The value of a Oxy-fuel set up.

admin

I'm considering purchasing an oxy-fuel set up and want to know a few things.  I am considering buying the small pack http://www.harborfreight.com/welding...nks-65818.html and want to know the limitations with this.  I don't see any big cutting or beveling in my future with it so I'm not worried about depriving the oxygen rapidly and frequently.But,  How long could I cut with these little guys?How expensive are the small tanks to refill?How do you value your setup and have you ever thought "I could of spent this $XXX.xx on something else more valuable"
Reply:The big problem is the super small acetylene cylinder. With acetylene you need to use no more than 1/7th  the volume of the cylinder in one hour. That cylinder is only 10 cf, so even the smallest tips use more than that. That really limits you. You can cut or heat a few bolts or do a few quick welds, but that's about all. A "B" size cylinder is better than that little "MC" cylinder in that kit. A B is 40 cf vs 10, so you get a bit more time. Even my 75 cf cylinder is limited when I start using bigger tips.Another issue is that the valves on an MC cylinder is different from a B cylinder and both are different than those used on larger cylinders. That means you would need to go to adapters to use different cylinders.Those kits are fine for the auto hobbyist who occasionally needs to free a stuck bolt, or mechanics ore HVAC guys who need  a small torch kit to keep FT on the truck. If you are at all serious about using OA, you want to look for a bigger set.As far as gas, I forget off the top of my head what it just cost me to get my B cylinder filled. I do know that it was only $5 moree than it would have cost to get my MC filled. 4 times the gas for only a few bucks more. I can deal with the bigger cylinder for the few times I need to solder pipes with my air acet torch. The reason is most places charge the same amount per cylinder for various fees that are included in the price. Things like retest, haz mat fees, transport and handling etc. The gas is only a small part of the actual cost. The bigger the cylinder, the less per cf you pay for gas.Lastly would be the issue buying from HF. I've seen a number of guys who bought their kits only to later find out that while they are victor clones, normal Victor parts won't fit because they are just far enough out of tolerance. Down side is by the time you find this out, you usually have had the kit for awhile and it's too late to do anything about it. Treat them as disposable and plan if you even need parts that you'll be buying a new torch.I've seen plenty of decent full sized torches listed on CL for what that kit will cost you or even less. I'd take your time and see if you can't find something better..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I would skip the baby tank set up and go for a full size set. If you really want the small set, check craigs list if available in your area. They can be found cheap by me.  I would go for a SMITH SET MADE IN USA for $195.00 from welders supply, a local supplier near me in Wisconsin.http://www.weldersupply.com/P/317/Sm...eteMediumDutyOAs for tanks, here's a craig's list post that I get mine from. It list sizes and prices.http://milwaukee.craigslist.org/tld/4454346126.html
Reply:I don't have experience with the small set like that, but I have recently started using Oxy-Acetylene torches.  Here is my setup...I don't think you'll be happy with that setup.  It is primary sold for brazing joints on AC systems.  To be honest, for that price, you are pretty close to a non-HF of that same thing.For $300, you can get a couple of decent cylinders on CL.  I got the bottles, cart and regulators above for $200 (but I was not in a hurry...I watched for a LONG time to get that).  But, for the $300 to $350 range, you should be able to get a decent pair of bottles.The Oxygen bottle should have a capacity approximately 2X the acetylene bottle (capacity, not necessarily size).  You will want to make sure your LWS (Local Welding Supply) is willing to fill the bottle you plan to buy.  I just took a chance, but others arrange to meet the seller at their LWS and ask if they will fill those bottles.  If they will, they pay for them.  You also need to make sure your bottles are 'in date,' or you will end up paying a small fee, the first time you get them filled.  You are generally only going to have a problem with the larger bottles (which were often owned by the LWS and only rented out to commercial customers).  Most LWS's won't even blink when you bring in a mid- or small-sized bottle.  But, it is important to figure this out with your LWS, because they are ALL different.Once you buy bottles your LWS will fill, they will just exchange them (you go in for a fill up, they give you another bottle which is already filled, and they take your bottle).  So, don't buy new bottles for exchange, unless you want to cry, when they hand you ancient, dinged up bottles.  That doesn't matter (they will give you tested, non-expired bottles, with plenty of life in them--they just won't be pretty).If you don't have much experience with the torch, I can HIGHLY recommend Kent White's "Mastering the Torch" course, at TM Technologies.  You will leave there very comfortable in 15 processes (soldering, brazing and welding on five different metals).Hope this helps.KevKevin / Machine_Punk from The Aerodrome Studio - Lincoln PowerMIG 210 MP - Meco N Midget w/custom welding station - Vintage Victor 100Current Projects: The Aerodrome Studio
Reply:Like DSW said those are disposable sets. We call them junk where I'm from. Invest in the Smith like BD1 says or a Victor set. Replacement parts and add ons are readily available for both. For no more than it costs I would buy a set you could grow into. Don't starve your kids while doing it though. Not saying it was HF torches but some of them were flat out dangerous back in the day. Quality control was not a priority for some of those companies. Buy or lease the biggest cylinders you can. The contents will not go bad over time if you don't get it used quickly.Arcon Workhorse 300MSPowcon 400SMTPowcon SM400 x 2Powcon SM3001968 SA200 Redface1978 SA250 DieselMiller Super 32P FeederPre 1927 American 14" High Duty LatheK&T Milwaukee 2H Horizontal MillBryan
Reply:Like others said, that little HF is garbage for its limitations.  Total waste of money for a home hobbiest.Lincoln Power Mig 216Lincoln AC/DC-225/125Miller  625 X-Treme PlasmaMiller 211 Forney 95FI-A 301HF 91110Victor Journeyman O/PMilwaukee DaytonMakita  Baileigh NRA Life Member
Reply:If you read the HF ad that torch has a "turbo lever" Sounds sexy to me.
Reply:Hi, for what it's worth, I always wanted an Oxy/Acc outfit to do all those small gas welding and brazing jobs, but when I totalled up the cost of the outlay and the bottle rental/fill........I bought the Multiplaz 3500 plasma outfit instead.And that's it.........it won't do fine Tig welding on very small items but you can weld or heat all day long for a few Watts of electricity and never have to watch the gauge to see how much gas you have left.After 3 + years of use it's proved itself to be my one and only welding and heating source.Ian.
Reply:You can buy a new set up from Smith that will last you a lifetime for $300.  You only need to cough up the bottles.
Reply:or go with the new victor set it's nice and balanced  and under 300$ HF torches are junk and get some bottles from CLSent from my iPhone using TapatalkMiller Xmt 350Lincoln Ln-25Ahp 200xSmith Gas Mixer AR/HTig is my Kung FuThrowing down dimes and weaving aboutInstagram http://instagram.com/[email protected]
Reply:How do you value your setup and have you ever thought "I could of spent this $XXX.xx on something else more valuable"
Reply:I bought an oxygen regulator at harbor freight, with a coupon I paid about $15.00  About the third time I went to use it, it started leaking.  I was out of town and our fuel supplier was also the welding supply in that town, so I went down there and spent $300.00 for a new Victor Journeyman outfit.  I already had all victor torches (small, journeyman and barrel) but went ahead and bought the complete outfit and couldn't be happier.  My old torch I had on the rig was kinda finnicky and the valves didn't shut off all the way.  I've got about a half dozen I need to get rebuilt...If the rest of the torch kit is of the same quality as the oxygen regulator I bought at HF, I'd definately pass...  Their oxygen regulator is buried in a ditch at Coalgate Oklahoma if anyone would like to go get it...-------------------------Chemetron AC/DC 300 HFSnap-On MM300L Lincoln SP140 Lincoln AC/DC 225g Lincoln SA200 Lincoln SA200 Miller Bobcat 225GVictor torchesH&M and Mathey beveling machinesMcElroy Plastic pipe fusion
Reply:As far as torches, figure out what size you need (I do really small stuff all the time, so I got a new Meco Midget, with a full set of tips, from TM Technologies online).  This one rarely sells for less than retail on eBay, so you might as well buy new.I do some larger stuff too, so I got the medium-sized Victor torch, the 100.  I wanted a vintage torch, since, in my opinion, it is one of those things which was made better years ago and a good torch will last you a lifetime.  I wanted a US-made version, so I bought the original 100 on eBay.  I got the torch for $15, because it leaked.  I then gave it to a torch refurbisher, who made it look and work like brand new, for $50 plus postage.  There you have it...an essentially new, vintage torch, for less than $75.As far as tips...once you get your bottles, take the volume of the acetylene bottle and divide it by 7.  (In my case, 145 cubic feet / 7)  That will give you the maximum safe flow rate you can ever expect from that bottle.  Look up the recommended flow rates for the tips on your torch.  Don't bother buying tips for any larger than your bottle can support.  In my case, I think I have from 000 through 7 in Victor welding tips and only the first 2 rosebud heating tips, because my bottle won't supply anything bigger than that.  I got those all off eBay, for less than $15 a tip, by watching for them.  They are a good $50 a tip, brand new from the LWS.  There are lotsa good brands of torches out there.  I just happen to have Victor.KevKevin / Machine_Punk from The Aerodrome Studio - Lincoln PowerMIG 210 MP - Meco N Midget w/custom welding station - Vintage Victor 100Current Projects: The Aerodrome Studio
Reply:Guess my dad has a large acetylene cylinder so that removes that from the equation.  I CONSTANTLY forget about craigslist when it comes to big ticket yet common items (such as cylinders) so I'll probly check that out for the oxygen tank and maybe even a torch set.  It's nice to hear that the torch set up has huge versatility because that's important to me.  I'm no seasoned welder by any long shot and I have many years if not decades in front of me and that gives me plenty of time to learn and run into things that might need a torch.
Reply:When searching CL try Searchtempest.com. It allows you to put in a search term, say "torch" or maybe "oxy acetylene" and search a given distance around your zipcode for hits. I try and keep the term a vague as possible and search by hand after that. "welder" is my generic search term most times. It will pick up most welders even if they misspell it as an "ark" welder.If you had your location listed in your profile, one of the guys near you who peruses CL regularly might be able to make some suggestions....No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:There is some good accurate information above. Like everyone else, I believe that the HF regulators are junk and the bottles are way too small to be either usable or economically viable.I have owned an oxy/fuel setup since I was in my 20s (I'm 60). Wouldn't be without one. I worked for many years as a shipfitter where a torch was my #1 tool. There are a couple of things to be aware of, though. First, acetylene is EXPENSIVE! Some huge plant blew up a few years back and ever since then OMG it hurts to refill an acetylene cylinder! So my first rule is don't use acetylene for anything except welding. Cutting, heating, brazing - all can be done with oxy/propane. So for everything except welding use propane.Second, good quality gear can be rebuilt and refurbished. Be careful if you buy stuff with the Victor brand name on it nowadays. They have bought a lot of lower-grade companies and merged with them so now you see "Victor Medalist" or "Victor Cutskill" - these are all offshore brands of distinctly lower quality. Finally, even Victor's best gear is now made in China. I cannot comment on its quality. I'm not some jingoistic import-basher, but I prefer to buy older Victor gear that was made in places like San Francisco. Victor, Smith, Harris and Airco all made top quality gear. I buy cheap cutting tips. They seem to me to work just as well as the OEM tips. I try to tool up a torch with cutting tips from 000 to 1 or 2. Take good care of your cutting tips and torch gear. Many tips have precision machined surfaces that should not be knocked around. Threaded connections are also fragile and subject to damage. I like to cut the nuts off of old O/A hose and use those as thread protectors.Finally, don't expect to get really good results cutting steel with a torch until/unless you invest a lot of time in learning. However, if you pay attention to your cutting tip chart and diligently work to get better, you will have completely serviceable cuts. For lots of fabrication that's all you care about. Invest in a circle cutting attachment. Radiused cuts done freehand look awful.metalmagpie