Tig torch movement.

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Just a quick question, when you guys tig weld, do you keep the torch still or move it back/forth or in a circular motion?My friend wanted to play with my setup tonight and he started with no rod, then he started to do small circles with the torch and no filler and got some really nice )))))))) and then used filler and got some good welds. I'll get the pics from him later.But everything seemed to look more proper with doing circular motions. Just want to know if this is good practice or bad.ThanksTorchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:The only downside to something like that is you're going to start increasing the HAZ, slightly. With that said, I doubt that in 99.9% of situations that it would have any measurable ill effects on the weld.Everyone has their own methods; right, wrong or indifferent.Have we all gone mad?
Reply:Originally Posted by GambleJust a quick question, when you guys tig weld, do you keep the torch still or move it back/forth or in a circular motion?My friend wanted to play with my setup tonight and he started with no rod, then he started to do small circles with the torch and no filler and got some really nice )))))))) and then used filler and got some good welds. I'll get the pics from him later.But everything seemed to look more proper with doing circular motions. Just want to know if this is good practice or bad.Thanks
Reply:Walking the cup is good on deep bevels and inside corners.On thin sheet, or outside corners, you want to replicate something like that motion, but with the cup in the air.  Like a curvy zigzag works best for me.  You don't need to make full circles, or pass back over the puddle, just heat its leading edge and both sides.Find a good place to rest your forearm.  It really helps with stability.
Reply:It is usually only done when welding thin sections without fill rod to help maintain a uniformweld bead, especially if you are not using a remote control. If you lay down a bead using filler and are not happy with its appearance, you can wash over it using this technique to smoothen out the profile.Under normal circumstances it would be unnecessary, and would create a wider weld than what is required.
Reply:Good stuff thank you guys.Anyone have a how to on walking the cup? Do you do this with or without filler?Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:Circles are not needed and, as said, will only serve to increase the HAZ .The only time I would do circles would be if I were welding with no place to rest my hand or arm (and walking the cup was not possible), as it helps you to keep steady and stops your arm cramping up. Obviously everyone has their own style of welding, but when welding in certain positions on thin material with filler a bit of "zig zag" can help to flatten the weld profile, and without filler it can give you a nice uniform weld. Walking the cup can also be used on thin material, especially hygenic tube, but you need to walk very fast. With regards to cup walking, I would learn to freehand properly first as it'll make you a more versitile welder in the long run.
Reply:I keep the torch still but i slide my arm with the torch and pull to my right. But i keep my angle all the same when I pull.
Reply:Thanks guys. Off topic question, how do you guys get the color when welding? Like you see on manifolds and such. Is that from gas or heat?Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:Color is caused by oxidation of hot metal.  It's not actually good thing.
Reply:So what is the best color to shoot for?The guy that does my welding told me that mine are gray and weak and I want more of a silver color.Silver and gray are the same to me.Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:They're quite different.A dull grey color is bad.  Shiny is what you want.  Ideally shiny and silver like a polished mirror.Less than ideal, but still possibly acceptable is shiny, but with some tint (like you were describing).Now why are you getting a dull grey?  Well, pictures would help, but possibilities include a shielding gas problem (too little flow, too much flow, contamination, etc.), too little post-flow, lack of back purging (because the metal oxidizes from the back side of the weld too), overheating, and many more. . .
Reply:I'm using 15-20cu and not back purging. I'm switching between stainless and mild. Do you back purge on mild?Here are ones from last week, nothing too recent.First pic is stainless. I'm still trying to figure out how to back purge with 1 tank and I can't find any info on it. 3/32 tungsten. Red tip. 55ish amps.Keep in mind I took a wire brush to the welds after I was done. Not sure if it makes a difference, but I think it may.Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:You need to slow down, a lot. I can see that by the arrow shaped trail that is left in your bead. If you do that you should have an easier time reading the puddle and making a consistent bead, leaving nice rounded shapes each time you add filler or move forward.If you slow down, you need to be careful with your amperage as this is not something that should get overheated.No need to back purge on mild either.Have we all gone mad?
Reply:I will try some out and report back.Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer
Reply:OK, if your new to tig.... Stainless ISN'T  where you want to start learning.  It is VERY temperature  sensitive and will hurt your confidence level.......You typically back purge with a separate bottle although a lot of guys use the same bottle that they get their weld shield gas from with the use of two flow meters  and a T (there is a post showing this just recently posted)   Your welds look like your trying to hurry and maybe not a good parent metal......Brushing off the weld takes away the color and the way to see if your running too hot or not.......Get yourself some Solar B if you want to protect the back side of your stainless weld.......Gas backing is typically used on closed vessel situations and can be tricky at times depending on the place to be welded and a purge entry spot.......  Miller Dynasty 350Twenty Six HammersThree Crow BarsBig Rock
Reply:I started a new thread.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...672#post486672Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controlsHypertherm Powermax45 Esab ET220i Razorweld 195 MigRazorweld 200ac/dc TigTormach 770, Tormach xstechRazorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal Dealer