Business that slips through your fingers

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How many times has this happened to you small businessmen?Customer calls with a good project.  You discuss and agree upon a date and time to do the work.  Everybody's happy.Later that same day, the same customer calls back and says something to the effect of, nevermind, my mechanic/helper/brother-in-law/etc. said he can do the job.  Don't bother to show up.Normally this stuff doesn't bother me, because when this happens it's usually on of those projects that's small and can be handled by an amateur.  (Fix my non-structural, widget that I'll just throw away if you can't fix it)Today I got a call to work on a piece of heavy equipment.  I got the 'dear john' call a few hours later.  The customer's mechanic is using a borrowed MIG welder to weld an attachment to the boom of a medium sized excavator.I can see it now.  1/2"-1" thick steel, no preheat, probably welded with 0.030 solid wire in short circuit.Half of me is waiting for the call, "the attachment snapped off, can you hurry over and fix it!".  The other half is hoping I don't get that call, because somebody could get killed if it fails...How do you handle this situation?  Do you explain the complications involved in making this repair when another person you don't know, but suspect isn't a pro, is already working on the job?  Suppose he is competent, and doing the job correctly?  Then I look like a schmuck who's willing to 'undercut' a stranger; who may be OK to do the job, a professional welding working in another career because welding don't always pay so good, or a hopeless incompetent? Never mind the fact I spent an hour of my life I'll never get back checking on rod or wire for the job and researching the right procedure to use on the job....That's just cost of doing business. Or even worse, I turned down work because this was lined up...What can you do besides say, "Thanks for the opportunity, let me know if you need help in the future?"Somebody throw me a bone and let me know there's some non-sleazy way to snatch these lost opportunities back from the edge of the cliff...Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:Bite your tongue and charge more than you would have the first time when he needs to be bailed out of a mess. Everyone thinks that if they can weld a muffler on then they are pipe welders. It's like calling a mechanic and setting up an appointment to rebuild your engine and after he tracks down all the parts he gets a call saying "My brother in-law is a carpenter so he's gonna rebuild it for me". I've welded on a few thumbs on excavators before and I'm sure it's not a rookie job. Good way to kill someone.CERTIFICATIONS:7018M- H.V.O10718M- H.V.O11018M- H.V.O9N10- H.V.O71T-1-HYM- H.O.V100S1 PULSE ARC 0,035- H.O.V100S1 PULSE ARC 0.045- H.O.VER70S-3 PULSE ARC 0.035 H.O.VER70S-3 PULSE ARC 0.045 H.O.VER5554- H.O.V
Reply:My solution to people like that is I am a total dick(just like them).  When the "customer" calls back I ignore the first few calls/messages. Finally when they are desperate I tell them It will cost a premium and go do the job cash on the barrel head.   People like that just piss me off and 99% of the time they are better off being sent down the road.Disclaimer; "I am just an a$$hole welder, don't take it personally ."
Reply:I don't have a welding business but I have an electrical business and this happens to us also. I just cheerfully say I am happy they got it taken care of and leave it at that. A number of times they call back after it didn't work out, sometimes a few days later and I have had some call back after more than a year.My company has a high reputation and not a single unhappy customer, which these days seems to be an exception. Those who want the best eventually come around, those who don't care are the ones you don't need.Miller Challenger 172Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC 225/150Miller Maxstar 150 STLVictor 100CVictor JourneymanOxweld OAHarris O/ASmith O/A little torchNo, that's not my car.
Reply:Basically, they found someone that can do the job, YOU. Then, after they're at ease because they found you, they started looking for someone that can do it cheaper. If they're not comfortable with anyone else, they still have you to do the job. I've seen it many times. If it's someone I think I will get their loyalty after the job, I smile and do it. If I think I am saving their *** and I won't be getting called again, I charge BIG $$$."Where's Stick man????????" - 7A749"SHHHHHH!! I sent him over to snag that MIC-4 while tbone wasn't looking!" - duaneb55"I have bought a few of Tbone's things unlike Stick-Man who helps himself" - TozziWelding"Stick-man"
Reply:Usually I just thank them for the call and tell them to keep me in mind when they need the work redone if it fails. And it's not uncommon that I get that next call to come deal with the problem.As much as I hate it, I make more money fixing other peoples F ups than I do if I did the job correctly right from the start. It's tough, I hate having to fix F ups and it pushes my BP sky high, but I have to keep telling myself these people are penny wise and dollar stupid, and they get what they deserve if that's what they want to do..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Not a professional welder, either.  I have people, not many, attempt to tell me how they want their teeth restored.  The have no experience, no education, no scientific knowledge, no physics education, no understanding of dental material strength, design, application, no understanding of tensile or compressive strength, no understanding of torque application, etc.  BUT, they want to tell you, "I am here, and want to go there." They don't know how to read a map! You cannot cantilever a span of four teeth off of a single, short-rooted tooth. In the words of "The Humongous "...."Just walk away".  Only a disaster can occur.  You will get blamed and when an inquisitor like a lawyer or judge implores you to explain why you chose the course of action you did....and you realize there is no reasonable answer...you have only yourself to blame.  In the "make one person happy and they will tell 5 or 10, but make one person unhappy and they will tell everybody" may apply. It may be applied unfairly by the disgruntled person who is ignorant of how your job skills apply to the work they want. Same when people have three choices...good, better and best. Good is a patch. Customer expects whatever you do to have the quality and expectancy of good to last like the best. Not gonna happen. People have faulty memories, too.  Reason a handshake or someone's word is worthless and lawyers, contracts, bonds, patient consent are a must, nowadays. People that call you and then drop you are simply using you...in most cases. You are a quick-fix or a stop-gap. They want cheap and fast,not great and long-lasting. They are not dependable, they don't understand the complexity or professionalism that you offer. These people will go on ski trips, cruises, buy boats, but turn around go price shop for heart bypass!  They will be a constant source of headaches for you on weekends, holidays, etc.   There are too many good customers out there who will be repeat customers, who will refer you others and help build your business, rather than to fool around with these annoyances.  I am sure there are some that will cater to these "one-timers" and attempt to make a living, but, I would guess the long-term success of their business is very shaky, in not certainly predictable, meaning failure.   Quality customers whom already have a good IQ when it comes to knowledge of what you do and can provide, or can be educated by you on what is going on, will be great customers. They will understand what is going on and why.  They will not be dealing with unknown things.  They will be more likely to accept your judgment and be comfortable with your decisions, rather than questioning everything you propose. Those people appreciate and admire what skills you offer and will pay a premium price for that premium work.   My father just retired at 86 as a master electrician and electrical contractor as an IBEW member for over 65 years.  I saw him do work for "country clubbers" who never worked a day in their life. They would see a person digging a hole and stop and stare at the guy with "the magic stick" that could make a hole in the ground.  But, they wanted Rolls Royce service and pay moped prices. Now, those people are cheapskates in general, but they also have no idea of what skill it takes to bend conduit with a foot bender and have it all parallel. No idea the skill to run conduit along a wall, offset it to a junction box, no idea how and why some people can and do run conduit along a beam and hide it for aesthetics. No idea how much skill it takes to bend a compound curve in conduit and "back out" a bend to re-bend that curve that was a little less than perfect (many young electricians cannot do this either, or use a foot bender, as they need a hydraulic one...which means a job without a generator to run the hydraulic bender, means no bending).  My father had a collection of photographs of his work, his capability, his attention to detail to provide more than the customer expected and not overpriced, cheap looking, poor quality work.  Those people sent him customers. The engineers he dealt with had plenty of "book smarts", but would come to him for help in real world application.  They trusted him and depended upon him to help them in matter that they did not totally understand. They in turn looked great to their bosses and had a great symbiotic relationship with him to do the right thing, do it on time, and have something they were proud to be associated with for the rest of their careers.  I saw this as I was growing up and did not understand it always. I just thought he was tough and self-critical (critical with me on my ditch digging. how big of a deal can ditch digging be? I learned...damn hard).  But, the more self-critical you are, the more you can objectively criticize your own work to try to impress yourself with perfection, the easier it will be to impress your customers the first time, and every time. And, they will support you and pay higher prices for that dependability upon you and confidence in your skill and ability to impress them with your final product.  When I say self-critical, I also mean you have self-competition to take a little more time to plan out the best course of action before you start. Like "measure twice, cut once." One of my best professors told me, "Plan your work, work your plan".  The "plan" was not step 1, step 2, done. It was kind of like a flow chart, of "what ifs" with alternate contingency plans to branch off to in case of unforeseen complications arose. That way, you simply flowed, instead of getting into a panic or wasting time to reformulate another plan. People know things arise and your ability to competently move ahead is valued and highly regarded.  Sorry for the long post.  But, I have seen it myself in different professional settings. The results seem to be the same. "Keep doing what you've been doing, and you'll keep getting what you've been getting" seems to apply to being a success, or being frustrated, stressed and unhappy in any endeavor. Sometimes you have to be able to say, "I cannot help YOU."Last edited by TxDoc; 02-23-2012 at 12:34 AM.TxDoc's Photos Lincoln SP175 PlusLincoln Power Mig 256Lincoln 250 LX Spool Gun Lincoln Precision Tig 225 Hypertherm 600 KMG 2x72 Belt GrinderBaldor 812RE Grinder
Reply:Ink the deal in 15 minutes or else charge to estimate the job properly. Estimate fees are legit. After that, let them walk once they have paid for the estimate. Then the customer can have you take the job or leave it, your estimating time being spent on his dime.jmelho, ymmv, Just don't do what this guy did! :O[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIMcVxm5BSQ[/ame]Last edited by tanglediver; 02-23-2012 at 12:50 AM.City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Do not overact and or step down to their level. Be Professional, Honest, and last but not least, Kind! Work will fall out of the sky if you follow these principals. It takes less muscles to smile than frown. Sell - Sell - Sell some more! Most laborers/specialist cannot sell their services........that is a big problem in today's screwed up world. Hope this helps you....I know your work is top notch....lets get your attitude right! Think Positive! Get online and buy a used copy of Dr. Maxwell Maltz book Psycho Psybernetics....It changed my whole dictionary in my brain....and outlook on life...Keep Hustling!Lincoln 305GLincoln 100 WeldpakAssortment of Victor, Smith and Harris TorchesDont Worry About the Mule-Load the Wagon!Lincoln 305GUnion Carbide TorchDon't Worry About the Mule~Load the Wagon!
Reply:when they call for the first time i outline the complexity's of the project and let them know that what their asking comes with a fair amount of liability and responsibility.    Then get them to agree on a time and a place.   if they call back and cancel its no skin of my back, i thank them for calling and saving me the fuel.    If i head out there and find out that their a no show i WILL bill them.its the $50,000+ jobs that disappear on me that keep me up at night.    Thats was the theme of 2010, get emotionally invested in GREAT jobs only to have them disappear on me.IF someone comes out there and HACKS it up i usually end up making WAY more money fixing someone Else's mess than i would have doing it right to begin with.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by tanglediverJust don't do what this guy did! :O
Reply:Tanglediver - OMG!!! I wonder if that is covered under insurance? I wonder if the employee will ever see daylight again? OMG!!!   OMG!!!   OMG!!!"Where's Stick man????????" - 7A749"SHHHHHH!! I sent him over to snag that MIC-4 while tbone wasn't looking!" - duaneb55"I have bought a few of Tbone's things unlike Stick-Man who helps himself" - TozziWelding"Stick-man"
Reply:Originally Posted by TozziWeldingMy solution to people like that is I am a total dick(just like them).  When the "customer" calls back I ignore the first few calls/messages. Finally when they are desperate I tell them It will cost a premium and go do the job cash on the barrel head.   People like that just piss me off and 99% of the time they are better off being sent down the road.
Reply:Half of me is waiting for the call, "the attachment snapped off, can you hurry over and fix it!". The other half is hoping I don't get that call, because somebody could get killed if it fails...
Reply:Reminds me of the fellow who called me to ask if I could weld the frame on his Harley.  I said sure, and gave him a price for doing the job at his house.  I could hear his jaw hit the floor over the phone.  He said nevermind, he'd get his buddy to bring over his welder and fix it again.I asked if he thought that was a good idea, seeing as how his life was riding on the end result.  Fellow told me he was unemployed and couldn't afford to pay more than XXX.  I said, that doens't even cover the fuel for me to drive there and look at the job.Wished him the best of luck and ended the call. Originally Posted by Dualiewhen they call for the first time i outline the complexity's of the project and let them know that what their asking comes with a fair amount of liability and responsibility.    Then get them to agree on a time and a place.   if they call back and cancel its no skin of my back, i thank them for calling and saving me the fuel.    If i head out there and find out that their a no show i WILL bill them.its the $50,000+ jobs that disappear on me that keep me up at night.    Thats was the theme of 2010, get emotionally invested in GREAT jobs only to have them disappear on me.IF someone comes out there and HACKS it up i usually end up making WAY more money fixing someone Else's mess than i would have doing it right to begin with.
Reply:Thanks for the replies.  Sometimes the business side of business just gets to me.  The welding is usually easy by comparison.We'll see what the future brings.  The original call ended on a good note, so hopefully the customer will reach out if there's a problem or something else needs doing in the future.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:I have always said the work was the easy part.    Its all the other shat the comes along with it that will run a man into the ground.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:The work can be easy, or the work can be hard.It's the people that can be impossible.