A strange question...

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How to make a topiary frame?I'm completely new to welding - and have no equipment (yet!).  I'm looking for a relatively inexpensive set up and only for this purpose. I plan on using either galvanized fencing wire or stainless steel wire to make a couple of topiary frames.  what is the best method/equipment for welding wire?  The picture that's (hopefully) attached is an example of the kind of thing I'm planning to make (only much tidier and better than I'm sure my first attempt will be!).  I'm going to start with a serpent or dragon about 4-5 ft high.  Also I'm in New Zealand where we have 240v power if that makes any difference?
Reply:Your best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:I say get a small mig - these will just be tacks.Once the plant grows over it no one will see it anyway.Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveI say get a small mig - these will just be tacks.Once the plant grows over it no one will see it anyway.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:Originally Posted by crispAwesome.  I expect it to be a bit messy but, like you say, its only a frame for the plant to cover.I've had a look and there are plenty of arc welders going cheap - arc welding ok for this or is it best to stick to mig?
Reply:Cool, eyeing up a mono mig 101 on equivalent of ebay at the moment so I might throw a bid on it.
Reply:or one of these?http://www.supercheapauto.co.nz/onli...ecommendations
Reply:You could also buy a o/a torch and braze it.Yeah, I know, but it'll be ok!Lincoln Square wave 255Miller Vintage mig30a spoolgunThermal Dynamics Pacmaster 100xl plasmaSmith mc torchEllis 1600 band saw
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:If your going to spend almost $400 get a Lincoln or Hobart or at least a Northern Tool welder, you will be glad you did.Thermal Arc 210 - Tweco 211I - Cutmaster 52
Reply:That welder is flux core only, as is. May or may not have a gas kit and the ability to change polarity. Welding with flux core wire will do what you want to do, but at some point you may get tired of cleaning welds and want to MIG weld with gas shielding. C25 gas and almost no clean up of the welds. The galvanized wire will be hard to weld. All weld spots will have to be ground off. You don't want to weld the coating, make a dirty weld and gives off a toxic gas you do not want to breath. Can be welded with standard flux core and MIG wire. Stainless wire is less toxic and you still don't want to breath the smoke. Can be welded with standard MIG and flux core but welds will rust.They make stainless MIG welding wire and you need tri-mix or C25 gas won't rust,While tri-mix is best. For non-critical stainless welds, C25 gas will work.I think they make stainless flux core wire. You will probably have to special order it.An even cheaper way to weld these frames, might be to silver solder with a mapp gas torch. Uses a standard small bottle propane tip. Propane might be hot enough but will take a lot longer to heat the joint. Make sure you get silver solder with flux built in.Or the next step up would be a small O/A set up and yellow rod braze the joints.There are some nice portable/hobby sets that have small refillable bottles you can exchange at the local welding supply store, can be bought at home centers. just find a source of bottles and gas before you buy. Price compare with LWS and the home centers.If you go with mig, get a major brand with good warranty. That can weld with and with out gas. Do some price shopping at LWS then check home centers and hardware stores, Then pawn shops. You might see what looks like the same model welder at the LWS and home centers. For the most part they are the same but look at the wire drive system.Most of the time the LWS units have more metal and Home center units have more plastic. Good luck, have fun and come back with the first one you want to show off in pictures.
Reply:crispWWeb forum decorum & texting are different.In 'weld-world' when asking a question - you let it hang - often for days.Answering [discordant] posts in real time = lack of foundation . . .Your actual issue is forming - and not welding. Any cheap '120 Squirt Box' running Innershield by an untrained-hand will do what you want - with grinding.The real-expense of your enterprise are the fixtures, and forming tool necessary for your expectations.A '120 Squirt Box' is little more than a 'glue gun' in the grand scene of the tooling you need.If you are jump'in to metal work; start in your locale with direct contact;seek-out every metal worker that will talk to you. Opusps   Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:For that I'd either weld or braze with o/a. Not because it's any better or faster, because it isn't, but just because I really like using a torch and for art things I like the look of brazing. And also because $300-400 will get you a prety nice used torch/bottle setup that can be useful for a lot of things, especially art type projects, while a $300-400 MIG welder is going to be in the crappy/useless end of the scale. I still have and frequently use the $300 torch setup I bought, while the $300 arc welder I bought sat on a shelf for months until I bought a real welder and sold it. O/A welding doesn't get much attention since arc welding is usally so much faster, but I'm glad I spent some time with a torch before moving onto other processes. I made some decent sized projects with my torch -- including my welding table.I don't see why you couldn't make that. I'm not artistic so I certainly couldn't unless somebody drew up some plans for me, but it doesn't look too technically difficult to me.Good luck, and post progress pictures!
Reply:As to the feasability argument,  I'm going to side with Henry Ford:"Whether you think you can, or think you can't - you're probably right."So there... everyone is probably  right.As to choosing one DoesAll starter tool for such projects?My vote too is for an oxy-fuel set. Mainly because torch-heating would allow easily forming some of the tight radiuses seen. Also heating would allow annealing the "spring" out of complex forms. Too, a torch would allow for cutting, and also brazing and welding. However, I'd say braze the connections.Carry on Crisp; anxious to see your works.Last edited by denrep; 03-05-2015 at 07:40 AM.
Reply:Ask a strange question, get a strange answer. You need professional help. Mental or metal, you choose. There are are a few member in your part of the world, look them up, and pay them a visit.Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR" MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li  ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.
Reply:I plan on using either galvanized fencing wire or stainless steel wire to make a couple of topiary frames. what is the best method/equipment for welding wire? I'm going to start with a serpent or dragon about 4-5 ft high.Fencing wire will be a bit small in diameter for the height you are planing to build. If I was to do that project I'd be using at least 6mm round stock or rebar. The plants and vines that would cover it would add some weight to it. Also would anchor it to concrete base.
Reply:My son used to use a MAPP torch and brazing rod on bare steel wire.  Made a couple very nice pieces using about 1/8" - 3/16" wire. He was in high school then."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:I think my choice would be something like thishttp://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...1247_200441247and something like thishttp://www.harborfreight.com/gear-dr...ler-36790.htmlto do something like thishttp://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php...=ring%20rollerRead the reviews and beware.Some have had bad luck with the little ring roller, but HF has a good return policy.Other vendors sell the same type of roller, don't have any personal experience with them.Brazing with Oxy-fuel is tempting, with the big drawback being it is a bit more cumbersome, requiring a third hand sometimes to either hold the torch, the pieces, or having to set the torch down to pick up the brazing rod while holding the pieces in place.Absolutely doable.Hobart Beta-Mig 2511972 Miller AEAD-200LEMiller 250 TwinNorthern Ind. Hybrid 200Longevity Stick 140Longevity Migweld 200SThermal Arc Pak 3XR
Reply:You might get by using "hog ring" staples and a pair of pliers designed to crimp them.  They are also used to fasten upholstery.http://www.stapleheadquarters.com/Ca...FYgdgQodE5sADgSafety wire pliers is an alternative. Either way, you can use stainless or galvanised rings/wire."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:In the off chance you are still checking my suggestion would to first carve out a rough form from a Styrofoam block, use it as a base to shape the wire, when done pore some acetone over it and melt it out. I also agree that an ac/o2 torch could be a great place to start and you can use it for many other things. Personally I would just melt the wire if possible and skip the brazing. If you need to drop a bead just ac weld it and you will be fine and it will give you some practice on basic technique you will use if, in the future, you tig weld. Lets be honest here the thing only has to be "structurally sound" for what a couple years. You really should consider what type of plant is going in the frame. If its going to be for a insanely fast growing plant such as an ivy, that takes the shape of what ever it latches on to, it will need to be a very strong base because they don't have a strong support structure. If the plant will be something that has more of a thick structure then as soon as the plant takes the wire shape its not going to matter one bit if the thing you build falls apart. Half of metal design is knowing what your application will be once you know its intended purpose then figure out the how and the what I am going to need. As far as skill just do it if it looks like crap who cares just rip it apart and do another.
Reply:Semper Fi Pop
Reply:Originally Posted by FlitemedicSemper Fi PopOriginally Posted by OPUS FERROcrispWWeb forum decorum & texting are different.In 'weld-world' when asking a question - you let it hang - often for days.Answering [discordant] posts in real time = lack of foundation . . .Your actual issue is forming - and not welding. Any cheap '120 Squirt Box' running Innershield by an untrained-hand will do what you want - with grinding.The real-expense of your enterprise are the fixtures, and forming tool necessary for your expectations.A '120 Squirt Box' is little more than a 'glue gun' in the grand scene of the tooling you need.If you are jump'in to metal work; start in your locale with direct contact;seek-out every metal worker that will talk to you. Opusps  weldermike is right . . .
Reply:I read the first maybe three replies and jumped in with this suggestion:   .....Get you cheap 110V mig from like Harbor Freight that uses flux core .30 wire....Then go by the farm supply/co-op and get you a roll of plain bare steel heavy single strand fence wire like used to brace wooden corner fence posts, not galvanized or stainless.Bend-form, then tack weld it all you want...really easy and cheap, and will last for many many years.If you are concerned about how bare steel wire might look as your plants grow, then spray paint the frame green or brown or whatever...Soon you will be the neighborhood Edward Scissor Hands, except you won't be a closet gay like Johnny Depp.Last edited by wornoutoldwelder; 10-16-2015 at 08:06 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour best method would be to understand fully that you probably cannot do this. Being honest.
Reply:Originally Posted by crispGreat, thanks for your non-help.Sure, its more complex and will be much tidier than my first attempt will be (as I said in my original post) but everyone has to start somewhere.I was also told I couldn't reupholster a $10 armchair on my first attempt.  I sold that chair for $1200.  I prefer to assume I can do things and give it a shot rather than assume I can't and sulk in a corner.
Reply:regardless of the method used, i suggest going for it! "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes short again and again, because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who actually strives to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly. So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat." -- Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919), "Man in the Arena" speech, April 23, 1910