Problem with welds in thinner material

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I recently started using some 14 and 16 gauge steel for projects and I'm having some issues with laying a decent bead on my joints.  I'm a fairly new welder and recognize I need more practice on my technique, but I wanted to post a few pictures and see what more experienced welders thought of the problem I'm having.  I'm using a Hobart 187 MIG welder with C25 gas and switched from .030 to .023 wire for some 14 gauge tube I'm using.  Here are the pictures:Fit up for first joint:Here's the bead.  As you can see I'm blowing holes in it.  Welder is set to 4/7 on the amps and 50/100 on the wire speed which is Hobart's approx recommendation.Here's the second pass on the joint to try to close up the holes using the same settings again.  Not so great.Here's a second joint I tried.  Machine settings were 3/7 on the amps and 50/100 on the wire speed.  Somewhat better but still not happy with it.Here's a third joint I tried.  Machine settings were 2/7 on the amps and 60/100 on the wire speed.  The machine sounded pretty good at this setting and it seemed like it did a better job.  How's this look?So am I moving in the right direction on machine settings?  What can you tell about my beads other than I need much more practice?  I usually work with 11 gauge material up to 1/4 or so and I have better luck with that.  At least I don't blow holes in it nearly as much. Thanks for looking!Jeff
Reply:Last one doesn't look too bad from what I can see, but what does the back of the joint look like?But welds or joints like you show in the 1st pict are very hard to do with thinner material. You have thin edges you need to work with. Being how enough to get good penetration and yet not blow holes can be a very fine line.1st type of joint. Keep the weld on the right hand tube in your picture that has more material, Wash the puddle onto the left piece where it is thin, if it's getting too hot and the hole is starting to get out of control, either pull back on the gun which will cool the puddle slightly, or swing back over to the heavier part to help soak up some of the heat. One thing to remember on these, the side of the square tube has a radius. That means you start out with a gap at the edge unless you cope the butting tube. You can weld it without coping, but remember if you have a gap, the radius will make the space even bigger when you go to weld.But joints can be tougher yet. Tight fit up can really be important. However a gap can help get better penetration. How big a gap etc depends on how you personally weld and is something you'll have to work out thru practice. As mentioned above, remember gun height can control your heat to a limited extent and help you fine tune things. Closer to the material and you are hotter, farther away and the weld is colder, wire speed and voltage being the same..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Thank you for the tips!  I went back and looked inside the tube on the last weld and it looks like it filled in the gap from the inside or back of the weld ok.  Can't really get a good picture of it though.  For fun, I went and put .030 wire back in the machine to see how much of a difference it made using the .023 and after adjusting my settings for the thicker wire, I was able to weld almost as good.  The .023 does help a little though, so I will use it when I venture under 11 gauge material for sure.  I need to work on my consistency and hand position.  I think that's what is holding me back.  All of this is a blast though.  Having been a woodworker most of my adult life, this metal stuff is a nice break and a lot of fun.  I wish I had started much sooner than at 51 years old.
Reply:Oh one other thing I forgot to mention. Pushing the bead vs dragging it can often help with thinner material. When you push you lay down less material and input less heat overall often making it better suited for thin material..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:If you can try going downhill it will help out because it is faster so that means less time for heat build up.Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:I'm confused. It looks to me like you are pushing away from you. Should you pull it toward you? Find something to rest on, a TIG Finger or two might help. Two different drivers drive through a narrow opening, the confident one passes without damage. The other hits one side, careens across and hits the other side. What was the difference? One knew it would work, it did. The other knew it wouldn't work, he too was right. Learn how, then expect success, you won't be disappointed!
Reply:Seams to me you are just freestyling to many different styles. As you stated you are new to welding, so it all comes down to hood time and experience and learning how to react as quick as a auto dark hood to stay on top of whats happening upon initial light off. You have been a member here since 2009 and still don't know the basics bud, hmmm. See ya in five more years when you get your next project. All kidding aside bud, a welding machine is not a tool, it is like a instrument, that needs time and practice, and you must stay on top of both to be proficient.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeSeams to me you are just freestyling to many different styles. As you stated you are new to welding, so it all comes down to hood time and experience and learning how to react as quick as a auto dark hood to stay on top of whats happening upon initial light off. You have been a member here since 2009 and still don't know the basics bud, hmmm. See ya in five more years when you get your next project. All kidding aside bud, a welding machine is not a tool, it is like a instrument, that needs time and practice, and you must stay on top of both to be proficient.
Reply:Not being a smart a$$, did you change the drive rolls for the size wire you are running ?  You just need to practice to see what works . Get comfortable and try pulling and pushing.
Reply:Originally Posted by BD1Not being a smart a$$, did you change the drive rolls for the size wire you are running ?  You just need to practice to see what works . Get comfortable and try pulling and pushing.
Reply:Originally Posted by jeff scottYes sir I did.  Practice is my middle name at the moment.  I'm becoming more comfortable with my welder than I ever have.  Welding is definitely an art and I have a great deal of respect for those who excel in it.
Reply:No worries.  I appreciate honesty.  I'm soaking up every bit of knowledge I can from you professionals, this is a valuable resource.
Reply:Jody has a good video about using a "U" pattern when you are welding a gap with a MIG. Looks like you have a bit of a gap there, so you might try that. top of the "U" points in the direction of travel, so you are really putting the heat to the sides and not squirting the wire through the gap.Miller Multimatic 255
Reply:Originally Posted by Louie1961Jody has a good video about using a "U" pattern when you are welding a gap with a MIG. Looks like you have a bit of a gap there, so you might try that. top of the "U" points in the direction of travel, so you are really putting the heat to the sides and not squirting the wire through the gap.
Reply:I'm not a mig welder so take this with a grain of salt - but I do a fair bit of 16ga steel joints like your first one with stick and if you point the arc maybe 20-30 degrees towards the radius of the uncut piece rather than the cut butt piece, then you're far less likely to blow holes because there's more material to sink heat into. It doesn't take much arc to melt the edge of the cut piece so ensuring penetration isn't a problem. Again, not sure if this applies to mig so some of the more experienced can correct me.