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Hello fellas, this will be pics of the 2002 Kenworth T-800B Winch Tractor that I built and drove a few years back to illustrate how some of the winch and winchless tractors are rigged up here in Alberta for equipment hauling.Many of you will notice the puckboard fenders over the drive tires - I used to have nice checkerplate aluminum fenders but I tore them all to crap climbing log decks trying to turn around in the cutblock - Equipment operators NEVER leave enough room for anything larger than a pick up. lolAlso on the ramps you will see a white chalk line showing where I was going to cut down the ramp profile even further, but ended up selling the truck off before I had a chance to.These are BIG pictures and I don't have an image resizer for Windows 7 so only 2 pics per post. Hold off until I am done in probable 6 or 7 posts. Attached ImagesLast edited by Black Wolf; 04-14-2012 at 01:00 PM.Reason: SpellingLater,Jason
Reply:Showing pin-on neck rollers and air line attachments. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Air lines and power cord unhooked and out of the way. Clear shot of neck rollers and guides. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:As soon as trailer clears the 5th wheel it is on the ramps. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Down the ramps on to the ground and drive away. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Details of the mechanical removeable gooseneck and the load bearing pear rings. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Unlatching safety retainers and load bearing rings and showing neck to deck air lines before neck is removed. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Unhooking airlines and safety pin on air hook Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Backing under the neck and pinning it into 5th wheel. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:showing air operated hook still engaged into trailer deck. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Here is where my tractor was "Custom"... My 5th wheel is attached to an air released slider and I slide the 5th wheel towards the front of the tractor until the neck touches the ramps then I lock the slider.More common trucks do not have the slider and they driver has to get out and throw wooded blocks between the neck and ramps to hold the neck up as the pull away from the trailer deck. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Showing the release button for the air operated hook holding the neck to the trailer deck. This works WAY better than the old mechanical pins that would rust up and get bent. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Neck detached from trailer.To put neck back on, I would pull out the release for the air hook and then back into the trailer deck. Once the air hook latches it is pretty much the whole procedure in reverse order.All done posting pics.Thanks for waiting. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:Here is a link to a well known and reputable truck rig up shop a little South of me in Stony Plain, Alberta. They do excellent work and produce equipment that is VERY easy to use. I can only post up pics of the trucks that I myself have built or have driven for different companies.If you have any questions about the equipment on Marcep's site I will do my best to explain what it is or how it works. I am sure many of you will appreciate the Class 8 Trucks and Off-Road equipment that Marcep has designed and built.http://www.marcep.com/index.htmIf you want to see how winch tractors and bed trucks are built, I have pics from past projects through all phases bare frame to competed.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-14-2012 at 12:55 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:Some pics of winch tractor and ramps.Originally I built this truck with much steeper ramps and a live roll, but after using it with scissor necks for a while, I wasn't pleased with it and the roll was basically unused, so I redesigned the ramps into what you see here with a dead roll at the bottom.If you look closely you will see a small roller on the crossmember above the tail lights that keeps the winch line from cutting the 5th wheel.The winch in a Braden MS50T mechanical unit powered by a Chelsea 863 8-bolt PTO on the bottom of the transmission. Attached ImagesLater,Jason
Reply:thanks for the pictures. I was always intrigued by the engineering of those types of trailers when they would bring out the heavy equipment. It was an art to watch as they would piece the d12s together and the other track hoes. they made short work of ground work with equipment that large.
Reply:Why zactlee do you want to be able to remove the neck from the trailer? Probably obvious, but not to a greenhorn. ps: When you ask my wife what distracts my drving the most, she sighs and answers ~Big Lowboy Trucks~ I love to see them hauling a mighty weight down the road.Thanks for this post, very keen to see the nuts and bolts of it. A re-read several times for sure.Lincoln Power MIG 215Lincoln WeldPak 3200HDLincon ProCut 25Lincoln WeldanPower 225 AC/DCIf all else fails... buy more tools
Reply:Originally Posted by PapaLionWhy zactlee do you want to be able to remove the neck from the trailer? Probably obvious, but not to a greenhorn. ps: When you ask my wife what distracts my drving the most, she sighs and answers ~Big Lowboy Trucks~ I love to see them hauling a mighty weight down the road.Thanks for this post, very keen to see the nuts and bolts of it. A re-read several times for sure.
Reply:Interesting setups. I've not seen the no winch and no hydraulics on the neck setups before. Papa it's so you can load really large equipment safely. It loads from the front of the trailer rather than over the rear tires. I these pics the trailer is fairly level with the tops of the tires but many of these there's a rather large drop from the back platform to the middle which you don't want to take something large over.Millermatic 252XMT 304'sDynasty 280DXHypertherm PowerMax 1250Miller Trailblazer 302 EFIOptima PulserXR feeder and XR Edge gun and more athttp://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/index.htm
Reply:If i'm reading this right, you have to detach the 5th wheel,pull away from the trailer, and then re connect to detach the gooseneck? Our lowbeds use hydraulics to drop the deck to the ground and detach, without disconnecting the 5th wheel. The gooseneck has a hydraulic support that keeps it in the air as you pull away. What is the advantage to this setup? It seems like it would take twice as long to detach.
Reply:Weight, cost, and versatility are the main advantages IMO. If you haul equipment everyday, especially on a fairly 'local' level where you might disconnect a dozen times a day, you can't beat a hydraulic trailer. BUT, if I'm heading across the country with a RGN, I don't want the weight of the wet kit on the truck, or the hydraulics on the trailer; that's just that much less I can carry. And if I only detach a time or two over a week, I can handle doing it mechanically. By versatility, I meant that you can pull it with any truck. If its mechanical, you're not tied to a truck w/hydraulics.... Sometimes it seems like I rarely break the trlr down, and since its hard enough to find a 'backhaul' in many areas for a RGN, so if u can keep your weight down (and your RGN is decked) you can frequently do flat/SD loads.....
Reply:So exactly how long does this take to do without breaking a world record??...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:If you're good at operating/driving, only slightly longer than a hydraulic neck. Maybe 2-3 min each to breakdown and hookup..... Not a big deal... Just not as easy.., .. And on edit, there are a lot of situations that you can do a lot more with a hydraulic setup. With either style You can get in a real pickle on a jobsite that's not real smooth or level, the hydraulic is a LOT easier to get out of those situations, and there are some pretty neat tricks u can do with hydraulics if u have ground clearance issues....Last edited by bottlefed89; 04-14-2012 at 07:27 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by daddyWhat is the advantage to this setup? It seems like it would take twice as long to detach.
Reply:Duh! Don't need the hydraulics. Ok. Makes sense now. I'm so used to everything having pto driven wet lines that It never even crossed my mind that lots of trucks don't have them.Originally Posted by daddyWhat is the advantage to this setup? It seems like it would take twice as long to detach.
Reply:Black Wolf, I like that setup, and I REALLY like that trailer. Is that a 10' wide trailer? Did you ever have to use the winch to "help" the trailer up the ramps? I noticed the trailer had a lifting eye on the front, were the rollers an added accessory or standard? The only mechanical detach trailers I've been around here didn't have the roller setup, and you had to winch them up.
Reply:It was 10' 6" wide and I had pin on outriggers and decking that I could make the trailer over 12' wide if I had to (never did though)Yes, once in a while I did use the winch to help pick up the trailer but that usually happened in cutblocks after several layers of ice and snow and I had 2 sets of tire chains on and was pushing my trailer around with a machine on the deck. I was never a fan of taking a huge run at a trailer unless I HAD to... I was on a drilling rig move once years ago and saw a guy hit a hiboy loaded with pipe so hard that he split his 5th wheel in half. I worked really hard on NOT being rough on equipment... Especially if it was MINE. lolUnder "normal" circumstances I can pick up a 125,000lb machine with the machine still on the bottom deck. Some guys have to "cheat" and walk the machine up on the bolsters between the wheel... I never had to. A local equipment hauler has a fleet of about 10 or so power units, probably 50/50 between winch and winchless tractors, both tandem and tridrive and none of his trucks have to use winches either. Biggest difference between his fleet and my truck pictured is my air slide on the 5th wheel saving me the grief of using wooden block under the neck.The rollers were a factory option - They pin on to the trailer using the factory lugs for the mechanical flip over neck extension. I used to carry the extension flipped over on the neck, but I set it off to the side on some saw horses. No need to pack it around unless you are planning to jeep-up.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-14-2012 at 09:55 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:Thanks for the reply Jason. Different worlds for sure. Our guys can have up to a dozen moves a day when we are full tilt in the summer, and often the loads are dropped or picked in a lane with moving traffic and an impromptu flagger setup. The speed of detach may not seem like much, but it minimizes exposure to the chance of getting hit. We have an excellent safety record, and do all we can to make the job safer, a real challenge when dealing with the motoring public...Our heaviest piece is around 75,000 so we are definitely smaller scale. Very nice setup. Thanks for taking the time to show it.
Reply:You are most welcome. Thanks for taking interest in the thread and asking questions. When I pulled that lowbed as the main hauling contractor for the local Weyerhaeuser Mill most of my work was Off-Road (obviously) so traffic was not a concern. Add to that the fact that 90% of the machines I hauled were loaded/unloaded over the tails, this setup was the correct choice for my application.Have a good day.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-15-2012 at 11:57 AM.Later,Jason
Reply:Before I put this tailboard and the ramps on, I would sometimes have to track the 300 Komatsu back as far as I could on the deck without going up on the bolsters, and stretch the boom out as far as I could to get under the trailer if it was muddy, to keep from scooting the trailer or spinning out. I've only hooked up to it once since the modifications with it loaded, but it was muddy and I had no problem easing under it.I'm not a fan of having to get a run at the trailer either, as I own the stuff and really don't like to tear my equipment up. I wouldn't want to tear stuff up even if it wasn't mine anyway.
Reply:Originally Posted by Black WolfHere is a link to a well known and reputable truck rig up shop a little South of me in Stony Plain, Alberta. They do excellent work and produce equipment that is VERY easy to use. I can only post up pics of the trucks that I myself have built or have driven for different companies.If you have any questions about the equipment on Marcep's site I will do my best to explain what it is or how it works. I am sure many of you will appreciate the Class 8 Trucks and Off-Road equipment that Marcep has designed and built.http://www.marcep.com/index.htmIf you want to see how winch tractors and bed trucks are built, I have pics from past projects through all phases bare frame to competed.
Reply:Originally Posted by PapaLionWhy zactlee do you want to be able to remove the neck from the trailer? Probably obvious, but not to a greenhorn. ps: When you ask my wife what distracts my drving the most, she sighs and answers ~Big Lowboy Trucks~ I love to see them hauling a mighty weight down the road.Thanks for this post, very keen to see the nuts and bolts of it. A re-read several times for sure.
Reply:Black Wolf Have you ever tried winching other trailers. I was going to move a 29 foot van with my single axle truck. It had maybe 8 tons loaded in it. Wright wear it sat it was soft and just jacked up wear it started up 5 wheel. I hooked under trailer on both sides behind pin out wide so chains would not hangeup on 5wheel.Poured oil on 5wheel and started pulling. It would have pulled trailer apart before it went. Had to let trailer down on truck and put blocks under jacks. End up puting snach block on rear end of truck to winch it when I got under it.
Reply:Not sure I fully understand your question but when I owned and drove the Kenworth pictured in this thread I pulled the following:Tandem, Tridem and 24 wheel hiboys.Tridem and 24 wheel scissor-neck lowboys.Narrow neck Tridem Double-Drop lowboy.8 and 16 wheel jeeps under any of the above.All of these trailers had pick-up throats on them and I used the winch to lift them at one time or another.I have winched hiboys and scissor-neck lowboys (pinned flat) off the ground using the dead roll with no issues.Scissor-necks in regular lowboy position and my double drop were well on the ramps before I started taking any weight.Whenever possible, I ran the winch line through the pick-up throat and over to the side of the trailer as it saves the tail chain getting caught in the 5th wheel. It never mattered whether the trailer had rollers on it or not, as soon as it was on the ramps, it was coming with me. No issues.Hope that answered your question.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-18-2012 at 10:04 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:Even when i ran 8 runs a night breaking the neck off every time moving paving spreads i would rather have a mechanical detach than a hyd. They rule the west coast out here. I cant even think of anyone that even OWNS a hyd detach let alone someone that runs one regularly.Another thing that we simply dont have out here is axle lowbeds, Up until 2 years ago they would only allow 38K on a tridem they finally changed it to 60K on a tridem with a permit but no one bothered getting one because you can still run a 41' king pin to rear axle and be legal on all roads in CA and carry 60,000lbs on a 2 axle 16 tire group when spread out to 10' wide.I had my T-800 set up with an air release 5th wheel and air slide. With long airlines and electrical cord i could Pull up the the load/unload site, set the trailer brakes, dump the air ride on the tractor, release the 5th wheel and pull out from under the trailer just far enough to take the weight off the neck. Get out undo the links, catch pin and airlines from the neck to the trailer and pull the neck off.Even with the legal max of 126,750Lbs on 5 axles you could still easily pick the loaded wagon off the ground in lo-lo without beating the hell out of the truck or trailer.I had medium length ramps on the tractor with a pintle, 2" receiver, air/elec routed and tucked between the ramps and the only issue i ever had is if sucked the wagon in to close i would catch just the tip of the ramp on the neck rail of the Murray if i was off camber pulling it a driveway and cut hard.There are days i miss having it but when the construction economy tanked here in CA it was the first thing that had to go so i could focus on the core fab business.Last edited by Dualie; 04-19-2012 at 02:11 AM.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:I was referring to trailers that did not have a place to hook winch cable and couldnt be jacked up. |
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