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I have been asked to come weld for a guy who wants to turn out aluminum boxes.  There will be two joint types.  A short outside corner (lid) and a lap joint (side and bottom).  He is using 16 ga diamond sheet.  He has shown me some that appear to mig welded.  They are over sized welds and look like miggie.  These were not produced by him, but are samples of what I would be doing.I have mig welded aluminum and understand the ins and outs with it.  But I explained to him that I have never welded any aluminum this thin.  He is fine with that.  He has a miller 252 with spool gun and will get a push/pull if I'd rather.  He has a 48 inch brake for the bends.My question to yall is: Do/have any of you weld 16 ga (.063) diamond with a mig?  I don't think the lap joints will be much of an issue, I am concerned about the outside corners though.What are your thoughts on this?  The money is really good.  I just don't want to step into this and then pull up short with a faulty process.  If it can be done I will master it, but if it can't be done reliably everytime, then I want to know.
Reply:I have welded 14 ga diamond plate aluminum to 16 ga diamond plate aluminum with my 30A spool gun from my MM251 and I can tell you it's not easy. The 30A has a min of 14 ga and you had better be moving pretty fast to keep from burning through that. A push/pull gun may be a different story.  I have never used one before.StephenMillermatic 251Miller Syncrowave 200Miller 30A SpoolgunHypertherm Powermax 30Etc., etc., etc.............Cancer Sucks!
Reply:Thats going to be really tricky using a spool gun on somthing that thin. I have not used a spool gun before on alu, just tig. I know they are tricky on thin stuff.Ya gotta spend money to make money!
Reply:that is what i am afraid of.  I have just about decided against it.  I haven't tigged aluminum and he doesn't have aluminum tig equipment anyhow.  I hate to walk away from a potentially good money maker.
Reply:Heat sinks are your friend.
Reply:since the boxes will be all similar dimensions for a set number in a run I was thinking of building some easy forms out of 3x3x1/4 inch steel angle for the corners and use some angle for the lap joint for the bottom.  on the boxes that will have a welded seam for the corners and bottom, would steel be a sufficient heat sink?
Reply:i would make copper backing plates. i think you should ask for a pulser mig with push/pull. then you should have little problem being able to do it.Dynasty 200DXPassport plus w/ spoolmate 100victor 315c oxy/(act and prop)Miller digital elitemilwaukee power tools
Reply:I agree with Turk.  A Millermatic 350P, or PowerMig 350MP, or XMT 350MPa + feeder, with a Python, or other gooseneck push-pull torch, are all excellent machines for producing 16ga aluminum parts.   We used 350P's with Pythons in my old job doing high volume production welding of aluminum parts made primarily of 16 ga extrusions.   The pulser really makes welding the thin stuff quick and easy.   The pulse cools the weld and allows you to weld at a normal travel speed and get a good weld without burning it up.  Without pulse, controlling the weld at much faster travel speed is more difficult to get a good weld.  I was able to turn off the pulser and make all of the welds with straight mig, except one more complicated joint, but it was quite a bit more difficult and I had have the machine really dialed in for each joint.  With the pulse, I could leave the machine at one setting and weld most of the different extrusions and joints without adjusting the machine, except for a couple of the more difficult ones.As far as the spool gun goes, you will find out in a short time how tiring it is do production welding with such a big, heavy, bulky gun, especially if the joint access is not easy.   The gooseneck style push-pull guns like the Python are so much nicer to weld with, easier on the body and hands.   Push-pull is also much more cost effective.  12", 16-lb rolls of aluminum wire are much less $$/lb and last much longer than the tiny 1 or 2 lb, 4" spools in the spool gun.  You'll spend a lot less time changing out rolls and running to weld shop for new rolls too.  I can't see any descent volume aluminum production operation being all that profitable using only a spool gun.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:thanks yall, I wil relay this to him.  if he is serious about this I will take it, if not then I will let it pass.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott Youngthanks yall, I wil relay this to him.  if he is serious about this I will take it, if not then I will let it pass.
Reply:After i spoke to him concerning some of the issues, he says he hired his nephew who is a graduating welder who says he can weld aluminum with his eyes closed.  He said he did it because I had admitted I hadn't welded aluminum that thin.  I wish them well.
Reply:HA!  Less than one day go from potentially a headache to worry free.  Guess I missed a train wreck in this one.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott Younghe says he hired his nephew who is a graduating welder who says he can weld aluminum with his eyes closed.
Reply:Originally Posted by DesertRider33Push-pull is also much more cost effective.  12", 16-lb rolls of aluminum wire are much less $$/lb and last much longer than the tiny 1 or 2 lb, 4" spools in the spool gun.  You'll spend a lot less time changing out rolls and running to weld shop for new rolls too.  I can't see any descent volume aluminum production operation being all that profitable using only a spool gun.
Reply:just wondering , nobody has said any thing aboat welding downhand ,make a guide for gun tube set at 20 off 90 turn up the power and go like hell. i have use my spoolgun for props this way when tmoro is fishen day and there is still 30 to do.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungAfter i spoke to him concerning some of the issues, he says he hired his nephew who is a graduating welder who says he can weld aluminum with his eyes closed.  He said he did it because I had admitted I hadn't welded aluminum that thin.  I wish them well.
Reply:I talked to some mutual acquaintances and found out the guy is trying to appease his sister.    I wish him well.  I also found out the kid has never welded aluminum before.  He has only welded steel.  The school is a two year school that covers all the fundamentals and give the graduates proficiency in mig and stick.  They leave and should be able to pass a vertical cert on 3/8ths plate. Thanks for yalls input.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungI talked to some mutual acquaintances and found out the guy is trying to appease his sister.    I wish him well.  I also found out the kid has never welded aluminum before.  He has only welded steel.  The school is a two year school that covers all the fundamentals and give the graduates proficiency in mig and stick.  They leave and should be able to pass a vertical cert on 3/8ths plate. Thanks for yalls input.
Reply:Applications like that are where the new inverter supplies that can weld pulse on pulse make their money back...
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungI talked to some mutual acquaintances and found out the guy is trying to appease his sister.    I wish him well.  I also found out the kid has never welded aluminum before.  He has only welded steel.  The school is a two year school that covers all the fundamentals and give the graduates proficiency in mig and stick.  They leave and should be able to pass a vertical cert on 3/8ths plate. Thanks for yalls input.
Reply:I learned real quick don't oversell yourself cause right after the handshake, you run a test plate.  I have seen guys come in talking big only to sneak out the back.  The guys that do at least know better; it is the ones that bugger up a plate test and then blame the machine, sticks, leads, holder, plates, humidity, hood, weather, or , or, or, or ad nauseum.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott Young...the kid has never welded aluminum before.  He has only welded steel...
Reply:I've had quite a few aluminum projects come in that had already been welded on by someone with a small mig who thought they knew how to mig aluminum.  Combination of wrong equipment and lack of experience usually results in an ugly disaster.  At least you knew enough to ask what equipment to use to do the job.  I don't think your friend will have much success with his manufacturing, by the sounds of it.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Originally Posted by DesertRider33 At least you knew enough to ask what equipment to use to do the job.  I don't think your friend will have much success with his manufacturing, by the sounds of it.
Reply:Originally Posted by Scott YoungI learned real quick don't oversell yourself cause right after the handshake, you run a test plate.  I have seen guys come in talking big only to sneak out the back.  The guys that do at least know better; it is the ones that bugger up a plate test and then blame the machine, sticks, leads, holder, plates, humidity, hood, weather, or , or, or, or ad nauseum.