice for brazing.  Either can fill a bit of a gap in a way similar to welding.If I were welding this (and I would probably do this with TIG, but that's just me, but I would do the same thing with fluxcore), I would bevel the top and bottom of the end of one rod where it meets the middle of the other, and weld from both sides.  A 45 degree bevel will let the filler reach the bottom better.
Reply:gents many thanks for the ideas. i am making a display tree for my wifes friend who sells little kaakaa's in crafts fairs. there will probably be 75 of these joints to do each will need to hold 8 ounces and withstand being thrown into the car many times, so i was trying to come up with quick. the o/a weld sounds like it might  be the answer....thx again, ill put up some fotos when there are some to put up......
Reply:That flux wire , even a 110 machine should be plenty to put 1/4 rounds together, even if you gap them rather than tight fit it should penetrate and weld pretty strong then just clean up with a grinder."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:kolot.. so far the 110v mig is the only thing ive tried that has as you say got some pen. i just cant make it pretty and dont wanna grind 75 little snots..thanks..
Reply:Hmmmm, if you use fluxcore then you'll have to clean up the slag.If you use solid wire GMAW, then you still may have to clean up a -little- bit of 'soot'.  A quick hit with a wire wheel is usually good enough.If you use braze or silver solder, then you have more fitting prep to do to get a decently close fit-up.  And then you have to jig or otherwise hold the parts in place while you apply heat and filler.  And then probably clean up flux residue afterwards.Me?  I'd probably go with GMAW.  Less prep fitting than brazing and a bit less post-weld clean-up than FCAW.  Maybe a quick bit of a bevel on the end of the 'butt' piece, two places 180 deg apart (or there abouts  ), hold it in place and put a decent tack at both bevels.  Add another decent tack 'top-n-bottom' and then a quick hit with a small wire wheel.YMMV.    The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:some fotos..the oa is on top and below it the halfheartedly ground fluxcore..gonna use the torch, much better result and morefun..first gaswelding i've done inover a year..we made the  main piece 1/4 and the hooks 3/16...the blank end sticks into a 1/4 " hole drilled into the stand, which is a piece of tree or wood , to be decided...the curve on the end doubles as a hook and endprotector..not my design..there will be 4 threehookers as shown, eight 4 hookers and 8 fivehookers.. Attached Images
Reply:Dang.Seems pretty straightforward to me.Doesn't look like you need a "full strength" weld to me.Take a 1/4" carbide burr and bevel the ends of the smaller pieces. (you're creating a saddle)Braze the pieces on.Will be plenty strong and look a lot better than the birdsh1t welds I see in your photos.Could be tigged in a heartbeat.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:probably spent 4 hours d.icking aroundMight as well spend the next 4 hours getting the Tig outEd Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:From the looks of it, you're a better gas welder, so go with that. I would like to recommend making yourself a jig to bend the "hooks". Consistency is a good thing. A stub of pipe, 4" long, and a dia. that will give you the hook throat you're looking for. Weld a little "L" shape piece to the side of the pipe, with enough gap to fit the stock you're bending between it and the pipe. Slip one end of the hook-to-be stock in here and bend around the pipe. Mark where you stop bending on the pipe so you can repeat. Looks like a piece of 1" black pipe will do the trick. Do the same for you're 1/4" uprights. Little quicky bending jigs like this become your best tools. Bert200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIIIDang.Seems pretty straightforward to me.Doesn't look like you need a "full strength" weld to me.Take a 1/4" carbide burr and bevel the ends of the smaller pieces. (you're creating a saddle)Braze the pieces on.Will be plenty strong and look a lot better than the birdsh1t welds I see in your photos.Could be tigged in a heartbeat.
Reply:Perhaps you should change your design.  Use a larger main bar  rect. or round, then drill and fit the hooks inside.  weld or braze from the reverse side, then clean.  You could drill and tap, also.We really don't know what quality you are looking for, however the o/a welds  look pretty good to me.
Reply:I would have thought that brazing or even silver soldering,leaving a nice fillet around the joint would be plenty strong enough,Lincoln SP-170 MigHypertherm powermax 45Lorch T220 AC/DC TigButters FM 215 synergic MigKemppi 180 adaptive mig RULES ARE FOR THE OBEDIENCE OF FOOLS AND THE  GUIDANCE OF WISE MEN.
Reply:Originally Posted by gordon stephensonI would have thought that brazing or even silver soldering,leaving a nice fillet around the joint would be plenty strong enough,
Reply:Bronze rod diam might be too, large. from the photos.  What silver content, soft stuff or hard stuff. Check cleanliness and over heating issues, too.
Reply:Originally Posted by tapwelderBronze rod diam might be too, large. from the photos.  What silver content, soft stuff or hard stuff. Check cleanliness and over heating issues, too.
Reply:i wanted to show you how it finished up.. i finally decided to tig it , it was way faster than oa--i made a bending jig for small round stock..small pieces of 1/2" square welded to a piece of 1/2" round, each piece of square has a different hole (1/4 , 5/16,  3/8)..clamp it down and it makes a tight turn, which is what i wantedi learned it is better to grind a little proactively and get a better joint than to grind after its all futzed up.. i used the edge of a grindingdisc to put a small concave saddle where the rods touched..better fit..overall 84 hooks to be made, ground,welded..gave me a small appreciation for doing more than one at a tie, which is my experience...im not making the vertical piece of the display tree so no foto of finished product, but i think she'll be happy ..many thanks to all those who helped me... Attached Images