Inverter vs. Transformer TIG

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I'm looking for a solid machine to last a lifetime and I couldnt find this topic with the search function.My research has pretty much come up with the facts (or theories) that Transformer machines are workhorses that tend to last forever, but don't have the same arc stability characteristics and are big, heavy powerhogs.  Inverters are the in thing, have tons of feature, are light and portable, and work on almost all voltages.  The thing that worries me is that on multiple searches people have noted they had to replace circuit boards in them at costs upwards of $500 a board.  My choices currently are to buy a Synchrowave 200 or a Dynasty 200DX.  I will be using the machine for repairs and hobby projects.  I will not be doing any commercial work or paid jobs with the machine.Thanks for the input.  I appreciate your time.
Reply:Pretty close. Good quality inverters like the Dynasty have a pretty good track record for reliability. Issues are usually an exception rather than the rule. Thats not the case with cheaper Chicom machines however, where board issues seam to be fairly frequent. Boards can easily run over a $1000 however and often with inverters it's a cascade failure, one item taking out several others so it's seldom as easy as just replacing one board. We recently had to get a board replaced in an XMT inverter at the tech school. That board alone was over $800 plus the trouble shooting and labor. However that machine was about 7-8 years old IIRC and got abused pretty hard in it's life 5 days a week.I was in your position a few years back. The Dynasty has a lot of advantages over the Syncrowave, especially on alum. It's lighter, more portable, uses less power and the adjustability allows you to get a bit more output out of the machine at the same amps as you can with the syncrowave. The down side is it costs close to 2x as much for that portability. As much as I would have liked a Dynasty to start out with, I couldn't justify the extra cash for a machine that at that time wasn't going to make me money. I figured I could always sell the Syncrowave if I found I was being limited by the machine at a later date, and upgrade either to a larger Syncrowave/Dynasty if I needed more power, or to the Dynasty 200 if I found I needed the portability.I seriously doubt the average hobbiest would ever really notice the differences between the two, especially if you are just starting out as I was at the time. An experienced welder who was using it to make money, would probably be able to easily justify the extra expendature on the Dynasty however..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Any welder built after about 1980 has circuit boards in it.My Syncrowave 250 had a circuit board go out, it cost over $500 to replace- and I bought that machine new in about 1988.So just going with a transformer machine doesnt change much in terms of potential failures.Transformers are indeed bigger, heavier, and require bigger circuit breakers and wiring. They also usually have inferior arc characteristics.They are cheaper than inverters, however, on a straight apples to apples comparison.Old transformers can often be found very cheap, especially orphans like Aircos or P&H's or Lindes. But in comparing new machines, I think quality and longevity are going to be based more on how much you spend, not on transformer vs inverter, especially if you are looking at Lincoln and Miller machines.Buy the best you can afford.
Reply:Ok, I'll play.Being from Los Angeles and being ripped off by the Department of Water and Power every day, I can say the an inverter tig will pay for itself in power savings over the lifetime of the machine. Even more so in our "GREEN" future.That and productivity are key issues. Really an inverter tig when set up correctly will out run a transformer tig. The pulse features, balance, and programable start features are hard to beat on the Dynasty200.All tigs fail at some point. At least you will be set for the future with the inverter tig. On the other hand the transformer tig has a lot of copper in it and may be a gold mine.Now I am not a total Syncro hater. I just can't see buying one after knowing what the Dynasties can do.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:Originally Posted by RiesAny welder built after about 1980 has circuit boards in it.My Syncrowave 250 had a circuit board go out, it cost over $500 to replace- and I bought that machine new in about 1988.So just going with a transformer machine doesnt change much in terms of potential failures.Transformers are indeed bigger, heavier, and require bigger circuit breakers and wiring. They also usually have inferior arc characteristics.They are cheaper than inverters, however, on a straight apples to apples comparison.Old transformers can often be found very cheap, especially orphans like Aircos or P&H's or Lindes. But in comparing new machines, I think quality and longevity are going to be based more on how much you spend, not on transformer vs inverter, especially if you are looking at Lincoln and Miller machines.Buy the best you can afford.
Reply:By far the majority of welders have grown up with transformer machines and in some (maybe a lot of) instances, people are resistant to change.I really think the question should be directed at those that have used both and not just tried the inverters for a few days but really explored what they can do.I'd be very surprised that for those welders that have good experience with both transformers and inverters would ever return to a transformer machine if given the option.I like to explore the capabilities of my inverter based Tigs and even now I'll try something new and it's a "that's so cool" moment.Bear in mind that the above really only applies to AC welding there isn't really much you can do to a flat DC wave.I started with transformers, migrated to inverters and you'll have to drag me kicking and screaming to get me to go back to transformers now.Regards Andrew from Oz.
Reply:Some of us just have a little trouble spending $6000 on something that weighs 45 pounds...what are inverters made of, anyway? Balsa wood? Cotton candy?
Reply:I'll stick with the old RELIABLE A/BP 330 Miller.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterI'll stick with the old RELIABLE A/BP 330 Miller.....zap!
Reply:Something to be aware of when buying a new electronic machine that you are hoping to keep running for a long time, is whether the components on the circuit board are readily identifiable, or if they have been "obfuscated" (having their identification removed) or somehow otherwise made impossible to repair by anyone other than the manufacturer.  (I don't know if welding machine manufacturers are "potting" their circuit boards in epoxy or silicone, but this would make it impossible to reverse engineer, identify components, or repair.)If the design uses readily available components, then you (or independent electronics technician) have a fighting chance of being able to repair a damaged circuit board by troubleshooting and replacing any damaged components.If the machine uses obfuscated components (proprietary deisgn circuit boards), you will be dependent on the manufacturer or an affiliate to perform the repair, or to sell you a replacement board assembly if anything should fail.  And, it just so fits with the business model of the manufacturer who obfuscated their circuit board components, to sell the replacement boards at high prices.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterI'll stick with the old RELIABLE A/BP 330 Miller.....zap!
Reply:Originally Posted by BlauSchuhzap, is that your main machine? I'm looking into a ESAB Heliarc 252 right now for a reasonable price.... as in half less than half the cost of a good blue/red inverter. Would you recommend one of these transformer units for someone starting out?cons: heavy, power hungry. Once its at the shop and on wheel im not sure i care about the weight. Im in Mass and electric isn't exactly cheap.pros: simple proven design, mostly bullet proofI could just wait and keep my eyes out for a blue/red tig to hit the market locally, but i figured i could probably get my money back for the ESAB at some point
Reply:I was in the same boat and went with the inverter (HTP 201).  I am a renter and didn't want to have to install service for the transformer machine.  If I remember correctly, the Syncrowave 200 requires a 50-60 amp service.  I run the 201 off of a dryer outlet at max amps.  The cost of running electrical service weighed in on my decision.