TIG Welder Questions

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I’m trying to find an inexpensive TIG welder for joining mostly cast aluminum and 6061 alloy plate. What inexpensive welder would you guys recommend with an $800 to $2000 budget? Also what features & controls work the best with welding aluminum? I recently purchased one of those Chinese 3-in-1 units with the combined TIG/MMA & plasma cutter and the thing went up in smoke after 10-minutes of use. I’m not looking to make the same mistake twice and would appreciate any input.
Reply:Powcon! The Other Red, does more than just stick weld.Mig tig stick flux-core carbon arc. Its a all in one Bad a** unit. Look for a smt350 or 400 if you cant find one the ST will do the same.
Reply:Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Powcon! The Other Red, does more than just stick weld.Mig tig stick flux-core carbon arc. Its a all in one Bad a** unit. Look for a smt350 or 400 if you cant find one the ST will do the same.
Reply:Originally Posted by 7A749Yup.Pretty common there. Most Chicom stuff is plain junk. Some is acceptable (Riland is decent) but most end up where you're at now.As far as a good cheap machine, Miller Dialarc HF & A/BP TIG machines are both units that can be had for under $500 if you look around. All analog, no boards or solid state circuitry. They are excellent on DC & work nominally well for AC aluminum. Many thousands of them in use today 25+ years old making acceptable quality welds.Miller Syncrowave 250 machines are squarewave output units & are selling for under $1500 regularly if you look around. The S'wave 300-350's (older units NOT DX models) sell reasonably, but are large & heavy, also needing 100+ amps input power to operate to any consistent effectiveness.If you're looking for an AC/DC TIG inverter set up & ready to go for under $2000, join the club & get it line. Everyone else is too. Dynasty 200's can be had used for $1800 if you get lucky, but that's not every day. Powcon makes a good machine, Lincoln & Miller also offer DC only units such as the XMT line which generally do MIG TIG & Stick welding in DC output.No Aloooooominium AC TIG with those tho. Only with a spoolgun.Hope this helps a little. Just a matter of what you really need & want to spend.EDIT: There is a guy on here selling a Lincoln TIG 300/300 for under $500 on the east coast. Great deal & a super machine, great price.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=43140Good luck with your search.
Reply:I just got a sync 250 with a pulsar for $1000.  Took a couple months of searching CL and it was pretty far away (fortunately my company has another plant that is real close to where this was so I just picked it up when I was over there) but I had everything (TIG, cables, biggest bottle of argon, regulator, basic consumables) for almost to the dollar $1500.  I love the machine, small enough that it doesn't take up my whole garage, but it's big enough to do anything I'd ever do.  Welds aluminum or whatever.  It's about 15 years old, but works GREAT.  I know Lincoln makes good stuff too, but I'm sold on blue.  Good luck in your search - and don't forget to budget for consumables and gas and everything.Millermatic 135Syncrowave 250
Reply:Originally Posted by X83I was looking at the inverted AC/DC WSE200P or TIG200P welders but don’t know if I should go with another wonton welder consider what happened with the first one. Which welder do you think would offer the best quality for aluminum only without breaking the bank?
Reply:Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Powcon! The Other Red, does more than just stick weld.Mig tig stick flux-core carbon arc. Its a all in one Bad a** unit. Look for a smt350 or 400 if you cant find one the ST will do the same.
Reply:My vote is for a miller sync 180/200/250.  They will all do what you need, 180 being a bit on the light side but will still do 3/16 AL just fine.  All solid machines, 200 and 250 normally have watercooled torches.Have we all gone mad?
Reply:Hey, Yes Powcon is still being made down in San Diego CA. Its known now as arc-products. most Powcons are230v 460v real easy to flip the circuit board in the machine.  If your welding thin materials aluminum  .022 .035 16GE yes I would consider the ac feature on the welder.If you are welding  .100 or better I would just weld dc straight  w/helium the welds are smaller haz area is smaller. When I say or better I mean unlimited thickness. If your welding 2'' alum blocks ac you will need the flash of a nuclear bomb to get the puddle to flow with ac welding. Not to mention that you are destroying the molecular composition of the alum. I used to work for all the big contractors Raytheon Martin MariettaBoeing Lockheed Martin Palmdale. I only have equipment that emulate my predecessors. Powcon is a good one.
Reply:A thought that occurs to me if the OP is looking for a smaller inexpensive TIG welder for a hobby/light shop type machine is the Econotig or Hobart TIG 165.  If he is using this machine in a hobby or hobby+ environment those 2 would offer him a basic entry level machine capable of welding the sizes he was asking about and have A/C and D/C output.  Both of those machines are not chicom, but offer the lowest entry level costs.  There are numerous machines in the used market for 300-500 and can be had with gas and everything for about 1000.00  If he decides that TIG is for him, then he could use his experience to select the additional features that he decides he needs.  Both of  those units top out at 160 amps or thereabouts, so the thickness he desires is within reach without spending 2000.00 on a top of the line, has it all/ does it all unit. Most new users think the metal is thicker than they actually end up welding, so keeping that in mind helps to clear up what he actually plans to weld.   Just a thought from a hobby+ user with an econotig who is very happy with the results.  Not trying to start an argument, just offering another possible line of thought.  Thanks!!!BobI'm spending my Kids inheritance, I dont like him that much anyway!!!!!!Enuff tools to do the job, enough sense to use em.Anybody got a spare set of kidneys?  Trade?
Reply:Thanks 7A, I was thinking of when I bought my welder and what was then available.  If I had gotten all of the bells and whistles I would have never learned to just lay down a good solid bead.  I would have been in the weeds learning all about pulse, timers, and ramp instead of proper position, proper cleaning and most of all proper joint construction.  Sometimes it is better to start off with a little less and struggle some to really learn the basics, then progress to more powerfull, better equiped machines. Some of the really good welders here can get an econ machine to do some amazing stuff, and thats because they know how to weld and get the most out of their ability, not the advanced features.  Thats how I learned, and it seems to hold true especially when you get into TIG and advanced metals and systems.  Thanks.BobI'm spending my Kids inheritance, I dont like him that much anyway!!!!!!Enuff tools to do the job, enough sense to use em.Anybody got a spare set of kidneys?  Trade?
Reply:Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Hey, Yes Powcon is still being made down in San Diego CA. Its known now as arc-products. most Powcons are230v 460v real easy to flip the circuit board in the machine.  If your welding thin materials aluminum  .022 .035 16GE yes I would consider the ac feature on the welder.If you are welding  .100 or better I would just weld dc straight  w/helium the welds are smaller haz area is smaller. When I say or better I mean unlimited thickness. If your welding 2'' alum blocks ac you will need the flash of a nuclear bomb to get the puddle to flow with ac welding. Not to mention that you are destroying the molecular composition of the alum. I used to work for all the big contractors Raytheon Martin MariettaBoeing Lockheed Martin Palmdale. I only have equipment that emulate my predecessors. Powcon is a good one.
Reply:Showdog75,LOLWait til he buys his first bottle of Helium.He'd wish he'd spent the money on an AC capable machine.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Yes I’m a confused newbie who currently just has a Matco MIG welder and a set of Harris torches but would like to find a nice AC TIG welder to start working with some aluminum. I would like to stay away from the helium mixture and just use 100% argon gas.I’m considering an inexpensive AC/DC inverter TIG with either IGBT or MOSFET transistors but it looks like most the IGBT welders only start around 100hz to 250hz for the cheaper ones and the MOSFET units go up to 300hz. My question is would the 100hz be sufficient for welding aluminum and would the IGBT welders be consider more durable? The last 3-in-1 CAT250D TIG/MMA plasma welder exploded the relays inside and fried one of the MOSFET transistors inside after just 10-minutes of operation. Also it just seemed to melt the 6061 aluminum I was working with and only had one amperage control adjust feature.  Here are some of the welders I have been considering. WSE200P TIG200PSUPER200PINV200AC/DCTC205AC/DCEverlast PowerTig 200DXEverlast PowerTig 225LXLincoln Squarewave 175Hobart EZ TIG 165iMiller Diversion 165 HTP Invertig 201The lack of controls on the front panels of the US made machines tells me they may be more durable with less parts but do they have the same versatility as the import welders with more features? I would consider a used Syncrowave or Dynasty if the price was right but would prefer to have a more compact unit to sit on top of my MIG welder do to lack of space in my garage.
Reply:Seems to me you've already gotten good advice regarding what to buy.From your last post, you obviously haven't "learned your lesson" regarding the cheap Chinese junk.Don't worry so damned much about frequency, bells and whistles, etc, etc and buy a solid machine and learn to tig weld before you get wrapped around the axle.Half the machines you list, I wouldn't waste the ink (toner) printing the specs.You're a long way (hood time) away from being able to take advantage of the advanced features you may someday find useful.For a newbie, you'd be hard pressed to beat a used Miller Syncrowave 200.  You're not going to set it on top of your mig and you need 60A to use it to it's potential, but it's a machine that will stay with you and produce better welds than you're likely to make.It's the feaking experience, not the machine that makes great welds.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:OK,OK, If your gonna get a machine with the ac/dc capability. I would recommend the Lincoln square wave 175 They are a dime a dozen on c-list. Buy something American made. Stay away from HF and the china stuff you see on line.
Reply:Helium not to much out here, $75 bucks for a 300 cyl.
Reply:What do you guys think this local Miller Syncrowave 350 that’s single phase 220V for $800 any opinions on this machine?
Reply:thermal,What grade Helium?I'd sure like to see a receipt for a 330 of helium for $75.  Not even close to what BC (Hobart Board) who lives in CA is paying.I can't believe anything is cheaper in CA than in VA.  Of course, if helium is refined from hot air, it could be cheaper, since there's a lot of that in CA.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Much batter than any chicom and capable of any weld you will want to produce.  Some like it better than others, but a good solid machine from a US manufacturer with all or most of the advanced features.  Now like sundown and the others have said, you gotta get seat time and weld your brains out for a while to get good at TIG.  There is no replacement for experience, other than more experience.BobI'm spending my Kids inheritance, I dont like him that much anyway!!!!!!Enuff tools to do the job, enough sense to use em.Anybody got a spare set of kidneys?  Trade?
Reply:Do these Miller Syncrowave 350 welders really draw that must amperage and use much electricity? The IGBT transistor units claim they are over 80% efficient and draw less than 30-amps. I’m just going to be using this at my house which is only rated at 250-amps with a single phase fuse panel and room for some more double breakers. Also do know if this is a pulse or inverter machine or just an AC/DC TIG?Last edited by X83; 07-14-2010 at 03:46 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by Showdog75I'm gonna assume this guy is a newbie[not a bad thing , we all were newbies at one time] since he's on a welding forum asking what machine to buy for welding aluminum. Your gonna confuse him with such advice. DC-- aluminum welding isn't for beginning aluminum welders. DC-- aluminum tig has alot of limitations.
Reply:Sundown, hospital gradeX83, test befor you buy. *800 bucks  thats a very good deal.
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIII... Of course, if helium is refined from hot air, it could be cheaper, since there's a lot of that in CA.
Reply:Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Now is the best time to learn dc Aluminum. If you know how to lay a good bead with steelJust transfer those skills to aluminum. AC welding if you have no one to lead you correctly you are gonna be there a long time trying to get it. What limitations are you referring to? lets see the travel is way faster less heat and can dissolve larger cut length rods for a faster fill in groove joints.New-by or not the immersions process is always going to produce a smarter more efficient welder.Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Now is the best time to learn dc Aluminum. If you know how to lay a good bead with steelJust transfer those skills to aluminum. AC welding if you have no one to lead you correctly you are gonna be there a long time trying to get it. What limitations are you referring to? lets see the travel is way faster less heat and can dissolve larger cut length rods for a faster fill in groove joints.New-by or not the immersions process is always going to produce a smarter more efficient welder.
Reply:Originally Posted by X83What do you guys think this local Miller Syncrowave 350 that’s single phase 220V for $800 any opinions on this machine?
Reply:Thermal,What the hell is "hospital grade" helium.Helium is graded by purity.  The higher the percentage pure, the higher the cost.Is "hospital grade" helium like "hospital grade" oxygen.  In other words "not pure".Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Sundown, last I heard of hospital grade it was 99.95% pure I think.  Welding grade is 99.995%?Have we all gone mad?
Reply:No, Meaning it is clean enough for gas welding> IE pure, untainted, its a metaphor. I might have to help you out with your (special situation). Man you need help.
Reply:Whats up sn0border did sundown take you under his wing? Ha Ha Ha
Reply:Originally Posted by thermalfusioneng.Whats up sn0border did sundown take you under his wing? Ha Ha Ha
Reply:X83,Take your time in buying your machine.  If you rush into things you maybe out of even more money, especially since you don't even know how to test a machine.  Take the time to learn and understand what the features on these machines do. On a earlier post you were worried about hz and whether 100 hz was enough, but the machine your looking at runs at 60hz. Maybe if you post your location perhaps there might be a chance that some can let you try a machine.
Reply:While it doesn't provide the finesse and fine controls on the AC,  I've been really happy with my Miller Diversion 180 rig. Out of the door with everything but the bottle of argon for $1,700 new. Works on 115 and 230VAC as well, only sinks 20A. So as long as you're topping out at 3/16" material its good for the FNG in my opinion.
Reply:Originally Posted by FormulaXFDWhile it doesn't provide the finesse and fine controls on the AC,  I've been really happy with my Miller Diversion 180 rig. Out of the door with everything but the bottle of argon for $1,700 new. Works on 115 and 230VAC as well, only sinks 20A. So as long as you're topping out at 3/16" material its good for the FNG in my opinion.