I have to vent

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I know some of you will say I am a dumba$% but here me out. Almost 2 years ago I got out of tig welding school and hooked up with an old friend. He has a 55 chevy he is turning into a high H.P street rod and planned to do it with a 110 flux core mig. I had just previously bought my new dynasty 200 and all equipment so i suggested he let me help and weld the chassis aslong as he HELPED with cost of gas and consumables. My #1 concern was for his safety and fear of that mig welder. So for the past year and a half every other weekend I have loaded up all my gear and dragged it to his house to weld on this car. He wanted to notch the roll bar tubing by hand I said no and came out of pocket for a jd2 notcher. I purchased 20' of 1 3/4" dom 10' of wich I cut and notched at work to make coupons to practice tube joints. The other 10 I delivered to his house for spare tube wich he agreed to pay me for. He wanted a custom guage mount in stainless and I could not find the filler locally and told him i could get it online but it wasn't cheap. He said I don't care order it and i will HOOK YA UP. So i did and mount is done. My problem is I haven't seen dollar one (yes you can call me stupid) in over a year and a half. My moral dillema is I can't bail and let him finish this project with a crappy welder and someone who knows nothing about the proper process. Everytime I ask about money its OH MAN I AM TIGHT THIS WEEK I"LL GET YA NEXT WEEK. I guess my big problem is I really don't want him to kill himself because he is an a$% and I bailed when I could have finished it right.
Reply:... Annnnnnd, thats what you get for trusting people.Sorry, BTDT. Its like Big Hoss says on Pawn Stars "Its not that I don't trust you, its just that I don't trust anybody". Life lesson learned, sorry it happened to you, too.[Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:Obviously he doesn't appreciate your efforts so if it were me I'd tell him to jump in the lake and move on.He has money or he wouldn't have a high Hp 55 Chevy build.
Reply:Take his motor and tell him he can have it back when he finds the money to square with you..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWTake his motor and tell him he can have it back when he finds the money to square with you.
Reply:He's obviously playing games with you, so I would politeley tell him that I need to get paid, or you can suffer the worst imaginable consequence! Getting beat up in front of your wife and kids. Thats just me thinking out loud tho. I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:I'll donate plenty of time to a buddy's project, but never money.Dynasty200DX w/coolmate1MM210MM VintageESAB miniarc161ltsLincoln AC225Victor O/A, Smith AW1ACutmaster 81IR 2475N7.5FPRage3Jancy USA1019" SBAEAD-200LE
Reply:lmao @ working for a year and a half before wanting paymentWelding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Originally Posted by MikeGyverlmao @ working for a year and a half before wanting payment
Reply:Let him finish the project himself, chalk it up as a lesson learned.
Reply:A old wise told me one time "Never lend a friend more time or money, than you are willing to give them, as the chance of ever getting it back is very slim"Miller Diversion 180Lincoln Mig Pak 5000 HDHypertherm 45Uni-Spotter Stud WelderOxy Set-up with Harris TorchMiller 30FX Arc StationMiller Elite - Hockey Canada Helmet
Reply:Originally Posted by BrianstickLet him finish the project himself, chalk it up as a lesson learned.
Reply:That's one of the good things about getting older, you get smarter.
Reply:I am thinking- all the filler is YOURS. All the work on the notches are..... YOURS. Take a bottle of oxy/ acetaline over, and take YOUR stuff back. Let him keep HIS tubing.I want you to understand; YES, you are gonna lose a friend over this. But you are gonna save money on the Christmas cards you won't have to spend for, and the postage saved will put a smile on your face.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:And yes, he did 'Hook ya up.' Hook, line, and sinker.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:just disappear from this "friend".  He'll be calling and calling and calling and looking for ya.  Just ignore everything.  Don't expect to see any money ever.  Lesson learned.  If he comes up with your money, great.  If not, you were never gonna get it anyways.
Reply:Originally Posted by Oscarjust disappear from this "friend".  He'll be calling and calling and calling and looking for ya.  Just ignore everything.  Don't expect to see any money ever.  Lesson learned.  If he comes up with your money, great.  If not, you were never gonna get it anyways.
Reply:Ya don't tell him off, just stop doing work until you can get some money out of him.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Look pal, you are a big ku*t, but a nice one seeing as you done all that work for a guy who didn't appreciate it and didn't press him for any money too hard.Go over and ask to borrow his mig welder for a quick 5 minute job, then stop calling for a while....when he comes for the mig, tell him straight he can have it back when he settles your account.Make damm sure you have an itemised account prepared of all that is owed to you so that he can see that the job has cost YOU money and he must be a man of honour.You will not have an aquaintance anymore, but you will get your score settled without having to beat him or get beaten if he's bigger than you.Sometimes you have to grasp the nettle and wise up.Are there anymore at home like you as I have an old rust bucket that needs a complete rebuild to get it on the road.......I can pay you one day when I win the lotto...LOL. Ian.
Reply:I guess I swim against the current but.....I would stop over and tell him "I'll give you xxx.xx for the title to OUR project and I'll finish it at my shop" and then you will have a nice 55 Chevy.
Reply:Originally Posted by BrianstickThat's one of the good things about getting older, you get smarter.
Reply:Originally Posted by BrianstickThat's one of the good things about getting older, you get smarter.
Reply:Originally Posted by vwguy3I guess I swim against the current but.....I would stop over and tell him "I'll give you xxx.xx for the title to OUR project and I'll finish it at my shop" and then you will have a nice 55 Chevy.
Reply:I have a friend that treated me almost exactly the same. He would just kindly put me off and I didn't really push him to hard.  after all I was enjoying working on his house.  Eventually it bothered me so much that I went to see him one night and told him I thought he was stepping on me. He asked me why and I just flat out told him all the little things that he took me for granted. He broke down and almost cried.  well He started from that day on to keep his books straight with me.  He is still a friend but Iv'e got to admit. We are never going to be as close as we once were. Mac
Reply:I like the idea of holding his mig welder ransom treat him how he's treating you !i am kind of guilty of offering my services and before you now it your in to deep ! but i am learning  " comes with age right "on the flip side of that when ever i ask a friend to do something that is work involved i  always ask the price upfront and I NEVER !I REPEAT NEVER try to beat them down on the price if it's to much i just wait or get someone else to do it  . because i have found if anything ever goes wrong there is no finger pointing or  resentment  and none of " i 'm not making any money on this anyways stuff " keep things square ! i don't know what you guys call it but i call it having integrity . most people don't know what that is .. chrisOriginally Posted by RojodiabloI am thinking- all the filler is YOURS. All the work on the notches are..... YOURS. Take a bottle of oxy/ acetaline over, and take YOUR stuff back. Let him keep HIS tubing.I want you to understand; YES, you are gonna lose a friend over this. But you are gonna save money on the Christmas cards you won't have to spend for, and the postage saved will put a smile on your face.
Reply:It sounds very much like a one way friendship to me. He's playing you like an old fiddle. Walk away now, He seems to have money for everything but you.Life is all about priorities and choices,And he chooses not to not to pay up,You are not asking for wages, just the money you have spent on his project!!!Lincoln SP-170 MigHypertherm powermax 45Lorch T220 AC/DC TigButters FM 215 synergic MigKemppi 180 adaptive mig RULES ARE FOR THE OBEDIENCE OF FOOLS AND THE  GUIDANCE OF WISE MEN.
Reply:THANK YOU everyone for your input it is very much appreciated. I now don't feel like such a (insert your word  here) for just walking away from HIS project. Again thanks for the supporting words.
Reply:Any pics of the car?I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Originally Posted by Tool MakerI have a friend that treated me almost exactly the same. He would just kindly put me off and I didn't really push him to hard.  after all I was enjoying working on his house.  Eventually it bothered me so much that I went to see him one night and told him I thought he was stepping on me. He asked me why and I just flat out told him all the little things that he took me for granted. He broke down and almost cried.  well He started from that day on to keep his books straight with me.  He is still a friend but Iv'e got to admit. We are never going to be as close as we once were. Mac
Reply:I used to have a couple friends like that.  I don't any more.I like the idea of reclaiming your materials with a gas axe.  I've offered to do that once and the money showed up immediately.  If you make the threat, you have to be ready to follow through.Buying the project ain't a bad idea either if he really is having money problems.  Just make sure you aren't paying for your own work.My name's not Jim....
Reply:I USED to have a friend that asked me to paint his boat. I've been painting cars, trucks, boats and everything in between for about 22 years. I just finished resoring my old boat and he asked me to do his.The deal was he would help out and pay for materials and the rest would be settled however. I wasn't worried about it.I did about 99% of the work while he stood around in my garage drinking my beer.The boat turned out great and he took it home.Six months later there was no money coming from him. Yet he showed up at my place in a new car and went on vacation to Asia.I called him when he got back and told him my boat had motor issues and asked if I could borrow his for my family vacation.He said yah and I picked it up and locked it in my garage.After about a week he called and said he noticed that we hadn't gone on vacation but his boat was nowhere to be seen.I said ya, funny that but his money was nowhere to be seen also.He paid me to get it back and tried to remain friends with me but that was it for me.I will not let anyone take advantage of me.You get what you put in and people get what they deserve...
Reply:tig d, I've been a contractor for about 40 years and a 'little' and have done deals with friends, strangers and enemies both with and without contracts.I've seen good deals with extensive contracts go south, and poor deals between people who were hard to respect go clean as a whistle, and pretty much everything in between.I built one quarter million dollar boat on a hand shake where we both held up our ends and are friends after three decades, but then I recall getting burned by one 'close friend' who had a written contract and drawings with payment schedules.My opinion is that if you work a deal, you're the one who's responsible to make sure its all out there at the beginning.  If you don't then you're the one who will regret it and have little to claim when things go south.So I'd leave this guys' project totally alone, I'd go on with your life and let it go.   Just like the saying, "good money after bad" - so I'd advise you to stop wasting your good time.Let it go, you failed to get an unreliable person to a firm deal- just don't do it again.  From now on, whatever in your life requires an agreement- get one.  Agreements out front need to be written and if you don't then you'll continue to 'work on learning' this lesson.Just like a pipe test, you don't always bust that test the first time, but if you keep working on it- you'll get it.  This is no different, its just a question of your learning.He ain't chang'n, but you can.cheers,Kevin Morin
Reply:Friendship is but another name for an alliance with the follies and the misfortunes of others. Our own share of miseries is sufficient: why enter then as volunteers into those of another?--Thomas Jefferson
Reply:Your concern for his safety will be rewarded.  Every time I get "taken", I usually get "taken care of" down the road in one way or another, so look at it that way."Never mistake education for intelligence."AIRCO Oxy/AccMiller Thunderbolt
Reply:This reminds me of a situation many years ago when I was a teenager and helped a "mate" with an engine conversion, I did all the fab work, custom engine mounts, recessed the fire wall bla bla, then helped him prep it for paint.The deal was once finished we would just go cruisin for a few days. Once I was no longer needed my " mate" he never came round again and I never even sat in the finished project. Lesson learned about for working for free for " mates" Plenty of guys want me to build stuff for them until I mention $$ which saves me a lot of work for no return.Cheers Andrew
Reply:a lot of this depends on weather this is a real friend or not... it sounds to me like he was, and it also sounds to me like you really cared about both him and the project in the beginning, it also sounds like now, even though he was a real friend, his actions and disregard for you and your efforts has kind of really turned you off, almost like getting stabbed in the back, I mean for all you have done, the LEAST he could have done is at least pay you for your expenses...the problem is, sometimes you don't really get to see what someone is made off until you wind up doing dealings like this... then you get to really see the kind of person your dealing with, and here it seems that this guy is not the friend you thought he was...I'd say to sit him down and explain how you feel about this and make it clear that you started out on this project because you really cared about both  him and his car, but now that he's screwing you and stabbing you in the back here it just doesn't sit right with you at all... lay it out there and see what ou get, I wouldn't feel bad turning my back on someone who was screwing me even if they are a friend, because at that point they really aren't.... that being said I have many times winded up loosing when dealing with friends, it's almost always a losing proposition dealing with friends and family...theres an old saying which should apply here, "with friends like you I sure don't need any enemy's" ... been there done that...miller 330a bp TIGmiller dynasty 200DX TIGmillermatic 185 MIGthermal dynamics cutmaster 101 plasma cuttersnap-on YA5550 plasma cutterhypertherm powermax 30 plasma cutterbaileigh CS225 cold sawetc....
Reply:I think next time I'd show up with a box of blue.  Not a Dynasty, but some Miller Light or whatever comes in a blue case.  Watch him for a while and call for a ride home.An old neighbor and high school friend got a 40's truck from his brother before he died.  The stipulation was he would continue the restoration.  My friend is still reeling about how expensive it is, and he himself had fixed up a '55 Chevy back in the day."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Originally Posted by turbocad6Editedtheres an old saying which should apply here, "with friends like you I sure don't need any enemy's" ... been there done that...
Reply:I guess you forgot one of the most important sayings..."In God we trust..All others pay cash"...1/2 down the other 1/2 when done....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:I appreciate that you had some concern over an ol' bud fixin' to build his hot-rod with a 110v hot glue gun... But I was younger once & also get a sense you were also showin' off some of that nice Dynasty "TIG bling" too. I used to quit showin' off when the beer ran out usually, & then sometimes had to apologize.Your pal is a stone d!ck for not getting those materials to put in his buggy. The notcher, well you want that anyway so no real biggie.As you age and get scarred up some it gets easier to avoid the pecker swinging contests & showin' off for the old school buddys. I never trade work for money with friends, it's either beer, favors, or gift - that's it, no exceptions. That means I'm never gonna be doing a long project & end up with drama & heartbreak - the money can burn if I have to get it from my friends.tig dummy, to some extent we've all been there or just haven't got there yet, but you aren't alone and maybe more normal than you think. Work it out, or don't & go on to something else.I just looked at what I typed & am wondering if I somehow got possessed by SDIII????Good luck MattLast edited by Matt_Maguire; 09-21-2012 at 11:05 PM.
Reply:Hey, tig dummy, so what ya gonna do? Or have u done it already?Ranger 305gMillermatic 140 AutosetDewalt Chopsaw2 grindersMy Fists
Reply:Nothing will screw up the satisfaction of giving any quicker than an expectation of a return."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Tig Dummy,You are paying for one of his toys.  It's about time he helped you pay for one of yours."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:I'm in the tell him straight up camp.  You didn't want him getting hurt, so you've been nice for a loooong time.  He will likely agree you have been good to him.  Agree to come back in a week.  Return with a torch.  If the money isn't there, I'd cut out every piece you worked on or paid for, if for no other reason than because you don't want any of your work or materials associated with that car if he goes forward with his 115 flux core someone else gets killed. Just sayin.
Reply:Thank you everyone for the support. I was going to have THE TALK before I posted this. I had no idea this thread would go soo far. 2 days before I was going to corner him for THE TALK he got fired from his job and is now in danger of being evicted from the house he and his daughter rent. He has made mutiple calls to borrow money wich I HONESTLY don't have so here we are.
Reply:Time for him to sell the 'project'. Its a luxury, not a necessity. Maybe he will give u some money. I doubt it though.Ranger 305gMillermatic 140 AutosetDewalt Chopsaw2 grindersMy Fists
Reply:Snivel?Diplomacy?Small claims?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanic's_lien Be glad he ain't family.City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:well if you want the car, offer to buy it to help him out of his situation, otherwise, run like hell.  He might want to pay you, but he obviously does not know how to handle his finances, and een if he ever does have any, you think it will last long enough to trickle down to you?miller syncrowave 250hobart handler 140home made 400 amp engine driven in progress...
Reply:sounds like you ain't gonna see **** from this guy, offering to buy the car will prolly be a loosing proposition too because if he thinks you have the $$ to buy the car then you should also have the $$ to lend him...cut your losses and chalk it up to experience... experience like this will ALWAYS cost you and you will allways come out of it for the better in lesson learned... at least you learned this lesson in a way that won't really hurt you so much... just move on and remember that for the most part, people only really care about themselves, they only "care" about you when it's good for them to do so...  as long as you actually learn something here then it's not a total waste.... most valuable lessons in life wind up costing you in one way or the other... could have def been worse...miller 330a bp TIGmiller dynasty 200DX TIGmillermatic 185 MIGthermal dynamics cutmaster 101 plasma cuttersnap-on YA5550 plasma cutterhypertherm powermax 30 plasma cutterbaileigh CS225 cold sawetc....