Lincoln Idealarc 250/250 or Everlast I-Tig 200?

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Hi All-First post, but I've been lurking for some time. I'm in a position to buy a very nice used older roundtop style Idealarc 250/250......no leads, clamp, or stinger. Shipped.ORan Everlast Power I-TIg 200...with consumables, stinger, torch, and regulator. Shipped.For approximately the same price.I know the pros of the Lincoln are that they're built like tanks and function quite well...but the Everlast stuff seems to offer a good price with a lot more functionality.I really like the idea of a super reliable welder (Lincoln) but I'm kind of discouraged by the size/weight. The Everlast is much lighter and comes with a decent warranty...but you won't hear anyone talk about them like the older 70's-80's Lincoln/Miller units.  Usage: I'm most interested in doing stainless from very thin to 1/4"....plus some general mild steel projects like a welding table, cart, etc. I have a 50A circuit in the garage to power either one.
Reply:Hey ScubaSteve,You indicate you've been lurking here for a while, so, I would presume you have read most of the members' opinions here regarding the brands & mfg. origin. Your best bet is to go to the Everlast forum & read what their owners have to say. You can also take stock in the reputation of the die-hard classics like the Lincolns & Millers. No one is going to make your decision. It's up to you to determine each equipments' merits or faults & what will best serve your needs in the long run, especially the time of proven success & satisfaction. It's your $$$$, so invest it any way you feel you need. You only have to satisfy yourself & not have to explain to anyone WHY you chose as you did. Live with the results of you own choices & decisions.DennyComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:You say 1/4" stainless.  You pretty much want a 250 Amp machine for that.  You also pretty much want a water cooled torch.  However....  The idealarc is first and foremost a stick welder.  Not what you want at all.  No gas valve (thus no post and pre-flow timers), no high frequency start (scratch starting on stainless is not what you want).  In my opinion that machine is out of the running.  (Unless I googled the wrong version of the machine).If you are really going to do 1/4" stainless (that's a big hunk of stainless) your going to want more than 200 Amps.  Stainless seems to keep the heat localized so you don't quite need the 1 Amp per .001", But its nice to have.  Bottom line, re-evaluate your need for 1/4" and if you still think its necessary, get a bigger machine.  With stainless, its always better to run a little faster with higher amps than slow with lower amps.  The slow puts too much heat in one spot.  Warping! From Everlast, the 225 and the 250 machine seems to be a big step up (in dollars) from the 200 machine.  Not sure how that will fit your budget.  On the plus side they should be full featured even on that 50Amp plug.If you are really just doing stainless (no aluminum), I think you will be very happy the with performance of one of those 80's (or even 70's) Miller.  Yes the machines weigh 500lbs.  And yes, sometimes they look old.  But they put out one of the steadiest arcs you will ever see.  330/320 AB,  Dialarc HF aircrafter etc. and all should be available via Craigslist for about that $600 range.  Often you will find them with water cooled torch, pedal etc. for that price.  Some people think they are worth more - so be prepared to haggle.  Those would be 300+Amp machines.  The down side on these old machine is they have a range switch.  You cannot feather the power from 200 amps down to 5-10 (whatever the minimum is).  You basically hit the minimum power for your range and snap, the arc goes out.The next step up would be something like a Syncrowave.  The 250s are actually 300 Amp capable and about the most reliable TIG machine you will find.  In theory your grand kids will still find it useful.  The asking price seems to be about $2000 - sometimes you find one for $1500 or less.  Jump on those.  Don't be afraid of a 350.  They are 500 Amp machines but as long as you stay away from the upper ranges you should be able to get them to work on 50Amp breaker (maybe ask around).  BTW, in theory, even the Idealarc requires 86 Amps to run stick on AC at 230V!As for 'very thin'.  When you get to about 20 gauge stainless, it is difficult to control warping.  Just about crumples like paper.  I used to have a Dialarc HF and can tell you that 20 gauge is in the range for that machine.BTW, a big plate of 1/4 stainless will probably run over $1000.  Are you sure you want/need 1/4" capability?Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:@Yorkiepap- Excellent advice....and you're right! The only opinion that matters is my own. I always like to consult before buying, though....thanks for the clarity.@Con_Fuse9....Thanks for the numbers....hard data is always a good thing. Yes, 1/4" SS is pretty big....probably wouldn't ever go that big except for mild steel....so I take it back  You're right on as far as the Lincoln model number ....I was planning on doing scratch start, but the lack of control could be a problem. Stopping and starting could get old real quick! Food for thought. Thanks guys!Last edited by ScubaSteve; 01-31-2011 at 10:19 PM.
Reply:Thanks 7A749.  When I search Lincoln's site for a 250/250 the stick machine is the only one that comes up.  There is a parts manual for a TIG-250/250 but no user manuals.  I can find user manuals for TIG-300/300.  I guess I'm too used to Miller's site.Oh, and it seems the Syncrowave 350 is a 400 Amp machine, not 500.  Still a nice machine.  There is one locally for $2500 complete with water cooled torch and water cooler.  Looks like an early 2000s 350LX.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:Personally, i would go with the everlast. From what people say, they are good machines, and welders are one of those things that, if they still work after the warranty runs out, they should be good for another 50 years or so. And you have a five year warranty with the everlast. I remember in about 2006 i decided that i would start attempting to farm the land that we own. I bought a good used tractor that needed some work, and after hundreds of hours of work, and thousands of my hard earned dollars, i gave up and scrapped it. So many things went wrong with that machine, that its just unbelievable. And someday i want to run my own welding shop. And so, i learned from that experience **cough** nightmare **cough cough** to never, ever, ever rely on used equipment. Now, i know that welders aren't tractors, and that lots of people out there depend on these old machines, but still, for me, thats a lesson learned. Im starting to shop around for, and buy tools, and ive even started building 3pt implements and a few odd things out of my garage, and im way more likely to buy a new machine that might not last for 50 years, than a good old one, that i dont know where its been, or what its been through, or if its going to blow up the next time i flip the switch. Maybe im just paranoid, but id buy the new one anyday. But thats just me. Good luck :-)[Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:The Lincoln 250/250 is a stick machine....was hoping to add a reg and torch for scratch start TIG.....But i guess there's plenty smaller, newer units out there nowadays that are probably superior....weight/size could be an issue mainly because I don't want to clutter the garage. Miller just seems to command a high price.....broken units are going for $600 plus....kinda crazy spending that kinda money sight unseen...but I understand why. I would really like to get one of the better brands, even the thermalarcs seem to be a nice balance between quality, size, and price....at least for a starter unit.
Reply:If you shop around (Ebay and Craigslist) you can find good used Lincolns. I paid $400 for my Idealarc 300/300, and it came with a 3/0 ground lead, 100 feet of 3/0 cable, a 25' air cooled torch and a "bag of crap".. Which had some useful fittings and such. Only things it needed was to be wired into the shop, and a flowmeter. The HF had some minor issues, which were completely fixed by help here on the forum.E-2C Hummer PilotLincoln IDEALARC 300/300 TIG Welder Lincoln AC/DC 225/125 BuzzboxLincoln Weld-Pak 155 MIGForney (Harris Style) TorchesoooooOoooooWhen in doubt.. ADD POWER!
Reply:Hey Lanse,Yes, you are entitled to your opinion, although you project that buying used equipment is a bad idea because of your own personal experience..... with a tractor, & not a welder. For you to interject that your experience is the basis for others to relate as gospel, is not really a sound reasoning. You state: "From what people say", as your reason & that is simply hearsay, is it not?  You have nothing to validate that any piece of equipments' warranty after 5 yrs will survive another 50yrs, so your assumption is just that..... remember to never assume.There are many used pieces of equipment, not necessarily just welders, that have been taken care of, used lightly, & are still in superb condition that will yield many years of faithful service. Your bad luck & excessive investment into a project that was totally fruitless from the start, is not any kind of comparison to judge all used equipment. The smart/educated consumer, looking to save some $$$ will always do their homework. The initial observation, simple test of working condition, & price that generally is always negotiable, will give credence to both buyer & seller if a deal can be made that will satisfy both parties. I have purchased (8) of my (12) welding units used as they were clean, worked perfectly as I tested them, & the price allowed me to save considerable $$$ which allowed me purchase another piece. So, please bear in mind that not everyone has the resources for new & can definitely get a superb deal with used equipment.Attached are pics of the used units I purchased & use daily without any issues since I got them. These are all over 10yrs old & work as new. The Lincoln 255 MIG was the unit from our company I sold the same day I listed it on CL & you can see how it was taken care of & tested by the buyer who paid the listed price without haggling. There are great used units that are available if one simply does their homework.Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:I am glad that I bought mine used.I got a nice welder,practically new from a wealthy guy that wanted something different I guess.I think I got it for less than half price.It's a Miller 250 syncrowave DX.It came with a Miller cover,water cooled torch,built in cooler,foot pedal,hand control w/amp controller,ground clamp,etc.I am very happy with it.GuyHypertherm Powermax 30Miller Syncrowave 250 DXMiller Challenger MigDevilbiss 60Gal 6hp Air CompressorCentury A/C D/C 225/140 Welder
Reply:Sorry guys,I would edit the size of the pic,but I don't see an edit function.Hope a moderator can help me with the pic.My first pic.I guess I should have resized it.GuyHypertherm Powermax 30Miller Syncrowave 250 DXMiller Challenger MigDevilbiss 60Gal 6hp Air CompressorCentury A/C D/C 225/140 Welder
Reply:Hey all-Thanks for all the great advice. Eventually ended up going with a Maxstar 150 STH. Got it with the full accessories package; x-case, regulator, torch, and finger remote. For $1500 new and free shipping, I couldn't go wrong. Hell, used units were selling on Ebay for $1200....and with fewer accessories. Just got all the rest of my gear (flowmeter, tank, hood, gloves) and I should be tigging (or attempting to TIG) in no time.
Reply:I have an Idealarc 250 ac/dc stick machine and I tig weld stainless steel via scratch start frequently with it. It does a very good job of this for a very economical price. I am not sure why folks say scratch start tig ing stainless is not a good idea? X ray quality welds are done daily in industry with scratch start tig.JasonLincoln Idealarc 250 stick/tigThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52Miller Bobcat 250Torchmate CNC tableThermal Arc Hefty 2Ironworkers Local 720