Lincoln SA series:

admin

Would somebody mind spending a couple minutes splaining to me what the difference is in the Lincoln "SA" series is? I see "Red Face", "Blackface", "Long Hood", "Short Hood", and various other names seemingly applied, but I've never been around any of them myself. Seen plenty in years gone past towed behind, or mounted on trucks and trailers. I'd just like to be a little more intelligent when reading posts about these machines. Thanks,SlobPurveyor of intimate unparalleled knowledge of nothing about everything.Oh yeah, also an unabashed internet "Troll" too.....
Reply:First picture, Short hood.Second picture, Red face.Third picture, Black face / green light. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:There are a few threads on this.  Here's a one that does a decent job explaining them.  Not all 100% factual, but close enough you won't know the difference.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...-Red-Blue-face
Reply:Thanks guys, it's been a long time but I do remember seeing all three types CEP has posted through the years. Don't really know if I'll be in the market for another welder or not but one of these "Red Faces" would be one of the highly sought after models it seems.SlobPurveyor of intimate unparalleled knowledge of nothing about everything.Oh yeah, also an unabashed internet "Troll" too.....
Reply:Originally Posted by SlobDon't really know if I'll be in the market for another welder or not but one of these "Red Faces" would be one of the highly sought after models it seems.
Reply:The long protruding barrel of a Short-Hood is ideal for anchoring where it can sink to bite in a soft bottom.The large heavy copper laden round barrel of a Red-face is more suitable for anchoring over a solid or  rocky bottom, where its mass and weight can do the holding.While the Black-Face with its lighter and more buoyant aluminium windings, along with side terminals, high-mount starter, and "busy" governor linkage is more ideal for drag anchoring into weedy vegetation.Last edited by denrep; 10-10-2014 at 01:19 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPJust weld with one, one time. You'll be hooked for life!
Reply:There is nothing like pure 100% copper. My 1974 green light welds nothing like my Red face. My Red face won't stack 6010 like the Short hoods, but runs 7018 better than the Short hoods. The Short hoods have a 4-gear generator, and run at less RPM, they make it childs play to stack 6010.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPThere is nothing like pure 100% copper. My 1974 green light welds nothing like my Red face. My Red face won't stack 6010 like the Short hoods, but runs 7018 better than the Short hoods. The Short hoods have a 4-gear generator, and run at less RPM, they make it childs play to stack 6010.
Reply:I've had pretty good luck with Hobart's 335A 6011. When buying 6010, what ever brand you buy, get the Plus. Lincoln 5P-Plus. ESAB 10P-Plus. If you do buy an SA-200, be on the look out for an LN-25 too. Here is what my Red face can do with .045” NR-212, and 1/16” Hobart 21-B. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Red Face SA-200's are just plain cool.... if you get one CEP will want you to get it painted.... Last edited by JAS; 10-10-2014 at 03:09 PM.Reason: So CEP can chastise me, he's an agitator1963 SA 200 Redface, rebuilt by me, bodywork by CEP Everlast 255EXT w/W300 coolerMiller 212 AutosetMiller Xtreme 375Bridgeport MillSouth Bend 9" Lathe
Reply:Originally Posted by JASRed Face SA-200's are just plain cool.... if you get one CEP will want you to get it painted....
Reply:Yeah, yeah, yeah, JAS has already talked me into painting his SA-200. I got to get away from that kid! Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYep he's holding me at gun point. Slob go for it bud, pickins are getting slim out there. All in all I own 11 machines, and hands down my 66 redface is my most prize possession out of all my machines. It is just so dam unbelievably smoothe like no other machine. The best way I can describe the arc with 7018 is to me it's like a high amp mig that is in spray transfer, that's what the arc out of a 7018 feels like to me with these machines. So dang sweet and smoothe.
Reply:If you do get one there are some mods you can do, some guys like to put one wire alternators on, electronic idlers, and a newer style carburetor. I stuck with the R-57 vacuum idler, the original Marvel carb, and a generator. I like old school originality and it agitates some, I have been called an agitator before. By a member of this forum..1963 SA 200 Redface, rebuilt by me, bodywork by CEP Everlast 255EXT w/W300 coolerMiller 212 AutosetMiller Xtreme 375Bridgeport MillSouth Bend 9" Lathe
Reply:Yeah he is pretty mad cool, I know him now for about 4yrs, and even though he's just a internet buddy with me one of these days during my travels I'm gonna do a pop in and shake his hand in person and kick dust and cuss and talk some welding smack face to face and eat us some jelly donuts and drink some coffee and burn up some wire. Cep is mad cool and a great friend to me. He has helped me become a little more open minded about things in my choices and always for the best it worked out. Cheers ya big gorilla I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYeah he is pretty mad cool, I know him now for about 4yrs, and even though he's just a internet buddy with me one of these days during my travels I'm gonna do a pop in and shake his hand in person and kick dust and cuss and talk some welding smack face to face and eat us some jelly donuts and drink some coffee and burn up some wire. Cep is mad cool and a great friend to me. He has helped me become a little more open minded about things in my choices and always for the best it worked out. Cheers ya big gorilla
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveWhat are you going to do the second hour? By the way, I don't know why everyone says the SA-200's weld smooth - if welding with one were like driving a vehicle, then they ride like an empty dump truck vs. driving a Cadillac....
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYeah he is pretty mad cool, I know him now for about 4yrs, and even though he's just a internet buddy with me one of these days during my travels I'm gonna do a pop in and shake his hand in person and kick dust and cuss and talk some welding smack face to face and eat us some jelly donuts and drink some coffee and burn up some wire. Cep is mad cool and a great friend to me. He has helped me become a little more open minded about things in my choices and always for the best it worked out. Cheers ya big gorilla
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeWell ditch that greenlight machine and put your big boy pants on and get in the real game brother.
Reply:I ran a red face for 4 hrs straight.It welded 5/32" 8010, and 1/8" 7018 so smooth.I hope to be using more SA200s before my career is over, so I have something to compare the other models to.Copper all the way.
Reply:Originally Posted by JASI give CEP a hard time, only because I have for as long as I've known him. He's a great guy, sharp as a tack.
Reply:Ouch....1963 SA 200 Redface, rebuilt by me, bodywork by CEP Everlast 255EXT w/W300 coolerMiller 212 AutosetMiller Xtreme 375Bridgeport MillSouth Bend 9" Lathe
Reply:Originally Posted by JASCEP has forgotten more about welding and driving piles than I'll ever know, he's got some killer welding machines and a fleet of SA 200's.... And he's already dialed into your time zone weldermike
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeLoves talking welding thats's for sure. Can't get him to shut up tho once he starts. Talks so fcking much I'm surprised his tongue don't get sun burn.Originally Posted by CEPMike the sun never shines here! Haven't you heard? It always rains here.
Reply:The comments relating to CEP are not hard to realize true and appreciated from even the short time I've been around. Hell, I followed his earlier advice and made a quick buck saving a friend's hindquarters 270 miles distant from home by cutting off the mangled trailer tounge and installing a new one while laying in a gravel parking lot. I wouldn't have even attempted the job had I not received the guidance from this open hearted gent on how to weld overhead when it counted. For those interested here is the text posted on the Hobart site shortly after it's completion:I was able to use this G-258 machine quite extensively yesterday almost 250 miles distant from my location and it worked flawlessly. The knowledge of how the vacuum idler system works has been most beneficial as it presented problems during operation but was easily repaired. A very good customer, (landscaper) of mine was in the Ozarks bringing back a load of decorative river rock indigenous to the area. This rock is carried in special designed tubs for offloading and handling with a forklift, or telehandler machine and stacked on the trailer when in use. I suppose through both use, and time, fatigue set in and one of the tubs let the sidewall go shifting the heavy load more forward onto the tongue bending it till almost dragging the roadway. A wrecker removed the trailer and stored it at their place of business in the lot. This is when I received a call to see if I'd be interested in trying to make a repair. This was Friday evening.Saturday morning I rounded up a heavy coupler, two six foot sections of 2X6X.25 wall tube, and some various plates to reinforce the soon to be welded butt welds. Through phone conversations to verify measurements at the trailer end of the tongue weldment, I then built up the new tongue in the shop using the G-258 which at this point was still unproven. As a backup I was planning to place my G-213 in the back of the truck in case the G-258 did not perform correctly. At this time the G-258 did actually perform flawlessly.Early Sunday morning I loaded up the Jeep foregoing the hauling of the G-213 with the tongue weldment strapped to the roof, threw some basic tools and portaband saw into the welder's tool boxes along extension cords and got on the road. Arriving at the jobsite about five hours later, we set up and I cut the existing bent tongue off the trailer cleanly with the band saw leaving six inches of "stub" to butt the new tongue against. As habit I had also thrown in the back a four ton porto power unit and was glad I did as the heat of either welding my new tongue, or the former tongue was about 1/4" off in dimension from draw. By temporary welding on a couple of anchor points for the porto power to push against, (inside the "A" of the tongue) it was easily spread to correct dimension. After getting everything tacked into place and measuring again, it was all welded solid with both 6011, and 7018. I then wrapped over the complete butt welded areas after grinding smooth with 1/4" plate about three inches distant of centerline of the butt weld. This was my first ever experience welding overhead with stick where it mattered. I learned a lot on this little job in that aspect. I then welded the tub latch mechanism back onto the tub after plating the area which had ripped loose spilling it's containment without problem. This tub had small stones in it which were shoveled back into it.During the course of this repair I noticed the welder was no longer returning to low idle after welding but remaining running at high idle against the governor. During a break I took the unit apart and found it to be carbon fouled precluding the sliding piston from operating. Everything cleaned up well and once reinstalled, the unit works better than it did originally. I adjusted it for about a two minute delay to return to low idle after the arc is extinguished.I haven't even thought about a fair price to charge for this rescue. The landscaper's family has supported my business for many, many years so it will require much more than normal thought. I may just let them figure it out.Thanks to all whom helped me understand, and supplied information relating to the idler solenoid and general operation of this welder. I do not live life "shallow as a piss puddle on a sidewalk" and want everyone to know their participation is valued. Thanks again.  Now back to the current posting: I too prefer old and original if it can be kept that way. All of my antique trucks, (it's a sickness I tell ya) have the original engines and drivelines still yet I think nothing about working them as designed. I think a nice "Red Face" with a nice semi professional refinish job would look quite nice behind my old gin pole truck I'm constructing. It too incidently still has it's 1957 engine, (Mack Diesel) and 15 speed triplex transmission.In the original post on the Hobart site, I reference 6010 rod which was in error if you've seen it over there. It was 6011 rod I used as again I've never used any 6010 which is soon to change.The landscaper referenced sent me a check for $1000.00 for this little job so maybe I can get that welder acquired before the "war department" finds out?I may be on a mission.Thanks,SlobPurveyor of intimate unparalleled knowledge of nothing about everything.Oh yeah, also an unabashed internet "Troll" too.....
Reply:Get up on it! Post some pics when you get it.1963 SA 200 Redface, rebuilt by me, bodywork by CEP Everlast 255EXT w/W300 coolerMiller 212 AutosetMiller Xtreme 375Bridgeport MillSouth Bend 9" Lathe
Reply:Well, I found out the hard way the welding supplier no longer has Saturday morning hours after driving 35 miles to get a couple boxes or tins of the 6010 ESAB rod CEP has suggested, along with another spool of L-56 wire. Guess I shouldn't be pissed cause the phone number is stored in my phone and I didn't call. I used to swap my tanks on Saturday mornings near every week and purchase consumables. I don't remember seeing any correspondence announcing the store hours change but it was prominently displayed on the front door. I then went to the shop and started into a small, older Impala wreck to finish out the day.I was wanting to get some burn time in with 6010 this weekend as the next week is going to be busy w/little play time. I tried to follow up on the SA welder and the daughter answered the phone telling me her mom is gone through next week in Florida so I'll follow up later. She did say the welder was still there but couldn't speak for it.SlobPurveyor of intimate unparalleled knowledge of nothing about everything.Oh yeah, also an unabashed internet "Troll" too.....