Non Ferrous blade on chop saw WOW!

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This last weekend I made a small headlight bracket (for my nephew's snowmobile) using 2"x1/8" aluminum. Had to make a few different cuts. Well I used my new 12" Non Ferrous blade on my Milwaukee 6180-20 abrasive saw. It cut the aluminum like butter with an almost burr free edge. Very impressive. I had originally ordered a Freud blade @ $100.00 but canceled and bought a Pioneer brand blade locally for $39.00 and glad I did. It cuts like a dream. The 12" is rated for 4500 rpm so well within 3900rpm chop saw limits. If anyone is interested it can be found here. http://www.westerntool.com/product.htm?pid=491655snoboyLast edited by snoboy; 11-07-2006 at 10:05 PM.
Reply:nice blade..when doing aluminum try some canning wax on the teeththen you'll see some aluminum fly... just apply it by hand while the blade is not spinning!!!...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:I use a worm drive skill saw with a cheapo carbide blade. Canning wax or Crisco works wonders on aluminum.Last edited by TozziWelding; 11-07-2006 at 10:41 PM.Disclaimer; "I am just an a$$hole welder, don't take it personally ."
Reply:Originally Posted by TozziWeldingI use a worm drive skill saw with a cheapo carbide blade. Canning wax or Crisco works wonders on aluminum.
Reply:I use to rip aluminum extrusion down the length on a table saw at work and every few cuts I'd apply a stick wax to the blade and the cuts came out real smooth with that wax.   They were either diamond or carbide tipped blades.
Reply:Very cool, so you just took off your chop saw wheel and installed this one?John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:Some company is making carbide tipped blades for a 7" circular saw that can cut steel.  That was an impressive one to watch.  It makes a hell of a noise, too.
Reply:I've cut 1/4" aluminum once on my tablesaw, can't remember for what. Had just the normal carbide wood cutting blade in there - was nervous as hell when the alum was about to make contact with the blade, but whaddya know, the saw just breezes through it like nothing. As an aside ever read about the guy that invented a blade brake that would stop the saw blade fast enough to prevent cutting your finger off? interesting story, he tested it many times with a hot dog before having the nerve to try his finger, which he finally did. Said it stung like hell but the thing worked. He thought he had a great idea, pitched it to the saw manufacturers, but they banded together and figured that if one of them adopted it and the others didn't, the others would get sued, so they were better off if *none* of them adopted it. So his idea went nowhere.Gotta love our lawsuit happy country  - John
Reply:Originally Posted by runchmanI've cut 1/4" aluminum once on my tablesaw, can't remember for what. Had just the normal carbide wood cutting blade in there - was nervous as hell when the alum was about to make contact with the blade, but whaddya know, the saw just breezes through it like nothing. As an aside ever read about the guy that invented a blade brake that would stop the saw blade fast enough to prevent cutting your finger off? interesting story, he tested it many times with a hot dog before having the nerve to try his finger, which he finally did. Said it stung like hell but the thing worked. He thought he had a great idea, pitched it to the saw manufacturers, but they banded together and figured that if one of them adopted it and the others didn't, the others would get sued, so they were better off if *none* of them adopted it. So his idea went nowhere.Gotta love our lawsuit happy country  - John
Reply:Probably electrical conductivity.  I remember now reading about that development and never realized that it had disappeared.  As I recall, it threw a pawl into the blade tooth.awright
Reply:Originally Posted by MicroZoneVery cool, so you just took off your chop saw wheel and installed this one?
Reply:To Runchman:See this link regarding the auto-stopping table saw--it is in production.I think I even saw it in a Sears flyer today.        http://www.muellerco.com/mueller_ind...table_saws.asp
Reply:Hey wow, I had no idea. Guess things changed since I read the original article way back when. - John
Reply:Originally Posted by snoboyYep! I too was real nervous on that first aluminum cut but I had the piece held tight in the saw's vice and eye protection on so I made the cut. My nephew and I just looked at each other and both said "like butter" at the same time.  A worthwhile $39.00 bucks
Reply:Soft thin aluminum can usually be cut OK by a standard carbide-tipped saw blade in the appropriate saw (table saw, power miter saw, handheld circular saw, etc), but the special blades made to cut non-ferrous metals will do a generally better job and usually last longer.There are now several brands of metal cutting carbide blades out there, to cut either ferrous metal or non-ferrous.  I saw the Metal-Devil ad, friend had some that he let me borrow to try out but he had dulled the blade BADLY (I finished the cuts with an abrasive wheel in the circular saw), then I picked up and bought a Freud ferrous cutting version.  Niiiiice.  Beat the pants out of using the abrasive wheel in the circular saw!  It made lots of little curled swarf and a nice clean cut edge.Before using the blade, check the specs on what the blade is rated for rpm-wise, thickness-wise, material-wise, and saw-wise.And yeah, the metal-cutting carbide blades can go south pretty quickly.  Cutting metal is a lot harder on the blade than cutting most wood is!The table-saw safety device has been around for several years now.  It uses electrical signals to tell if 'flesh' touches the blade teeth, then quickly jams a chunk of aluminum into the blade to rapidly stop the blade.  The blade may or may not be trashed, and the 'flesh' will likely get nicked or cut but not amputated or sliced totally off.
Reply:Moonrise, do you by any chance remember the model # of the Freud ferrous cutting blade? Was it a "cold cut " blade rated at say 1500rpm or was it rated for higher rpm? I personally own about 7 Freud blades and really like them. I'd bought the 14" non ferrous if I hadn't come accross this one for so cheap.
Reply:Actually the saw-stop guy has been lobbying the government like crazy trying to get his technology made mandatory on all table saws, with all the manufacturers having to buy from him, not just paying royalties for the design. And his price is a percentage of the saw's retail price. And....it destroys the blade and costs a bunch for a recharge kit should it ever operate. Cheaper than a finger, absolutely, but what about accidental misfires? Like car airbags have never gone off when they weren't needed?
Reply:Originally Posted by snoboyMoonrise, do you by any chance remember the model # of the Freud ferrous cutting blade? Was it a "cold cut " blade rated at say 1500rpm or was it rated for higher rpm? I personally own about 7 Freud blades and really like them. I'd bought the 14" non ferrous if I hadn't come accross this one for so cheap.
Reply:Originally Posted by stickActually the saw-stop guy has been lobbying the government like crazy trying to get his technology made mandatory on all table saws, with all the manufacturers having to buy from him, not just paying royalties for the design. And his price is a percentage of the saw's retail price. And....it destroys the blade and costs a bunch for a recharge kit should it ever operate. Cheaper than a finger, absolutely, but what about accidental misfires? Like car airbags have never gone off when they weren't needed?
Reply:Originally Posted by snoboyI'm all about safety too Stick but I believe we're on the same page when I say. The operator has the final responsibility of safety. A large dose of common sense will go a long way. Safety gaurds mandated by the FEDs will be a major PTA and people will just alter them ao remove them. I can tell you that my table saw and my fixed based compund miter saw have NO blade gaurds installed. I and only I use these 2 tools for prescision wood working. These 2 tools are locked out when not in use. If someone needs something cut I do the cut. Just for the record guy's I'm not new to power tools that can cut and mame,(18 yrs @ Boeing)  just new to welding for my self.snoboy
Reply:Originally Posted by MoonRiseThe Freud blade was a 7 1/4 inch cold-cut ferrous metal blade, standard triple-chip grind on the carbide teeth, blade body coated with the standard red Freud 'no-stick' coating.  The rpm rating was in the appropriate range for a standard 7 1/4 saw, IIRC.  Was ~$39 at HomeDepot.OK, you made me look it up.     Freud Diablo Steel Demon blade model DD748F, 5800 rpm MAX.http://www.freudtools.com/contractor...6_D0748F_A.jpgSince the material I was cutting was only 1/8 inch thick plate, the blade worked just fine.I generally like Freud blades as well.I don't see a Freud low-speed 14inch non-ferrous specialty blade listed on their website.
Reply:Just a couple of notesWhen cutting ally tooth speed is everything.Be wary of a "slow " tooth speed blade  that is a contradition in terms.A tungsten tip blade with a positive rake (read a sharp timber blade)  is fine for thin wall material, in fact is our prefered blade for site work.Particularly when the material is powder coated as the powder coating acts as a very good lubricate.A negative rake with a mist feed is ideal, but with out the turn over to justify the capital investment hard to justify,As far as I am aware a timber drop saw has a higher RPM, in that case a timber tungsten bade in a timber saw is safer than a "Ally " blade in a hot saw.I cut ally all day every day, be warned it can "pick  up" clamp when cutting and get into the habit of pulling bck the free length prior to your up stroke as it will prolong the life of your blade.Lube:If powder coated adjust your feed rate .In mill and less than 3mm water, metho alu cut all work well. Avoid WD40 or Inox and the like as they can affect the quality of powder coating.In mill greater than 3 mm (1/8" for the cave dewellers in the States  ) if you dont  access to mist feed clamp carefully and "feel the blade cut" dont force it. If you are cutting a lot you may feel or hear a slight drum, STOP, there is a good chance you have a build up of ally between your teeth.Let the saw stop and pull the ally vertically down ,not side ways as you willl stuff the tooth use a pair of side cutters.Depending on the number of teeth on your saw ,if this build up happens regularly snap the carbide off... sounds bad but it works.Good luck and enjoyBrett
Reply:Originally Posted by MoonRiseThe Freud blade was a 7 1/4 inch cold-cut ferrous metal blade, standard triple-chip grind on the carbide teeth, blade body coated with the standard red Freud 'no-stick' coating.  The rpm rating was in the appropriate range for a standard 7 1/4 saw, IIRC.  Was ~$39 at HomeDepot.OK, you made me look it up.     Freud Diablo Steel Demon blade model DD748F, 5800 rpm MAX.http://www.freudtools.com/contractor...6_D0748F_A.jpgSince the material I was cutting was only 1/8 inch thick plate, the blade worked just fine.I generally like Freud blades as well.I don't see a Freud low-speed 14inch non-ferrous specialty blade listed on their website.
Reply:One thing I checked on is that the Diablo Steel Demon that is rated at 5800rpm. is the 7 1/4" blade only. The 10", 12", 14"  Steel Demon blades are all rated at 1800 rpm max.
Reply:we use one like that at work on a skill saw for cutting ally sheet and a 5" one on our grinders for cutting out weld's lots of wax and care needed  the 5" caught one day through the piece across the shop and cut my knuckles still feels like theirs something in my knuckle there not a tool for the faint of heart 1 mistake and its all over we try to use grinders that have a clutch in them so we least have half a chance of getting away from it and when the blades get dull we replace with new no resharpening in our shop thats just the boss rules we had one resharpened and a tooth broke of and embedded in the blokes face shield after that when we feel there getting dull buy a new one Creative metal Creative metal FacebookBefore using a blade or wheel, ALWAYS double check the RPM rating on the tool and on the blade/wheel/attachment for compatability.  If you don't know or can't tell (worn out label, whatever), then don't use it.Using a blade rated for 1800 rpm on a saw spinning at 5000 rpm is not good.Using a grinding wheel rated for 10,000 rpm on a 13,000 rpm grinder is also not good.Using a blade made to cut wood on a piece of steel is not good.Sometimes, and only sometimes, you can use things 'off-label'.  One example is using a high tooth-count carbide-toothed blade made for wood to cut relatively thin aluminum pieces, you can usually do that with some sacrifice to the blade life.  Depending on the material thickness, orientation, and stiffness, a backer board of wood may be needed to support the aluminum during the cut.I always -try- to remember the following:Tools don't care.  Power tools make things happen FAST.  Where's it going to go WHEN it slips.