Cold Saw ?

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I currently have my horizontal band saw running about 20 hours a week or more. I have about had it with this saw and brought in one of the local sales reps from a machinery dealer. He looked at my operation and determined that I needed a cold saw. semi automatic (down feed).  I want to know if any of you are running a cold saw in a production shop ?  I do a lot of mitered cutting bundles of cold rolled and tubing of various wall thickness's and need a saw that will not let me down. Any thoughts ?Dan.Repair Specialties LLC
Reply:They are definately faster and a little cleaner cut. The price is much higher but if you're doing alot of material, no worries.John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:I have very little experience with one but have seen them work. I don't know what you have for a bandsaw but I wood think upgrading to a better bandsaw would be better for the difference in money. The coldsaw I seen was a 50 rpm cooled blade saw and did a great job and seem to cut a little faster than a bandsaw. It did however require more attention than the bandsaw and if the bandsaw had the lubricated blade like mine, blade life didn't seem to be allot different. I one thing I found about the coldsaw, it would cut as big a material as mine bandsaw. I guess in closing you would need to compare the prices, operating costs, and material size needs and then decide what you want. Good luck with your decision and pass along what you do and how you like it.Miller DVI2Lincoln Precision Tig 225Thermodynamics Cutmaster 38Everything else needed.
Reply:Cold saws are nice for precise angular cuts.  If you force the feed rate you will get chatter or damage to the blade.  A large bandsaw that can cut angles might be a better choice.   From my experience cold saws are not faster and in many cases slower that a large band saw.  You have to choose a much larger horizontal bandsaw to get a quality cut.   The ultimate choice would be a vertical cutting power feed (hydraulic) band saw.  I don't know what they cost in the US but up here in Canada you have to approach 40,000 dollars.  The head of the bandsaw tilts to the required angle.
Reply:In our shop we use 2 horizonal bandsaw for production work.   We use 2 CNC saws to cut the straights then we have to bevel them.  Cold saws are nice but I think a band saw would be the cheaper way to go in the long run.DewayneDixieland WeldingMM350PLincoln 100Some torchesOther misc. tools
Reply:Thanks guys,    My local dealer again reminded me that he was the expert and a cold saw was what I needed. But I still wonder. I like to cut bundles and I sweat the cold saw wont work for me. It would have to cut a heck of a lot faster then a band saw to make it worth standing over it, when I can stuff a stack in a band saw and go to welding while it works for me.  I am planning to spend less then $10,000 (hopefully less then $8000) on a saw and think I can get a pretty reliable mitering band saw for that. Any reconmendations on brands ? There are a lot to choose from, I need hands on advice.Dan.Repair Specialties LLC
Reply:In one shop I worked in years ago they had two men working continuously on handrailing.  They had one hand operated cold saw and one with power feed that they could set up and walk away from.  Both took blades around 12 inches diameter.  The fancy machine was set up with carbide tipped blades which were more expensive but would last for over a month of use.   Large bundles of pipe and tube over a foot across were square cut outside on the vertical bandsaw in the saw shack.  That vertical bandsaw was primarily used for structural beams.   I like colds saws myself.   Your salesman should be able to give you some information on just how long it will take to cut say two inch square tubing quarter wall.  You can then compare times.  You might ask for a sales reference or two from satisfied customers.  Cutting times are not so important if you can leave the machine to cut and you are a smaller operation.  Setting up your saw correctly makes a great difference.  You should be able to load the roll case directly from your rack of tubing, push your tube into position for the cut and have lots of room to support the end cuts on another roll case.
Reply:Thanks LotechI just realized my bandsaw is ste up 180 degree in the wrong position.  Never really gave any thought to the increased efficiency of going from the rack to the feed table.  I go through the saw vice to the feed side.  oh well.  I guess i'll have to flip it.
Reply:I have been running a cold saw in my shop for 15 years or so now. I also have two bandsaws- a 4x6 and a 7x12.My cold saw is manual, not auto.They both have their good points and bad points.Sometimes I cut bundles in my bandsaws- but I find its pretty fussy- stuff moves, the blade breaks more and gets dull quicker because of the gaps and starts and stops.Usually when I have a bunch of pieces to cut, especially miters, I prefer to use the cold saw, and cut pieces one at a time.My cold saw is MUCH faster cutting than my bandsaws- but you have to stand there and pull the handle down each time. But its still faster to have a guy cut a hundred pieces. My saw is set up built right into my stock rack- I load 20 footers, and slide them onto the saw table. On the left, I have a stop system I built, copied from a Biesemeyer stop for a woodcutting chop saw- It goes to 11 feet, so I can get any sized piece from a 20 footer. You slide the steel hover, hit the quick clamp lever on the vise, and chop. Repeat as needed.My saw is a Haberle, made in Germany, weighs 500lbs without the stand, 3 1/2hp and runs at 44 rpm. Blades are HSS steel, no carbide, Resharpenable, mine last a long time between sharpenings. Full time flood coolant- I use a water soluble, it doesnt affect welds and is easy to clean off. Now if you buy a full auto cold saw, you can just load 20's and let it cut em. You probably would only cut one at a time- not a bundle- but if the saw is advancing the part, who cares? Its still working on its own, and only needs loading when its done with a whole 20 footer.The smaller, 12" cold saws, are really best up to about 2" material. 3" in pipe or tubing. I cut solid 2" square sometimes, but its slow- takes a minute or two per cut. Whereas small stuff- 1" sq tube, or 1/2" square, or 1/4" flat bar- its pretty much instant.Cold saws leave nice edges, and are quiet, no sparks, and nice to use.Depending on the size of the stuff you are cutting, it sounds like a cold saw would work well. A full auto bandsaw would be another option- but the cost is about the same- upwards of 10 grand. A decent big Amada (japanese made, pretty much the gold standard in auto bandsaws) will run you close to 30K.You might consider checking with the Jet Surplus store- they just sold a couple of Wilton full auto cold saws pretty cheap- Wiltons are actually MEP brand, made in Italy, a good brand of cold saw. They said they expect some more of em soon.http://www.equipmentsalesandsurplus.com/Is the Jet Surplus Dealer, in Auburn Wash.Here is a shot of my cold saw, showing the stock rack and cutoff stop.
Reply:Well I had a salesman bring me in a demo coldsaw to try once when I was looking for a saw, and personally I don't have a large operation.  I found out that even though the Cold saws may cut faster, I was better served by being able to start the saw and leave to work on other things. especially if cutting a bundle for multiple pieces.  however the saw I used was not able to cut bundles as large as my bandsaw, and that helped make part of my decision.  I will throw this in.  Not sure how your salesman are there, but around my neck of the woods, They often remind you they are the expert only to push what makes them the most money instead of what you really need.  Good luck in your decision.  ~JacksonI'm a Lover, Fighter, Wild horse Rider, and a pretty good welding man......
Reply:Well I really do appreciate the input.     To sum up the size of my operation-its me, myself, and I when it comes down to it.I have couple of less then productive part time helpers which is why I need to speed up my process without adding man hours. I am flooded with work,lots of ones and twos, but about 40 hours a week worth of short run weld jobs, 30 to 50 parts at a time. I can employ a guy 20 hours week just sawing, but the reality is, I can get nearly the same cut myself while i weld if I had a better saw. Saving me nearly $1000 a month in labor, labor money that would be better spent on adding another man welding. I need to be able to cut for an hour in the morning and have finished product out the door that same night. Right now it takes as long to cut as it does to weld. I mostly cut smaller stuff, under 2". generally it will be either square tube .120" wall-.250 wall. Or cold rolled solid rounds of 3/8" to 3/4". Right now I cut 10 pieces of 1/2 cold rolled at a time, each cut takes about a minute-then i need to deburr.   hope to hear more advice.Dan.Repair Specialties LLC
Reply:With the cold saw you're going to save time by the speed of the cuts and it will eliminate the extra time you spend deburring.John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com