Frozen water

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120 years ago the wealthiest citizen built a water system. it gravity feeds from the side of the mountain on the other side of the valley. 18 years ago the Federal Government forced us to build a new water system. The low bid contractor was chosen. A 1.2 million dollar contract developed into 2.2 million. It serves fewer than 200 homes. The new main line is plastic. they placed the new main on the opposite side of the road from the old. Some drops were lengthened, others shortened. A local elected official, and a hired engineer were hired to oversee the construction. I suspect they were paid off to look the other way. Witnesses tell me my water line is 30" deep below the paved two lane town road. I have always run a trickle of water in the cellar sink. The whole family is innocent including me, it got turned off. By 5:00AM the problem was discovered. I sprang into action, changed into my leotard & cape, and set out to be a hero. Being a hero is hard work! The plan was to dig beside the curb stop, to a depth a man could stand to work on it, then hand dig to expose it. Obstacle #1 was a boulder 6' long firmly frozen to the ground. A 210000 BTU salamander, and a giant propane torch eventually shattered the rock. Four hours with jack hammer, compressor and backhoe we were past the frozen ground. as it was under 7' of snow it was only frozen to a depth of 3'. I keep a piece of 1/4" PEX air line for the purpose, it was gone. Calling around I found a rig I could borrow. The technique involves disconnecting the pipe, opening the valve, and sliding the PEX through the valve down the pipe toward the main line under the road as warm water is pushed through it by compressed air from a modified 30 LB propane cylinder.  The actual thaw took 15 minutes.The last of the clean up was at 7:00 PM. I will this weekend install a more permanent trickler to prevent the inevitable of someone turning it off. It's the first time it happened to me. I've thawed water for others many times, thought I was immune!An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.
Reply:why didnt you wrap the water line with pipe defrost cable and plug it in for winter?Of all the things I lost I miss my mind the most...I know just enough about everything to be dangerous......You cant cure stupid..only kill it...
Reply:'Tis the season.  One of my neighbors accidentally burnt a fair portion of his house down on Sunday trying to thaw a water line.  I don't have the skinny on it, but sounds like a torch in the wrong place was involved.
Reply:Originally Posted by roadkillbobbwhy didnt you wrap the water line with pipe defrost cable and plug it in for winter?
Reply:Originally Posted by tbone550'Tis the season.  One of my neighbors accidentally burnt a fair portion of his house down on Sunday trying to thaw a water line.  I don't have the skinny on it, but sounds like a torch in the wrong place was involved.
Reply:Originally Posted by Willie BSometimes it's with a welder. I've repaired a number of homes where the ground conductor to water/electrical appliances burn. They rarely are sized for welder current.Water freezes in VA?!!!
Reply:re-doing a 120 year old system that works just so a few elected and connected fat-cats can feed at the public expense? then having to fix it yourself when it breaks? that would make me want to go postal.i.u.o.e. # 15queens, ny and sunny fla
Reply:Originally Posted by Willie BWater freezes in VA?!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWTo them, deep enough in the ground to avoid frost is dug with a shovel. I'm surprised you can get away at only 30" deep there in VT. I'd have expected deeper. That's borderline for us around here. Typically they'd prefer us to be at least 36", though 30" will meet code from what I remember. too many times they put in the water lines before they final grade the lawns, and the guy on the dozer cuts a lot more down than the plumber might expect and leaves the lines shallower than they should be.You should be able to tap a cold water line with something like one of those 1/4" T kits used for ice makers and simply run the copper line down into the wash tub to drain. Only disadvantage of those is that they don't seal 100% when off, but for what you need, a few drops or a very slow trickle in the summer probably won't kill you. If that worries you, a standard 1/4" valve with a washer would work after the T.
Reply:Originally Posted by docwelderre-doing a 120 year old system that works just so a few elected and connected fat-cats can feed at the public expense? then having to fix it yourself when it breaks? that would make me want to go postal.
Reply:Originally Posted by tbone550Har-dee-har, har!  Had -2 yesterday morning and a high of 11 today with wind chills at -11.  Might be shirt-sleeves weather for you and DSW, but it's blue-cold to me!  Hate the Winter!  Summer, too for that matter.  Give me a year of Spring, a week of Summer, a year of Fall, and a week of Winter.  I'm up against the Nat'l Forest and the Allegheny Mtns though, a little cooler here than other places.  I bet avg temps this time of year here are mid-to upper-20's in the day, high teens at night.One of my lines froze at the well a few years back, found that it was 10" deep where it exited the casing!  Not cool.
Reply:Originally Posted by Willie BI keep a piece of 1/4" PEX air line for the purpose, it was gone. Calling around I found a rig I could borrow. The technique involves disconnecting the pipe, opening the valve, and sliding the PEX through the valve down the pipe toward the main line under the road as warm water is pushed through it by compressed air from a modified 30 LB propane cylinder.  The actual thaw took 15 minutes.
Reply:Not my idea. In the formative days of our society, hydraulics weren't readily available. The first excavator I ever saw was 1973, they weren't common until ten years later. Early backhoes were add ons  for fragile farm tractors. They couldn't move boulders. Those without great financial resources used wood to break rocks into sizes they could liftAn optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.
Reply:had -15 here this am. Thawing water is never fun. Sucks to get wet when its cold. Last one we did I used 1/4"od brake tube and a little electric pumpMillermatic 252millermatic 175miller 300 Thunderboltlincoln ranger 250smith torcheslots of bfh'sIf it dont fit get a bigger hammer
Reply:-37F the other morning here, our water lines are required to be at least 6' and usually closer to 10' deep if they run under any traffic lane. Last year we had close to 80 water line breaks in our small town. If I were you guys I would sue the pants off the contractor and get a licensed inspector from an independent company to inspect all the work, put together a case and get things fixed.
Reply:Originally Posted by ironmangq-37F the other morning here, our water lines are required to be at least 6' and usually closer to 10' deep if they run under any traffic lane. Last year we had close to 80 water line breaks in our small town. If I were you guys I would sue the pants off the contractor and get a licensed inspector from an independent company to inspect all the work, put together a case and get things fixed.
Reply:Originally Posted by Willie BThese corporations are run by shady characters. usually a lawyer is a principal in the corporation. They dissolve the corporation every few years and start up again under a different name. In this case there was a 110,000 surety bond supposedly protecting the town. Public officials were very defensive of this contractor, actively opposed the complaints of many local property owners, and released the bond money as early as it was legally possible. The corporation no longer exists.