Production Techniques Part V.... Cutting Angles

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Hey guys,I will need (4) posts (17pics) to get all the pics on, so PLEASE WAIT till all (4) posts are done to see the pics in sequential order. THANKS....Here's another episode of production techniques & some helpful methods to allow you to obtain excellent corner miters. I see many of the youngsters/newbies are having difficulties with corner angles & getting a good setup.First, being in production my entire career, I do most projects/applications by cutting multiple pieces to save time. A good tungsten-tooth dry cut saw is my first choice because of the cutting power & ease with great cuts on steel, or any metal. An abrasive saw can be used, although cutting multiple pieces will be severly impaired. Generally, only one piece at a time can be done with any accuracy & that is if it has a stout set of vise jaws.This is an order from my past employer as I do subcontracting for him with the several customer contracts he kept. This is a 3-segment ceiling grid, 6' X 8', that is used on the top of the office cubicle we manufactured for American-Eagle. These are simply an independent small office for the A-E managers & usually set up in the rear area of the stores. We mfg. (2) sizes with the 2nd unit an 8' X 8' unit. The smaller unit gets a (3) segment grid, & the larger one gets a (4) segment unit. The smaller unit has (1) 4' x 4tube flourescent fixture in the center grid, & larger unit gets (2) flourescent fixtures in the center (2) grids.Next are the drawings of the (2) grids w/dimensional stats of the grid sizes & configurations for the grids w/lights & the grids that get 2' X 4' ceiling panels. The frames are made with 1" X 1" X 1/8" angle, corner mitered/welded, & 1.5" X 1/8" straps for light & panel support. The angle material lengths are cut (3) at a time on my dry cut saw. After all pieces are cut, the vise is shifted to 45* for the corner miters. The secret to getting a really nice accurate angle is to use another piece of the same angle to support the angle in the vise. This makes a "box" in the vise jaws & makes it very rigid so there is no vibration or movement that would alter the 45* cut.The next group of pics are the setup on my welding table. I use 1.5" X 1" alum. angle as a frame jig to maintain squareness & repetitive consistency. Everything is clamped & checked for square prior to welding. Once the alum frame guides are clamped, each piece is simply placed into position, clamped, & welded.....makes quick work when doing multiple pieces. When I was working, there were many times we got 8-12 orders from A-E for these units, so production had to be effective/efficient.Anyway, the pics are in sequential order of fabrication so you can see how nice angle corners can be done. Hope this helps those who are having difficulty with angle corner miters & maintaining accuracy. Don't hesitate to ask any ????.Ok..... give me time to get all (4) posts on. Thanks....Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:2nd Group......Gonna be 2 more....Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:Group 3....Gonna be (1) more....Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:Last group...Hope these help you make better corner joints....Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:Denny,Thanks for posting your techniques! I can already see how to incorporate better corners into upcoming projects...Which type of cold cut saw are you using? I've got a 14" abrasive saw but I like the idea of a cleaner cut (and garage).-Tom
Reply:Hey Tom,Glad to hear you found usable info to help you. My saw is a Porter-Cable 1410 Dry Cut Saw, with 14" Freud Diablo C7, 72T. tung.-tipped blade I use exclusively. These saws are low rpm(1300) & the blades are rated for 1800rpm & NOT to be used in an abrasive saw. This Porter-Cable is no longer made & the company merged with Black & Decker from my understanding. The only saw that would be comparable is the Evolution Rage(? 2 or 3), not sure. I know several members here have the same saw as I do, & others have the Evo. unit & appear to be quite satisfied with it also. They have superb power & with the Diablo blades, I average 1200-1500 cuts before sharpening is needed, & I also do that myself. Do some homework on the good saws, especially the vise, as some are quite flimsy. The Evo appears to have a heavy vise also. Anyway, here's some pics of my saw & setup configurations I use.Denny Attached ImagesComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."
Reply:thank you so much for posting this. you just helped me out a ton.im gonna flamed to now end for this but maybe someone can learn off my mistake. i was cutting a tab out of the bottom of the angle and fitting the pieces together (if you can imagine it). then i was wleding outside corners that werent snug and wonderng why **** would melt or get holes blown into it.if the angle was made out of wood id use a mitre saw and 45 it on both ends. i wouldnt cut the bottom tab out and fit it together. so why would metal be any different?lessons learned today....mitre cuts are your friend and weld on the inside!the grand ol' opry aint so grand anymoremiller maxstar 150sworking on an oxy/acet set up
Reply:Originally Posted by yorkiepapHey Tom,Glad to hear you found usable info to help you. My saw is a Porter-Cable 1410 Dry Cut Saw, with 14" Freud Diablo C7, 72T. tung.-tipped blade I use exclusively. These saws are low rpm(1300) & the blades are rated for 1800rpm & NOT to be used in an abrasive saw. This Porter-Cable is no longer made & the company merged with Black & Decker from my understanding. The only saw that would be comparable is the Evolution Rage(? 2 or 3), not sure. I know several members here have the same saw as I do, & others have the Evo. unit & appear to be quite satisfied with it also. They have superb power & with the Diablo blades, I average 1200-1500 cuts before sharpening is needed, & I also do that myself. Do some homework on the good saws, especially the vise, as some are quite flimsy. The Evo appears to have a heavy vise also. Anyway, here's some pics of my saw & setup configurations I use.Denny
Reply:I like the short piece of angle to keep the piece being cut from camming out....I'll steal that idea, thanks!
Reply:Once again Denny you have given me some more knowledge and techniques. I really like the concept of turning  the angle upside down to cut the other mitre.Thanks for posting this, I only wished the internet had been around when I was 30, this would have saved me a lot of effort making mitres back then.One question I have though: You also have a horizontal bandsaw, so why do you use the chopsaw when cutting multiples rather than the horizontal bandsaw?Keep these techniques coming, they  are great help.Cheers.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Yup thanks for posting, I lurk a lot but I've been noticing a lot of attitudes here "I don't want to share my technique."So thanks to guys like you that share the tips and tricks you've learned and picked up.  Helpful guys like you has been what has helped me get as far as I have gotten in my career and will always continue to help me learn new stuff.
Reply:Great idea boxing the pieces to cut 2 at a time.  Now dumb questions time.  When cutting mitred corners do you add any length due to material thickness.  For instance if the inside dimension of 12" is desired do you cut the long side of the piece longer, based on the mateial thickness??  I just did this last night and cut the pieces to the exact length and had a way bigger gap then anticipated to fill on the outside corners.
Reply:I love that stand. I'm def gonna build one just like it (need one bad, cutting on the floor sucks). I dont want to hijack but this is another way that i get great results. This technique is probably not for everybody.  The only photos are of me doing it with aluminum. First I mark the angle with a cheap square. For aluminum I have found red markers work best for me. Then I cut it in my old bandsaw (I use wax on the blade). For steel i just use my crapy chop saw and adjust as close as I can. Then I quickly bump it on my 6x48 belt sander like this. But you have to set it up right. I get some scrap and test the angle and adjust until it is perfect. www.performancealuminumfabrication.com
Reply:Hey guys,Glad to see you find these technique postings useful.... thanks.To Glenn(Stampeder):  I don't have a horizontal bandsaw, although I use a vertical one downstairs in the machine shop. The P-C dry cut saw can cut much more material at a significant more efficient time frame & do thicker material with ease. Besides, the dry cut saw setup/stand is more compact.To antibling:  Personally, I don't feel any of the techniques I have posted are such a big-deal "secret" that I would not want to pass on to the youngsters/newbies to learn. What benefit is it to anyone if I die having locked away useful info that allows another to gain knowledge & experience. A tremendous amount of knowledge has been lost in the past by those who never felt they should "give away" their "secrets".To akpolaris:  I always cut material to the specified overall length, & then mitre. The inside dimensions would be determined by the size of the angle you choose to use, ie., 1" X 1". 1.5" X 1.5", 2" X 2", etc.. All the cuts I make are to the outside corner to the finish length needed.To welds4d:  Yes, I see many have serious issues with cutting angle & the piece camming. That could cause injury & easily destroy a good tungsten blade in a heartbeat. My pap showed me that method way back in '56 teaching me how to cut mitres.Addendum:  I have posted other techniques on cutting methods in other threads that you can review if you take some time to do a search.DennyComplete Welding/Machine/Fab. ShopMobile UnitFinally retired*Moderator*"A man's word is his honor...without honor there is nothing.""Words are like bullets.... Once they leave your muzzle, you cannot get them back."