Good and Bad MIG Welders

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Hello everyone. I'm new to welding, have been teaching/practicing the basics at work when I get a chance, and have decided to try and find a decent used 220V unit for home use. I've checked Ebay and Craig's. There are plenty of brands I've never heard of but some of the main ones I see regularly are Century, which I believe is a Lincoln product, as well as Systematic, Chicago Electric, Central Electric, ThermalArc, etc. I have researched some of these such as ESAB and know that they seem to be a well respected unit for commercial use.  I would opt for a nice Lincoln/Miller/Hobart but they are more expensive and my budget, while flexible, is not unlimited. Of the "secondary" brands that are out there are any of them worth messing with or should I just wait for a good deal on one of the top tier machines? I'm looking for something in 175 A and above range, just for the versatility it will give me should I decide to work with thicker stock. Thank you.
Reply:Top brands: Lincoln, Miller, Essab,  older Hobart's, in no particular order in the US.Mid level brands:  Thermal arc and the newer Hobart's. There's a lot of over lap between these two areas. The MAC tools, Snap on and so forth machines probably fall in this category.Cheap machines:. Chicago Electric, and "no name" brand imports ( Northern Tool, Eastwood,  Astra, etc). These are machines that frequently have QC issues, are FC only ( bottom end 110v units), have limited power settings and erratic feed issues. Some are good, and others aren't worth the money if someone gives them to you. the problem is it varies between machine to machine in the same brand. There's no real way to know if the machine you get will be good, bad or so so.  These will make learning harder as you won't know if the problem is with you or the machine many times. Also these machines usually fall into the  "disposable" category. When they break, don't expect to be able to get parts to fix them. You will have to locate your own parts from other sources and do it yourself with no instructions or manuals.What exactly is your budget and what are you looking to do with it? A new Hobart 187 on close out at $650  ( probably one of the best deals on a 230v mig right now if you are on a budget) isn't the same as a used MM250 as far as capability. Both would be excellent starter migs even if the MM250 is overkill.Also if you haven't tried one, I'd suggest using a CL aggregator like Crazedlist or searchtempest. I use "welder" as my search topic and then seacrh the list by hand to see what might interest me. I usually have the range set at 250 miles but usually only look at the 1st 5-6 lists to seee what's semi local unless I'm really searching har for something right now.Last edited by DSW; 10-16-2011 at 11:05 AM..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Marine 73.  I'm sure you will get responses from people with a whole lot more knowledge than me.  I think Chicago Electric and Central electric are Harbor Freight Chinese stuff.  A word of caution even on the Miller and Lincoln used stuff.  Make sure repair parts are available for it.  My little Miller 110 unit isn't that old, but I understand certain electronic parts are unavailable or hard to locate.
Reply:I would definitely hold out for one of the respected major brands: Miller, Lincoln, ESAB, Hobart, and Thermal Arc in approximately that order. The others are either second-rate brands and/or import junk. Of course the good ones don't show up every day but patience will eventually be rewarded.Also,as many here have suggested, use a Craigslist aggregator like searchtempest to find welders near your area. When you find one, search this board to see what problems, if any, are experienced by other usersFor instance, the Millermatic 200 is an older unit but is reliable and highly regarded. The MM 250X... not so much!Good luck,JohnA few weldersA lot of hammersA whole lot of C-clamps
Reply:Okay, thanks for the quick replies. I'll use the aggregators to search again. I would prefer to limit my cost to around $400 and I realize that this will limit me somewhat but I'll stick with the top brands. I can afford to bide my time and wait for a good deal to come along. Thanks again for all the info!
Reply:Unfortunately $400 won't get you much at all as far as a decent 220v mig. It's tight even for the cheap 220v migs. Also a side note, some of the lower priced import 220v migs are only 140 amp. That's pretty much the same output you get with the top end 110v migs, so you really didn't gain anything by going to 220v with one of those. If you want a "real" 220v mig you need to be sure it's at least a 180 amp capable machine. They do show up from time to time, but $400 is really pushing the lower limits of what you will find. You probably need to have about $650-750 as a budget for a decent 180 amp class mig. Look around for deals on the Hobart HH187. Hobart has "upgraded" the machine to the HH190 and many places are clearing out the older models at really good prices. I think I read a thread here earlier today where someone posted up a price on the HH187 in the mid $550 range on clearance..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Just for the record, I had two Century units, one an 230v AC/DC stick, and the other a 120v MIG for wellover 20 years andnever had a problem with either.  I kept the MIG, a supposed 110 amp model the longest.  It actually seemed underrated and welded as well as newer 140 Hobart units.  And Lincoln seemed to have a good supply of spares though I never needed any.  With just these two welders I built several trailers, three weldup metal buildings, and numerous auto and ag equipment repairs.I recently sold both to pay for a new HH187.  I really like it - it has a wider sweet spot than the Century MIG but I miss the 120v capability.  The Century came with a far better manual andmore consumables than the Hobart.   wouldn't hesitate to buy another Century if a good deal came along.Steve in Central TX