dynasty 200dx or syncrowave 210 help me choose

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So as stated im in the market for a new tig machine. I bought a TA 181i and began my tig journey. I also use my idealarc roundtop 250 acdc for scratch tigging. So im in a bit of a tough decision-making spot...im not sure what welder to get. While the dynasty is fully loaded the price sticker matches. I have a torch, ck flex loc 150, so the machine out the door is about 3400 at the lws. Add pedal and we are at about 3600. Now the syncrowave 210 is a RTW machine, and at 2600 out the door its very appealing. As are the features at that price. Now im not a pro welder, just a hobbyist that occasionally gets a paying weldup job. So are the pulse time and background amps adjustability that the syncrowave 210 lacks really worth the extra 1000 dollars? I was sold on the 200dx.....but the s wave 210 may be better suited for me....add to that with the money saved I can buy horiz/vert band saw. Also on the swave you can upgrade the ac freq for around 200, bringing it to 2800 but still a substantial amount less, I just dont want to buy the swave only to realize I needed the adjustability of the pulse controls the 200dx has. Thanks for any inputI also realize that the dynasty has waveform control and a broader ac balance control. As well as many other features...Last edited by chevydyl; 12-16-2013 at 01:55 AM.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150  3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine              welding&fabrication
Reply:Depends a lot on what you want/need to do. I was in your position a few years back, except then it was the Syncro 200 vs the newer Syncro 210. I opted to pick up the Syncrowave over the Dynasty because I really didn't have a need for all the advanced functions the Dynasty had. At that time price difference for a set up ready to go Dynasty was 2x the cost of the Syncrowave, so the cost savings out weighed the advantages of the Dynasty.The newer Syncro 210 has brought the two even closer together. It's smaller, uses less power as well has more options and adjustments than my Syncrowave 200. Keep in mind that most of these advanced functions only help you if you have the level of skill to use them, either on the 210 or the 200dx. I you are doing basic tig, you won't need those functions for quite a while.I too would have loved to buy a Dynasty, and I still will at some point. In the mean time I've got a machine that will do most of what the Dynasty will do with the exception of the advanced functions, mostly useable on alum. If I was making money daily with the machine, especially if I was doing either mobile work or alum, it would be a different story. ( my syncrowave 200 is not what you'd call "portable" by any stretch. ) Then I'd bite the bullet and get the Dynasty.My thought was for the time being I have the Syncrowave to do all my projects. If I find in the future, I'm being held back by the lack of the advanced functions, find a super deal on a used Dynasty, or I find work that warrants the portability I lack, then I can always sell my current unit and upgrade. In the mean time I have other uses for that extra money. So far I haven't regretted that decision..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Since you're already familiar with the Thermal Arc brand, considering you have a TA-181 Mig, you might want to consider a TA-186 Tig.   All the features of the Miller Dynasty 200, at less than half the price.
Reply:I can't help with the machine, I think weldermike has a 210, maybe he can tell you about it. That 150 amp torch you have is holding you back though, with the new machine you need to get a watercooled torch. Would let you max out either of the machines and won't get hot.Airco Ac/Dc 300 HeliwelderMillerMatic 200 (stolen)Miller Maxstar 150STLMiller AEAD200LE (welding and generating power) Hobart MIG
Reply:Dsw thanks tht kinda puts it into perspective, I mean im just beginning alum tig, and Ive seen some pics of alum tig done by the 210, and its the type of bead I hope to be able to lay down. The swave 210 doesnt lack features, main concern is that you cant adjust on time and background amps they are factory set at 50/50. But then again im the type that wants the best...within reasonable cost. ie I only buy snap on tools, but I am not a mechanic. Plus its not like I have been saving and saving to buy a welder, I get a paid vacation every year that will more than cover the cost of a new dynasty 200dx. Hah its more like paid tool money, last year I bought a lathe, this year welder...another welder haha.Not to diss TA, dont get me wrong I do like my 181, but its like the snap on fettish I have($1200 for a drill and impact), I dont mind paying for an industial proven name. An American name at that, I know I know even the miller has overseas parts in it but at least americans tightened all the screws.....and im willing to shell out the extra cash to hopefully ensure that americans keep on doing that job.Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150  3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine              welding&fabrication
Reply:You don't NEED a fancy bells and whistles machine to do top quality tig welds on alum. Zap does nice work with his "ancient" Miller 330 with zero advanced controls. I'm not even sure you have any balance control on one of those. I can probably think of a few others that make really pretty welds with older "simple" machines.Terry likes to teach people alum on the Diversion 180 because it lacks all the advanced functions. I find way too many guys want to spend their time looking for some fancy setting that will magically make them great welders overnight, vs simply sticking with the basics and gaining experience. I find that even more true with alum that takes more control to weld well. Many times what all those extra buttons and settings do is allow a person to completely screw up a machine until those advanced functions are actually hindering them, vs helping them make a better weld.It's once you have enough hood time and experience that you can start to take advantage of  advanced functions. It also doesn't hurt to have someone with a lot of experience on them sit down and work with you to show you what they can do. I'm sure I'd benefit from sitting down with Terry and having him show me what some of the advanced functions on a Dynasty can do compared to the older Syncrowaves I'm used to running. However without having the basics of heat control and so on down, they aren't going to do you any good. I'm not sure the average home hobbyist ever puts enough time in under the hood to get enough experience to be able to take advantage of these features..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:They are both great. I don't know why Miller put the Sync210 in a mig chassis, but I love it.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:IMHO, duty cycle is by far the most important part. If I had to choose between the two, I would pick the dynasty. It is 120A @ 100% and 150A @ 60% duty, and the sync 210 is 95A @ 100% and 125A @ 60%. Nothing sux worse than having a machine that cant keep up. I know from experience. I have hundreds of hours on a dynasty 200 and about 40% of that time I was waiting on the damn thing to cool. I wouldn't even consider the sync 210. And now that i have been there done that wouldn't get the dynasty 200 either.www.performancealuminumfabrication.com
Reply:Originally Posted by travisc454IMHO, duty cycle is by far the most important part. If I had to choose between the two, I would pick the dynasty. AND,.... now that i have "been there, done that" wouldn't get the dynasty 200 either.
Reply:Why not look for a used Syncrowave 250 or Hobart tigwave 250 ac/dc?tackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:Again dsw is right on, I totally understand, mind you I am learning alum tig with my lincoln roundtop with no high freq, and that is the reason why I know I need a machine with some bells and maybe a whistle haha. Ac balance.....I get minimal penetration right now basically just surface welds, I mean some of the welds look decent but a few smashes with a hammer and the weld breaks off one side of the coupon, and this is grooved out 1/4in 6061. @150 amps.Dont want a transformer.....and dont really want used, I like new stuffits funny you said that about fancy welder that will make a guy better over night, I bought the TA welder but everytime I want to weld lately I fireup the lincoln, ac scratch start sucks, so....not haveing a foot pedal sucks.....I think your right I dont need everything the dynasty has to offer, the duty cycle is the one thing that lacks....Miller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150  3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine              welding&fabrication
Reply:Also with the lincoln I can get a purdy practice bead out of it, I mean perfect straight,  even spaced dabs, but then when I put the tungsten into a joint like a butt weld, it kinda, idk i need some serious hood time, but I think the sync will do just great for me. And on the torch deal I think I will get the water version of it later after I build a cooler. I love the flex loc. It has allowed me to lay down some roots and hot passes on 4in pipe coupons that was like wow I did that lol. And thats with the lincoln scratch ill show some pics of them in another postMiller Syncrowave 210 w/CK FlexLoc 150  3/6/14ESAB PCM 1125 Plasma CutterAtlas 12x36 LatheACER 9x42 3hp millHarig 612 Surface GrinderDRINK Machine              welding&fabrication
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydylDont want a transformer.....and dont really want used, I like new stuff
Reply:The sync 210 is a inverter, and by a landslide its alot more than a entry level diversion, and yes it will weld 1/4in. I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Originally Posted by chevydylAgain dsw is right on, I totally understand, mind you I am learning alum tig with my lincoln roundtop with no high freq, and that is the reason why I know I need a machine with some bells and maybe a whistle haha. Ac balance.....I get minimal penetration right now basically just surface welds, I mean some of the welds look decent but a few smashes with a hammer and the weld breaks off one side of the coupon, and this is grooved out 1/4in 6061. @150 amps.Dont want a transformer.....and dont really want used, I like new stuffits funny you said that about fancy welder that will make a guy better over night, I bought the TA welder but everytime I want to weld lately I fireup the lincoln, ac scratch start sucks, so....not haveing a foot pedal sucks.....I think your right I dont need everything the dynasty has to offer, the duty cycle is the one thing that lacks....
Reply:I searched long and hard and am very happy so far with my HTP221.  It's essentially the same price (single voltage air cooled) as the synchrowave and has much more adjustability. The welder you buy is more a function of your bank account or your ability to pay for the welder.  You can certainly learn to weld with less and experienced guys can do a lot with less.  If you buy the best tig with the best features you can afford you can always turn the bells and whistles off to learn.. my 221 will weld 60hz straight-up aluminum just like a transformer machine.... but it weights 40 lbs and uses 26 amps outputting 220.   If the point is to make nice welds regardless of absolute skill then YES the features do help.  I don't like how Miller makes you pay for software upgrades that are already capable on the hardware of the machine... The "mig cart" thing is actually really cool if you don't want to run a water cooled torch, it's a neat little rig.  It's a little large but has storage and is solid. Between the two I would go syncrowave at $2500 vs $5000 for an air cooled dynasty with the same overall welding capability, especially if you aren't welding production or full time.  If you want a water cooled torch you might want to go another route.  I have another thread going just to figure out what all the bells and whistles actually do, the more I weld with the 221 the more I appreciate the bells.  They don't make me a superior welder but changes on the machine make material changes in weld appearance and quality, especially pulse on steel and AC balance on aluminum.Last edited by bikesandcars; 12-18-2013 at 12:32 PM.