Aluminum 45ft semi trailer

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I just got in a 45 foot aluminum flatbed trailer to do some repairs  on.  The customer has a small fleet of a flatbed trailers and I really want to make him happy so he brings more to me.  I would like any advice from anyone who has had experience working on these.  It is mostly cracks in the floor from the flexing that the trailer goes through.  I just want to make sure my welds don't crack like the last guys.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Show a pic of the cracked welds might help
Reply:In my experience with boats once AL has flexed enough to start cracking you will spend the rest of its days chasing them.Dynasty 200DXPassport plus w/ spoolmate 100victor 315c oxy/(act and prop)Miller digital elitemilwaukee power tools
Reply:Originally Posted by turkIn my experience with boats once AL has flexed enough to start cracking you will spend the rest of its days chasing them.
Reply:Drill out the ends of the cracks, and also grind out past the ends of the cracks. wire brush with a ss brush before welding between passes and when your done. Compressed air is your friend. Use what ever is a compatible filler metal, most likely 5356. If I get a dirty joint a trick is to pull your first pass, it wont boil and blow out so bad and it allows you to get some filler in. grind out that pass and wire brush it and push the rest. Most importantly, protect them airlines!Nothing Ever Got Done By Quitting, Never Give Up.
Reply:Is it cracked welds or cracked planks ? If its cracked planks I would check the crossmembers for cracks or broken welds. Also check for corrosion on the bottom side by the crossmember. Pictures of the cracked areas  would help a lot. Simply welding over the crack in a plank is a waste of time unless it was damage caused by loading.Miller xmt304,  Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.
Reply:You're going to start fighting a loosing battle over and over again.   Once they start to crack you just chase the cracks around.   Its usually reached its fatigue lifeVantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Yep what Dualie said. That guy with the trailers won't here of it though. He's gonna drag that trailer till it's undraggable. Just explain it to him a bit and he should be happy. Weld it and it'll crack somewhere else. Always do. Originally Posted by DualieYou're going to start fighting a loosing battle over and over again.   Once they start to crack you just chase the cracks around.   Its usually reached its fatigue life
Reply:Never, AND I MEAN NEVER, have I seen an aluminum trailer that will go the distance that a steel one will.I've often wondered if the additional payload pays for the trailer during the service life of the trailer as compared to a good old steel oneMy old Great Dane left the factory in 1982, and it's still going down the road with no issues."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I am working on the 3rd trailer from the same guy.  He knows the first one needs to be replaced.  Most of the cracks are from loading damage but the first trailer is loose everywhere & that is its biggest problem.  The dock where they deliver is too low & has steel bumpers so almost every trailer looks the same on the rear.  If he keeps paying I'll keep fixing.  I have thought about putting steel x bracing between the frame of the one that is real loose.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Well I have one of this guys trailers back in the shop this one almost lost a complete suspension and axle.  It was totally broke off on the driver side and only about 50 percent of the welds on the passenger side have not broken.  I really like people who abuse there junk then bring it to me.  At least this time he has a spare trailer and I'm able to spend the time in order to fix this one correctly.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Not trying to be the welding police but we perform annual dot inspections where I work and if this thing is that bad I would wash my hands of it.  If he gets into an accident and dot checks that thing out.  They might be knocking at your door.  There's a professional trailer shop that we send all the big jobs to and they even get to the point where the say no more. There a utility and trail king dealer    Just remember to cya
Reply:This one is mostly in good shape.  These were not very good factory welds.  I ground all the welds i could get to. The ones that I couldn't grind well I used 6011 rods. Some after welding with 6011s I plated over with gmaw.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:What am I missing here?  6011?Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelonWhat am I missing here?  6011?
Reply:Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Osweld - you don't need the work that badly.  The customer now says that he is going to sell it when he gets it back.  If he does (usually these guys don't, they continue to run it ) the work trail will lead back to you and your insurance company.  Once you work on something like this it becomes your liability.  Don't let yours and your family's future earnings be controlled by  someone who care less about proper maintenance. Think long and hard on patching his beaters without him letting you fix them properly.Charlie
Reply:If this is how he operates I don't think I would touch anything of his again.1982 miller blue star 2E ac/dcHarbor freight flux core posVictor oa
Reply:Originally Posted by osweldThe main frame beams are steel.  The same trailer is back in the shop again.  The customer said after I fix it this time he is going to sell it.  The problem it has now is all the beams & channels above the 5th wheel plate rusted through & the plate pushed up between the frame.
Reply:At least with major repairs like this one he gives me the time & money to fix it right.  I won't touch a project if I can't do what really needs to be done especially if it is a safety concern.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:I have fixed a few of those , a ton of work . I would cut the aluminum planks back far enough, stagerring the joints on 2 or 3 crossmembers. A wood deck would be easier . Get a new kingpin which you have to size for the thickness off the plate. I would use 3-8 plate for the coupler plate. Cut all the garbage out and start over. I would check over the rest of the trailer for rusted out spots before attempting this. Many times the rest of the trailer is in good shape and the coupler is rotted because crap gets in and cant get out . If you don't have a good 60 amp plasma you will want one , since that crap wont cut very well with a torch. Also you will want to raise the front up since a lot of the work will be done on a creeper seat. Good Luck.Miller xmt304,  Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.
Reply:Originally Posted by M J DI have fixed a few of those , a ton of work . I would cut the aluminum planks back far enough, stagerring the joints on 2 or 3 crossmembers. A wood deck would be easier . Get a new kingpin which you have to size for the thickness off the plate. I would use 3-8 plate for the coupler plate. Cut all the garbage out and start over. I would check over the rest of the trailer for rusted out spots before attempting this. Many times the rest of the trailer is in good shape and the coupler is rotted because crap gets in and cant get out . If you don't have a good 60 amp plasma you will want one , since that crap wont cut very well with a torch. Also you will want to raise the front up since a lot of the work will be done on a creeper seat. Good Luck.
Reply:Make sure to put extra support in line with the 2 sides of the fifth wheel. Also bending the leading edge of the plate upwards helps if the trailer was dropped low. A needle scaler works better than anything for cleaning the rust and scale off the frame.Miller xmt304,  Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.
Reply:Originally Posted by M J DMake sure to put extra support in line with the 2 sides of the fifth wheel. Also bending the leading edge of the plate upwards helps if the trailer was dropped low. A needle scaler works better than anything for cleaning the rust and scale off the frame.
Reply:Our trailer are all alu ,( reitnouer , mack , alutreck ) and the only one we have to stop work on it is the fountain half steel alf alu , we have done so far only rub rail repair to the other , no integrity Keep the picture coming pleaseI will try my best to be understoodMY DREAM GARAGEThe year the trailer was built will determine what material was probably used for the main beams.  Newer trailers, from what I understand, utilize T-1.  I'm not sure about the welding procedures on T-1.  It was one of the reasons I bought an older trailer, it's a good bet it's all A-36.Anybody know the different procedures for the newer spec main beams they're using these days?Last edited by farmersamm; 04-10-2014 at 09:32 AM.Reason: got my type of steel wrong, should be T-1"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:T-1 requires the use of high strength welding rods 100K+ psi  i have some 11018 in the oven that we used to use to patch cracks on the murray lowbed.   I even had a official WPS i think it called out for a 350+ deg pre heatLast edited by Dualie; 04-12-2014 at 02:27 AM.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:I talked to someone in the repair department at Transcraft.  He said the frame is A36 in the web & 100k in the flanges.  They recomend using E71T-11 flux core & 400 degree preheat when welding to the flanges.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Originally Posted by osweldI talked to someone in the repair department at Transcraft.  He said the frame is A36 in the web & 100k in the flanges.  They recomend using E71T-11 flux core & 400 degree preheat when welding to the flanges.
Reply:Originally Posted by DualieT-1 requires the use of high strength welding rods 100K+ psi  i have some 11018 in the oven that we used to use to patch cracks on the murray lowbed.   I even had a official WPS i think it called out for a 350+ deg pre heat
Reply:all in all T-1 isn't that big of a deal, and on the Murray lowbed it saved about 4000+ lbs compared to the A36 equivalentLast edited by Dualie; 04-15-2014 at 01:27 AM.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:I am finally ready to start rebuilding this thing.  The reason I am putting a plate over the web is because it is rusted through to the plate someone put on the outside in spots.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:I welded the plates to the frame.   I have all the braces cut for the kingpin plate.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools
Reply:Looks like you have a good start. I would add a few gussets on the leading edge where the bend is between the supports . That would help prevent the leading edge from getting hammered up when hooking and unhooking. I haven't seen that style of pin with the raised bolster before, what brand is that?Miller xmt304,  Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.
Reply:Its a Wallace Forge double spool kingpin.  The original one was a Holland.Miller XMT 304 cc/cvMiller 12RC w/ 15ft Tweco #4 GunMiller 30A SpoolgunCustom Thermal Arc TA 10/270 Generator "Thermal Star"Smith oxy/acet-propane with weld, cut & rosebud tipsAnd of course grinders, chop saws, hand tools