Intake manifold project

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I've been working on a cylinder head for my truck and I've gotten over 50% more flow through it. Now the intake manifold is a big restriction. So I decided I would just have to fix that.First I cut it upThen I welded it back together with 3/16" spacers to widen the runnersThen I had to build up the ends so that I can grind them out to match the widened sectionsI'll be working on it more tomorrow I'll post more pics thenDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:Crazy project!!! I like the idea, I was thinking one for a Toyota motor I plan to beef up a bit. Now I am getting inspired, which means I will soon have a useless intake manifold sitting on my bench!!! And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:i like your thinking but would it have been essayer to build a new one from start?ChuckASME Pressure Vessel welder
Reply:Are the flanges still true after taking all that meat out of it and then from the heat of the welding ?
Reply:cool, I would cast one out of aluminum, or go to a scrap yard and find a new one.MY Shop Gear::1: a rock and string2: glass bottle and gas3: old remote and batteries4: metal taped together5: ripped shoe6: smash anphibious water craft
Reply:"Are the flanges still true after taking all that meat out of it and then from the heat of the welding ?"No they are not. I expect to have it resurfaced."cool, I would cast one out of aluminum, or go to a scrap yard and find a new one."It's not likely you'd find a performance manifold for a 22re in a scrap yard, And man it would be nice to be able to cast one, but alas, I can not.I'll likely make an all new one sometime but for now I'll make this one workDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:That manifold is a poor OEM design. Having the Thermostat right in between those two runners is just stupid. Those two cylinders probably run a little richer than the other two. I would suggest making a manifold in the future utilizing velocity stacks and getting the thermostat housing away from the intake manifold as much as possible. From the looks of it, you could have straighter runners and avoid touching the thermostat housing. Maybe even get some Phenolic spacers to reduce heat transfer from the head to the intake. Good job though.
Reply:no no no vicoor  I mean i would cast it my self with my metal foundry!MY Shop Gear::1: a rock and string2: glass bottle and gas3: old remote and batteries4: metal taped together5: ripped shoe6: smash anphibious water craft
Reply:Oh!That's A mighty generous offer!I need it by the end of next week.....You better get moving heres some pictures of the progress:this one shows how much bigger the modified runners are (about 10% wider)These two show the inside of runners before and afterDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:I know you guys are going to beat me up on my welding but here are some more picturesI've been working towards completing the plenum. After I got the plenum adapters basic shape down the I welded the lower plate of the plenum on.This shot shows the biuld up of weld to shape the bellmouthsThis shot is straight down the bellmouth and you can see the transition to the runnerstomorrow I'm going to finish smoothing things out before I put the plenum chamber onDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:ah yes, the god ol' 22re. great engine, and you've got some productive work on that manifold! ought to be good for performance. don't forget to reprogram the ECU to take advantage of dem dere mods
Reply:today I built up the divider with weld and smoothed things outDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:Thats Alotta rod you used there.  I would like to see the results.DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Originally Posted by David RThats Alotta rod you used there.  I would like to see the results.David
Reply:That´s a nice project!what machine are you using? For the ones that don´t know the 22re´s what engine is that? in which truck? don´t stop posting!My Babies: HF Drill pressHF Pipe Bender3   4.5" Black and Decker angle grindersLincoln Electric PROMIG 175that´s it!
Reply:my "machine" is a '93 Toyota 2WD pick-up (my hotrod)2.4L 4cyl 5spd detroit true trac w/4.10 gears LCE header and hand built exhaust lightened flywheel (soon to be about 185hp)Oh and the welding machine is a Miller dialarc HF with foot control and aircooled torchLast edited by Vicoor; 10-16-2007 at 06:05 AM.Don't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:Update,I've got it all together for about 2 months. So far everything is working well, and it runs like a scalded dog.Here's some more pics of the rest of the projectCurrently I'm working on the details to install a Megasquirt engine management systemDon't talk about it, Just do it!
Reply:turbocharged? I had a 86 with a turbo and that thing tore some serious *** and scooted
Reply:cool ChuckASME Pressure Vessel welder
Reply:Originally Posted by bigNATEturbocharged? I had a 86 with a turbo and that thing tore some serious *** and scooted
Reply:http://weldingweb.com/attachment.php...1&d=1206135384You've done a impressive amount of tiggin. With the amount of tiggin you're doing on this, you can begin practicing some of the finer point of TIG--you've got the hang of it and with some more practice can make stuff look as good as the other tiggers on this site.      The blue circles show some of unsealed porosity, craters (from too rapid a stop,without fading back with the torch and pedal), cold laps, shuts. Any little porosity hole or suck-hole in a crater, can become or is a pressure leak. Wash over this stuff, for some nice, smooth flowing over everything. Forget about the stack of dimes look--you need this seal-tight. Attached ImagesBlackbird
Reply:Tough Crowd.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterTough Crowd.....zap!
Reply:[QUOTE=Vicoor;174379]Tough? Yes, But I need criticism so I can learn more.anyhow After I got it running I found 4 small leaks, One of which was in the photo below, There was another that was where I just plain missed a spot when welding. It was so obvious I couldn't believe I missed it.I treated the leaks to a dab of epoxy becuse I didn't want to take the manifold back off.******Whoa! I'm not-trashing your work! I'm impressed along with the other posters! I'm suggesting that you take it to a little higher level, like Zap and other pro tigger's.1-Do you understand about fading back out, via the foot/hand control (and additionally pulling the torch back some while this is occurring)--to stop those craters?2-Ditto:  -cooking out casting porosity, filling it, and cooking some more? -wetting and washing over laps and folds? -then for good measure on something like this, doing some more cover passes, with nice, wetted, smooth fill and flow?  From what I've seen--I think you're capable of all of the above.Blackbird
Reply:[quote=dave powelson;174384] Originally Posted by VicoorTough? Yes, But I need criticism so I can learn more.anyhow After I got it running I found 4 small leaks, One of which was in the photo below, There was another that was where I just plain missed a spot when welding. It was so obvious I couldn't believe I missed it.I treated the leaks to a dab of epoxy becuse I didn't want to take the manifold back off.******Whoa! I'm not-trashing your work! I'm impressed along with the other posters! I'm suggesting that you take it to a little higher level, like Zap and other pro tigger's.1-Do you understand about fading back out, via the foot/hand control (and additionally pulling the torch back some while this is occurring)--to stop those craters?2-Ditto:  -cooking out casting porosity, filling it, and cooking some more? -wetting and washing over laps and folds? -then for good measure on something like this, doing some more cover passes, with nice, wetted, smooth fill and flow?  From what I've seen--I think you're capable of all of the above.okay, no more epoxy for you!
Reply:Lightened flywheel? Please tell me that you are using this truck strictly on a road course.There's a big misconception that a light flywheel is a "performance modificiation."The ONLY purpose it serves is to make downshifting easier.And no, it cannot and will never give you even .0000000001 HP of gain. It will, however, show up as a HP gain on a drive-on chassis dyno, but that is only because of the lower rotating mass allowing the dyno to wind up faster and will show up as mathematical error in the results. On a real engine dyno, it will not show up as any HP gain since it does not make the engine produce torque (which is what any dyno is measuring).Wouldn't it have just been easier to take 4 tubes, a 1/4" flange and a large tube for the plenum and fab an all new manifold? This seems like a lot of welding, warping and grinding for a manifold that still has the thermostat in a lousy location. As already brought up, make sure to reprogram the PCM for the new A/F and timing settings or at least bump the fuel pressure up a bit to move the entire A/F curve.
Reply:Originally Posted by turboblownLightened flywheel? Please tell me that you are using this truck strictly on a road course.There's a big misconception that a light flywheel is a "performance modificiation."The ONLY purpose it serves is to make downshifting easier.And no, it cannot and will never give you even .0000000001 HP of gain. It will, however, show up as a HP gain on a drive-on chassis dyno, but that is only because of the lower rotating mass allowing the dyno to wind up faster and will show up as mathematical error in the results. On a real engine dyno, it will not show up as any HP gain since it does not make the engine produce torque (which is what any dyno is measuring).Wouldn't it have just been easier to take 4 tubes, a 1/4" flange and a large tube for the plenum and fab an all new manifold? This seems like a lot of welding, warping and grinding for a manifold that still has the thermostat in a lousy location. As already brought up, make sure to reprogram the PCM for the new A/F and timing settings or at least bump the fuel pressure up a bit to move the entire A/F curve.
Reply:Look into the adjustable AFMs. Some are basic adjustment and others allow adjustment of the slope in different angles. There are even converters that can be added to your AFM that will allow you to tune your slope and even make "peaks" in arear that are needed such as for on engines with VV timing or that cheesey V-Tech system that "kicks in" at a ceratin RPM and makes the AF change.Yes- a light flywheel will rev quicker and sometomes allow you to feel it in 1st gear, but......If drag racing, you want the heavy one. You need the inertia available when you leave the line. A big flywheel has more stored energy than a light one. The heavy one resists slowing down when load is applied to, hence giving you that killer launch when you HAVE TRACTION. Two years ago, we proved this to many locals that used lightweights. One of the locals here has a 90 Eclipse (good traction car) that went consistant 12.20s. When the clutch was ready for replacement, we installed a flywheel that was lightened by 6lbs and the car could not break faster than 13.80. We reinstalled the OEM flywheel and the car once again went 12.20! This was all due to the fact that the light flywheel allowed the rotating mass to "slow" easier and deplete its stored energy rapidly when trying to accelerate a car with good traction.IF you have a car with ****ty traction (most FWDs, rear drive GM muscle car with OEM 4-link, minitrucks with OEM style suspension points), the light flywheel may not hurt you since you can't hook up anyway and get all of that energy to the tarmac. The heavier flywheel will just make more tire smoke and help break things.car with good traction....heavy flywheelcar with ****ty traction....eitherIf you need a light flywheel to help speed accelleration in lower gears, that means you need more engine! If you have a programmable PCM, this could be overcome by allowing more max timing lead in the lower gears. It could also mean that the driveline ratios are mismatched to the powerband (either too low of a low gear or even too deep of a final drive ratio). My 72 Duster went 11.4 with 3.55 gears and when I went to the 3.91 gears the car lsowed into the mid 12's. It seemed that with the deep gear that the engine "didn't rev quick enough", but the truth was that it was a gear mismatch and I took the load off the engine. Going to the shallower gears made the car fast. My favorite saying is "deep gears only make up for whatch ain't got under the hood."When all is matched well and thought is put into the project, it will work and it will blow peoples' minds. There are too many individuals that totally mismatch components when trying to go fast. They read things on the Internet and in RiceRacer magazine and copy what someone else did and it never works. Doing REAL research and engineering is what makes a 360CID smallblock with 8.6:1 compression (and 89 octane pump gas), 600CFM carb and 3:55 gears go 11.4 on street tires with an automatic.You alreay have a great engine to start with, so there's no reason that you shouldn't have a truck that hauls some *** with some research, trial and error. And a little nitrous never hurt anyone either!
Reply:My truck is certainly no drag truck, and with a 2.4l N/A engine I really don't have much to spare there. I'm just trying to maximize my overall performance and drivability. To me it seems that I am going the right direction for that goal. I can certainly see the effect that you talk about when I "launch" my truck as the engine initially bogs somewhat right off the line. But I don't really hook up good enough to get anymore power to the ground anyhow.As far as the AFM, it's days are limited as the megasquirt is a speed density system. So that whole restrictive flap door measuring device won't be needed.Don't talk about it, Just do it!