Help with my confusion - tubing/pipe benders

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What is the difference between small diameter "tubing" ala brake/fuel lines on cars and larger diameter "tubing" (I think of this as pipe) such as roll bar tubing?  I ask as I just scored a nice set of tubing benders, 1/8" to 1/2".  Unfortunately, it was missing the 5/16"  As such, I wish to purchase the 5/16" "tubing" bender.  However, most of my searches turn up large diameter benders.  Am I using the wrong terminology?  What brand of small tubing benders do you folks like?  ThanksTom
Reply:They are tubing benders. You probably need to look at plumbing supplies or automotive suppliers for the smaller ones. Be aware, not all are equal. There are units designed to bend copper and alum only, and then there are units designed to do SS and steel as well as copper and alum. Here's the page from MSC that covers small tube benders.http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/GSDRVS...00000121186220Graingers, McMaster Carr, Snap-on, Mac tools would probably have ones for steel also. You may also find them at places that sell hydraulic parts like Parker or Swagelock..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:We use 2-3/8" and 2-7/8" tubing in oil wells.  Not sure why it's called 'tubing', except that it's used inside of 'pipe'.5/16" is not a common size in my experience.  Used on refrigerators.America Needs AMERICA'S Oil!!!"Global warming is the greatest scam in history ...There is no run away climate change. The impact of humans on climate is not catastrophic. Our planet is not in peril."--John Coleman, Founder of The Weather Channel
Reply:Tubing is sized by o.d. and wall thickness, Pipe up to 12"? I think, is measured by nominal size x schedule. 1 1/4" sch 40 is slightly over  1 5/8 od, and slightly over 1 3/8" i.d., sch. 80 is the same o.d.and a bit over 1 1/4" i.d.. Confusing huhh? ,,,,,Mike
Reply:tube is "thin" wall, pipe is thicker..aint sure where the line is drawn
Reply:mrmikey is right - tubing is measured O.D. x wall thickness. A roll cage for instance is usually 1 5/8" x .083". Pipe is I.D.. A 2" pipe is 2" on the inside and 2 and whatever on the outside. Very confusing. Don't waste your time trying to bend tube in a pipe bender - it will kink or end up screwy. Some have had luck packing tube with sand before bending in a pipe bender with good results and such. But do you really want to spill a ton of sand all over and deal with something that might not work for you? And pipe in a tubing bender - you will put a hurting on the dies. (pricey). Pipe = cheap / pipe benders = cheap. Tubing = pricey / tubing benders = pricey. Relatively speaking. Tubing and pipe can come in all sizes. I have seen 4" chromoly tube with 3" wall thickness. It is still tube even though it is huge. Have never seen a 4" pipe with a 3" wall? You may have - but it's tube not pipe! Got it?Just another clown trying to be cool
Reply:jinkzd,Maybe you'd like to explain to me how a 4" tube can have a 3" wall.Last time I checked, tube had walls on "both sides".Wouldn't a tube, to have 3" walls, need to be at least 6".  Course, then, if it was six inches, it wouldn't be a tube at all.  It would be a rod.You see the darndest things "On The Internet".Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:You guys sure went on a Tangent-DSW answered the question in the 2nd Post - the question was about finding SMALL tube benders/Dies for SMALL tubing.How in the heck y'all got in to 12" Pipe and 3" Side wall TubingEd Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Originally Posted by Broccoli1You guys sure went on a Tangent-DSW answered the question in the 2nd Post - the question was about finding SMALL tube benders/Dies for SMALL tubing.How in the heck y'all got in to 12" Pipe and 3" Side wall Tubing
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIIIYou see the darndest things "On The Internet".
Reply:Well Sundown, if you understood what was posted about tubing you would realize that TUBING IS OD! A 4" TUBE WITH A 3" WALL WOULD BE 4" AROUND AND HAVE A 1" OPENING IN IT. Next time read and understand before replying! The question was asked about tube and pipe differences. Size is irrelevant. A 502 big block chevy works the same way as a 120 cubic inch engine. Right? Same with tube and pipe, classification is based on certain parameters.Just another clown trying to be cool
Reply:Originally Posted by jinkzdWell Sundown, if you understood what was posted about tubing you would realize that TUBING IS OD! A 4" TUBE WITH A 3" WALL WOULD BE 4" AROUND AND HAVE A 1" OPENING IN IT. Next time read and understand before replying! .
Reply:Geeesh guys, calm down a bit, no sense in anyone getting their panties in a knot. Jinkzd, when referring to wall thickness only the wall of one side is stated not the  total, that's why SundownIII was questioning your statementHow in the heck y'all got in to 12" Pipe and 3" Side wall Tubing
Reply:Well Mr. jinkzd,Now that you've established yourself as our resident expert on tube....     NOTLMAOWhy don't you call your local metal supplier and tell him you need a stick of 4" tube with a 3" wall thickness.  I'm sure he could use a good laugh too, being as it's the holidays and all.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Gang  Thanks for the replies.   I appreciate you all trying to "edumacate" a noob.  Please though, let's not get in each other's electronic faces.  One of the things I like about this board is the civility, as compared to some other boards that seem to specialize in regular flame fests.    At any rate, my application is automotive tubing, brake and fuel lines, hence my question about "tubing benders."   Typing in tubing bender on ebay or search engines turns up a mixture of small benders and roll bar (for lack of a better term) benders.  I just wondered if I was using the wrong terminology.    The kit I bought off Craigs List are all Imperial Eastman benders.  They seem like nice pieces.  If nothing else, I will try to get the 5/16" unit from them.  TomPS With input from Welding Web (I lurk more than I post) and time at the Mig trigger, I tell folks that I am no longer a "booger welder" and now a beginner.  Thanks again.
Reply:mavman4,Given your situation, I would also try to find an exact replacement, so as your set remains intact.You've already been given several options for places where you may get the item you need.  I would add, believe it or not, that Sears also has some good options for the tubing you're talking about.This whole thread sorta got beyond the scope of the question you asked.  Basically, what those in the know are saying that tubing is measured by it's outside diameter and wall thickness, whereas pipe is generally sold by inside diameter and schedule.  Schedule determines the thickness of the wall.  Lot of other factors (seamless, etc), but that's the basic difference.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:PS.Just hate having someone try to blow smoke up my butt.Even worse when they try to pack sand in the same place.It'd be one thing if they had a clue what they're talking about.  Since they don't, it's even worse.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:i think you if the problem presists you better call metal supplier and tell him you need a stick of 4" tube with a 3" wall thickness........ its goona may be solve your problem ...steel bar steel supplier
Reply:[QUOTE=jinkzd;345742]mrmikey is right - tubing is measured O.D. x wall thickness. A roll cage for instance is usually 1 5/8" x .083". Pipe is I.D.. A 2" pipe is 2" on the inside and 2 and whatever on the outside. Very confusing. Don't waste your time trying to bend tube in a pipe bender - it will kink or end up screwy. Some have had luck packing tube with sand before bending in a pipe bender with good results and such. But do you really want to spill a ton of sand all over and deal with something that might not work for you? And pipe in a tubing bender - you will put a hurting on the dies. (pricey). Pipe = cheap / pipe benders = cheap. Tubing = pricey / tubing benders = pricey. Relatively speaking. Tubing and pipe can come in all sizes. I have seen 4" chromoly tube with 3" wall thickness. It is still tube even though it is huge. Have never seen a 4" pipe with a 3" wall? You may have - but it's tube not pipe! Got it?[/QUOTE2"' pipe is 2 3/8" on the outside. The inside diameter depends on what schedule it is. Schedule 40 is slightly over 2" inside. Schedule 180 has an ID of 1 1/2" give or take a few thousands. Pipe diameters  start with 1/8" which is .405 OD and measurement switches to OD at 14". 12" pipe is actually 12.75" OD. The wall thickness of pipe depends on whatever the schedule is. Tubing is a different breed of cat from pipe.
Reply:Well where to start? Last nite I had a few before posting. I knew what I was talking about as I do now. It just didn't come out right. I have personally seen 4" tube with a 1" hole, hence the comment about a 4" tube with 3" wall thickness. 1.5" wall + 1.5" wall ....... Can you see where I got a lil screwed up on my statement? I woke up this mornin ( a bit hungover, 4 and a half hrs after going to bed) and as I was putting my boots on at the computer read the replies. Little tired, groggy, hungover - ******* post in response. I was only trying to help out and it seemed to have been taken personal. Misinformation is a big problem on the internet, where everyone has an opinion. I know pipe comes in sizes larger than 12", as well as tube. The initial poster was asking about benders for tube and pipe, and the difference between tube and pipe. Asking someone at a tool counter about a 5/16" "pipe " bender would get a few strange looks at the tool counter, and make the salesman think he was a fool. I have worked with tube and pipe in 4 different power plants for the past 13 years, 5 of them in a purchasing role. I know the difference. I just misspoke (or typed). I don't really see the reason to get un civil with each other or knock someone else down to build themselves up. This site has really been helpful to me and caps off my daily grind nicely, and I don't want ill feelings towards or from anyone here. Sorry for the prolonged derail.Last edited by jinkzd; 12-31-2009 at 07:56 PM.Just another clown trying to be cool
Reply:Don't sweat it; the OP got his answers. Best bet for all who are reading this one is to take in the simple facts posted, and separate out all the bickering. Therein lies some good info.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:Last nite I had a few before posting
Reply:Originally Posted by mavman4. . . my application is automotive tubing, brake and fuel lines, hence my question about "tubing benders."   Typing in tubing bender on ebay or search engines turns up a mixture of small benders and roll bar (for lack of a better term) benders.  I just wondered if I was using the wrong terminology.    The kit I bought off Craigs List are all Imperial Eastman benders.  They seem like nice pieces.  If nothing else, I will try to get the 5/16" unit from them.  TomPS With input from Welding Web (I lurk more than I post) and time at the Mig trigger, I tell folks that I am no longer a "booger welder" and now a beginner.  Thanks again.