Welding n Fabrication Table

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Aloha,Awaiting a response from a CL seller located in CT who has an awesome 4' x 5' x 1-1/4" steel welding table for sale.  In the interim, sketched an alternative design for a 3' x 4' x 1/2" welding & fabrication table. Design, illustrated in the figures below, is based on a review of many different welding tables on WW and discussions with several welding buddies.Welcome comments/suggestions on the design/approach from the WW pros and enthusiasts.  Prefer my first full-up welding/fabrication project to proceed smoothly.  Shred away!  Mahalo.Key Requirements- Accomodate TIG/Stick/MIG and plasma cutting processes in home workshop- Dissassembly into SubAssemblies for future transportation/storage- Combination of welded and 5/8" bolted connections of structural members. Rigid design.- Allow future upgrade/replacement of table top (e.g. 3' x 5' x 3/4")- Table height of 38"- Semi-portability in assembled state- Accomodate vise placement on table top and clamp storage on legs- Shelf (material TBD), half-depth, configured across legs for tool/material storage- Primed and paint finish (De-millscale, DP epoxy prime, single-stage urethane paint or base coat clear coat)SubAssemblies* 3' x 4' x 1/2" HRS top with rounded corners and "x-pattern" slots for fixtures [GREY]* 2" x 2" x 1/4" HSS support frame w/ 4" easement/overhang along perimeter[YELLOW]* 2" x 2" x 1/4" HSS left/right legs [TEAL]* 2" x 2" x 1/4" HSS rear (upper/lower) supports [TAN]* 5" x 5" x 1/4" HRS & UHMW pads for legs [RED]Connections* YELLOW subassembly will be welded* TEAL subassemblies, 2ea, will welded and then bolted to YELLOW* TAN subassemblies, 2ea, will be bolted to TEAL* GREY subassembly will be bolted to YELLOW via 5/8" countersunk bolts* RED subassemblies, 4ea, welded to TEAL.  UHMW wear pads epoxied to RED for table-to-concrete floor interfaceNotes~ Rounded Corners and X-Slots in GREY accomplished before GREY bolted to YELLOW.~ Ground Cable Bolts welded to TEAL ~ Engine hoist, Kevlar slings, magnetic lift clamps, and shackles (SWL 3k lbf) used to positioning GREY to YELLOW~ Magnetic Base Drill used to drill 5/8" counter-sunk holes thru GREY and YELLOW~ GREY to YELLOW bolted connections (5/8") either thru YELLOW or thru angle clamps welded to YELLOW inside face.  TBD.  The latter appears more logical and would reduce the 5/8" bolts from approx. 3.5" to 1.5" Attached ImagesLast edited by ManoKai; 01-28-2013 at 09:00 PM.
Reply:Looks great man!  I will say however that I think you spent way too much time in typing up your "blue print" for a simple welding table.  A top, four legs, some gussets and your done.  .  Simple. Lincoln Power Mig 216Lincoln AC/DC-225/125Miller  625 X-Treme PlasmaMiller 211 Forney 95FI-A 301HF 91110Victor Journeyman O/PMilwaukee DaytonMakita  Baileigh NRA Life Member
Reply:@ SuperArc - Thanks.  Jammed it out in SketchUp in a few hours.  No worries.  Awaiting my TIG setup to start cutting and welding.
Reply:For bolting grey top to yellow frame. You could cut access holes in the bottom of the yellow to allow bolting using shorter bolts
Reply:Just a couple thoughts.I wouldn't prime/epoxy/paint the top. It's just going to get banged up anyway, and you won't be able to ground the workpiece through paint.If you want to glue/epoxy UMHW to the feet, you'll need to scorch the UMHW first with a torch, otherwise glue won't adhere to it because UHMW is technically a wax.I like your idea of bolting the top to the table, since it won't warp that way, but if you use a torch or plasma cutter to cut the clamp slots, you may warp the top. If you do warp it, Google "flame bending" to find out how to warp it back into plane.Good luck.
Reply:Originally Posted by SuperArcLooks great man!  I will say however that I think you spent way too much time in typing up your "blue print" for a simple welding table.  A top, four legs, some gussets and your done.  .  Simple.
Reply:Appreciate everyone's input.@ Herbet99 - excellent idea. Drill and tap to the underside of the top via a via cutout accesses. Slick!@ 7A749 - this table will be used hard. Tacks and grinds to the top, not a problem.@ Kelvin - the top will NOT be painted, but instead 'maintained' via Pam spray, etc.  Low-key.  Thanks for the insight into the UHMW application. Have used Delrin, UHMW, Ultem, and HDPE in the past. However, never affixed the polymers to steel. Perhaps mechanical fasteners in lieu of epoxy.  More to research.  Also, preference is to water jet for the corners and x-slots.  Need to source a shop in NOVA that can rip water jetting for the top.@ Insaneride - Disagree regarding re-learning CAD.  Used Google SketchUp (Freeware).  If you can weld (you have patience) you can definetly use SketchUp.  Much much easier than AutoCAD, which I dislike.  Agree with you concerning 'changes' during fabrication/welding. Certain this will occur; however, the Sketch is a quick-look for establishing major/minor geometries and highlighting any potential interferences.  Also aided me in processing the workflow (e.g. 1st, do x; 2nd do this, etc).  You should give it a try.  You would find GSU user-friendly and intuitive.Last edited by ManoKai; 01-29-2013 at 02:23 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by ManoKaiAloha,Connections* YELLOW subassembly will be welded* TEAL subassemblies, 2ea, will welded and then bolted to YELLOW* TAN subassemblies, 2ea, will be bolted to TEAL* GREY subassembly will be bolted to YELLOW via 5/8" countersunk bolts* RED subassemblies, 4ea, welded to TEAL.  UHMW wear pads epoxied to RED for table-to-concrete floor interface
Reply:@ Broccoli1 - Ha!  Expected incoming flack with the color schema for the part callouts. My bride is an interior designer and unfortunately learned more color names than I care to know.Update:  located a water jet cutting and machining fabricator in NOVA.  Yeah!  The top (umm, Grey) will be water jet cut and blanchard ground (2-sides).  Scored a dakine deal on the services.  To. Be. Continued.
Reply:Where in NOVA are you? I'm in western Loudoun myself
Reply:ManoKai, I would like to use your avatar to cut out into a plasma torch design.  Have you thought about implementing it into your table somehow somewhere?
Reply:@ Insaneride - YOU read my mind. AbSoLuteLy brah!  I'll definetly incorporate the "mano" (shark) into the Aluminum & 80/20 Machine Kart presently under design/concept development.  The Kart will be a 3-tier setup on casters with layers 1 through 3 [bottom to top] containing the MM175, Miller CoolMate 4, and Miller Dynasty 200DX & Hypertherm PowerMax 30, respectively.  RodGuards, no doubt, ripped to the side.The mano will be hewn from the firery plasma of the '30' before long.  You also sparked an idea to "stack of dimes" the avatar into the table when that skill is perfected.Shaka!Last edited by ManoKai; 01-31-2013 at 11:24 PM.Reason: Syntax
Reply:Originally Posted by ManoKai Update_Rev1:  located a water jet cutting and machining fabricator in NOVA.  Yeah!  The top (umm, Grey) will be water jet cut and blanchard ground (2-sides).  Scored a dakine deal on the services.  To. Be. Continued.
Reply:To be able to use off the shelf X-clamps from Miller, you will need to enlarge one end of each slot. Have a look at the tables I am telling you about and you will see what I mean. With the design you have now you are forced to clamp always to the side of the slot, otherwhise the clamp won't get a hold. With the Xclamps you can even clamp straight over the slot.Harder to explain it than it is, have a look at the pictures.Mikel
Reply:@ Mikel - Check.  Thanks for the input.  Orthogonal loading of the clamp-to-piece interface is key.  The design has been revised to now include a 2"x2" square input at the near (start) side of each slot (1-1/16" width).  Those Miller blues are cool.   I'll prob fab a few clamps for the table.  Mahalo!
Reply:Update:* Scoring all steel ("colors") on Monday, including the 3' x 4' x 1/2" steel table top* Welding and Assembly to begin after all metal preparation completed this weekQuestions:1 ~ IRT beveling the mitered-cut ends of the 2" x 2" x 1/4 HSS top frame, planning to 1/8" bevel the T, B, R, and L sides of each end & establish (via fixturing/clamps) a 1/16" gap between the ends prior to welding.  Refer to image below.  Essentially, bevel outside edges of all ends and maintain a gap.  Would this approach be technically sound?  Don't want to over-kill it, but would like to ensure good penetration during welding and easy of fitup.  2 ~ Equivocating on whether to TIG (DX200) or MIG (MM175) the joints.  Both rigs are limited, according to literature, to welding mild steel with maximum thicknesses of 3/16" and 0.20", respectively.  Quick-calc shows that 250A are needed for full penetration of 1/4" mild steel.  However, the DX200 would produce ~ 80% penetration on the 1/4" HSS.  Recommend using a 250A machine for the job?  Reality check needed.Would appreciate your feedback, expecially on Q2 as will prob change all HSS to 2" x 2" x 3/16"  Mahalo! Attached Images
Reply:Bevel the edges if you want and mig it  it will be fineYour building a table not a bridge to the the main land www.georgesplasmacuttershop.comPlasma Cutter and Welder Sales and Repairs--Ebay storeTec.Mo. Dealer Consumables for the PT and IPT torch's
Reply:@ mechanic 416 - Check. I like it.  MIG ops with 0.035 using the MM175.  Bridge to the Mainland from Kauai. That would require at least a Dynasty DX 2K. Ha!  Thanks brah!
Reply:I would not round the corners. I use mine as a layout table with soapstone and a sheetrock square.  The right angle corner is useful to me. I drill and tap as needed to accept vicegrip threaded C clamps.  Pretty soon you have enough tapped holes in odd places to jig just about anything.  I do have X slots for a magnetic drill near the edge.  I find you need at least 3/8" for the magnet to hold to what it is rated.   As far as the CAD work, I taught myself on "FormZ" It is a long learning process, but it will draw anything.  It is similar to Solid Works but works on a MAC.   Looks good!
Reply:@ BB - Negative.  The top is water-jetted w/ rounded corners and X-Slots and will be retrieved tomorrow.  Form flowed from function.  Shop safety IVO children, etc.  Have other fixturing to "square up" any work piece on the table.  IRT holes drilled into the top, not happening.  The top will remain intact, 'cept for the X-Slots.  Future add-ons will include trailer-style hitch receivers to accept a bench vise, JD2 Tube Bender & NotchMaster, and a cantilevered-based (mini) plasma table (grated w/ slag catch pan).Plan to use the top and tack (and grind) directly to it.  It's a welding and fabrication table brah!
Reply:I tack and weld jigs on the table quite a bit.  I find if I hold a 4 1/2" grinder with a flat pad and backing disc totally flat it only takes off the high spots,bb's etc without harming anything else on the table. The only time it gets damaged is when some of my employees grind at more of an angle, or with anything other than a flat sanding disc. Those kids learning to weld yet?  I have always let kids weld up my scraps in the shop. Only damage is the yelling mothers.
Reply:Update:  Test weld on the 2" x 2" x1/4" HSS today.  Burned in at an MM175 setting of "7.2 / 70" with 0.030 solid wire to the test pieces.  Slightly beveled the edges, 'cept for the outside corners.  Need to work on wrapping the corners (ie. tie-ins) better.   Slow n Smooth was the mindset.The co-planare results of piece 'a' and 'b' was illuminating.  Elected to tack the outside corner 1st, then inside corner, then top, then bottom.  Got lucky probably.  Ha!  Was most concerned with maintaing "flush ends" during the welding and obtaining good fusion. All in all, rate the welds a "B" grade.  Believe the fusion to the 1/4" thick HRS was adequate.  Next up is to dial in all the "Yellow" and "Teal" members in preparation for fabrication/welding .Would appreciate any comments/feedback on the welds to the mitered A36 'test piece'.  Shaka! Attached ImagesLast edited by ManoKai; 02-20-2013 at 10:23 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by blackbartI....Those kids learning to weld yet?  I have always let kids weld up my scraps in the shop. Only damage is the yelling mothers.
Reply:You better find if the 1 1/2" will slide in the 2". Usually requires seamless sq tube to slide another inside it. Like what"s made for hitch recievers.                                       MikeOl' Stonebreaker  "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:@ mla2ofus - Good catch.  Was planning to verify.  Measured the ID of the 2.5" HSS. A 1.25" HSS might fit, def not a 1.5".  Will figure out a way to make it work.  Mahalo!Alas!  The Welding n Fabrication Table is built.  Not final painted and top conditioned, but 'got her done' this past weekend.  Owe a Big Kahuna debt of gratitude to my (blood) bro for helping me advance the project.  He's a cert'd master welder for a large fabrication facility out west.  We slghtly changed the design to eliminate bolts ("welders don't use bolts, bro!) and the upper cross beams.  The original design was def OK overkill.  Existing tare weight ~ 310 lbs.  Planning to rip 2ea short-side supports (e.g. 1" x 1" x 3/16" HSS)  to facilitate handing clamps, torches, etc, along with future interface to an add-on (cantilevered design) plasm table.Really learned a lot from my bro.  Square, plumb, and level a la carpentry....and tack all pieces before final burn in.  We MIG'd it hot via the MM175, after prepping all 2"x2"x1/4" HSS.  Great to watch him work and instruct.  Methodical and with purpose.  Next up:  priming ops #2 and then black paint, followed by final condition top.   Also planning to add 4ea casters a la 'Gar's' design.  Final finish elevation for top will be 41in.Best Part:  repaid the favor by taking him to burn some power at the range.  Steered him in on a cold bore shot (first round) on an 8"x10" AR500 steel target stationed at 300yds.  TRG42 300WM platform w/ Hornady 208gr AMAX bullets,  fueled with 70.6gr of H1000 power encased in RWS brass.  He jammed that steel all morning long.  Nice to see his eyes light up!The journey continues...... Attached Images"Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Casters (4ea, GD-60S FootMaster) arriving today. Scored from www.needcasters.com for $30ea.  Bottom plates and nuts, reqd to interface the casters to the legs. are standing by. Going slow n steady with this activity.   Slated for completion soooon. In the interim, the table is being used like a boss!Last edited by ManoKai; 04-12-2013 at 06:10 AM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Nice table.......might be stealing some of you designs during my table build.HF 180 amp/240 volt Mig (cap mod)1987 Harley FLHTP (project)1990 F350 XLT Lariat S/C dually1990 S&S 11SC Cabover Camper2011 Ford Ranger S/C XLT
Reply:@ desertscout - Mahalo. Awesome brah! PM me if you have any questions. A work in progress. Need to finish her up so work can start on the 'Pele' Fire Pit.Last edited by ManoKai; 04-12-2013 at 11:04 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Applied the Rust-Oleum SemiGloss Black Paint to the WnF Table frame, horizontal supports, legs, and caster pads.  Project complete!Gearing up to design/build a wood storage rack {SMAW}, tube/pipe bender stand {MIG}, and 'Brewtus 10' brewing system {TIG}A big Mahalo to Gar, 7A749 et al for lending technical assistance and encouraging prowess during the design/fab process. Really stoked on the outcome of my 1st MIG welding project. Attached ImagesLast edited by ManoKai; 05-28-2013 at 10:35 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Nice wheels but, why would you paint a welding binch?
Reply:Not sure what happened, double posted.Last edited by Gar; 05-29-2013 at 12:04 AM.Reason: Double postLincoln Electric, Power MIG 256Hypertherm Powermax 45 Miller Dynasty 280DXSmith O/A torchGenesis of a welding table
Reply:Nice looking table bro! Attention to detail looks good!  ...Where have I seen those wheels before??? The paint job adds a nice touch of class. GarLincoln Electric, Power MIG 256Hypertherm Powermax 45 Miller Dynasty 280DXSmith O/A torchGenesis of a welding table
Reply:@ Gar - mahalo bro for the cool-caster idea. Ripped 'em from you. Ha!  The good news: identical casters will make their way to the 1.5" x 1.5" x 0.120" (11 guage) SS square membets of the 'Brutus 10 BrewHaHa Rig' in da worx.....Aloha."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Yo bro, came out great! A drawer underneath would be awesome, trust me! I just use my drawer for a dust tray, clipped off mig and tig wire and all sorts of stuff. And also keeps your floor clean. Anyway its's awesome I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Cool, I like it.      That is how most tables start out, nice and pretty. THEN you start adding goodies to them as the ideas pop up.. Holders for clamps, grinders, hammers,  cup holder and receiver tube for vise or bench grinder. It never stops.
Reply:@ weldermike - like it.  Thx for the props. Got ur PM. Will hit ya.@ BD1 - zactlly. Crawl, walk, and run. Def have a few add-ons in mind.Last edited by ManoKai; 06-02-2013 at 02:44 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Cut off the 3 lower cross members. They're going to restrict your movement and make u feel stuck underneath that thing, especially if you're tig welding with a foot pedal. You'll soon see what I mean lolWelding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Originally Posted by MikeGyverCut off the 3 lower cross members. They're going to restrict your movement and make u feel stuck underneath that thing, especially if you're tig welding with a foot pedal. You'll soon see what I mean lol
Reply:Mods, please delete this post.  It was duplicated in the upload process.Thanks!GarLast edited by Gar; 06-02-2013 at 06:11 PM.Lincoln Electric, Power MIG 256Hypertherm Powermax 45 Miller Dynasty 280DXSmith O/A torchGenesis of a welding table
Reply:Originally Posted by MikeGyverCut off the 3 lower cross members. They're going to restrict your movement and make u feel stuck underneath that thing, especially if you're tig welding with a foot pedal. You'll soon see what I mean lol
Reply:@ WelderMike & Gar - Check.  The lower three horizontals are 7" off the deck.@ MikeGyver - would like you to research the following topics and then report back:* Operator preference and design intent* Statics "101", FreeBodyDiagrams* Designing for lateral and torsional stability in steel structures * Euler buckling & flexural buckling resistance Extra Credit: Difference between ASD & LFRD methodologies {AISC's SCM}Last edited by ManoKai; 06-02-2013 at 06:55 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Originally Posted by ManoKai@ MikeGyver - would like you to research the following topics and then report back:* Operator preference and design intent* Statics "101", FreeBodyDiagrams* Designing for lateral and torsional stability in steel structures * Euler buckling & flexural buckling resistance Extra Credit: Difference between ASD & LFRD methodologies {AISC's SCM}
Reply:Very nice looking table. Nice craftsmenship. How do the level casters work? How do you extend the foot?
Reply:These are the kind we have on our tables, you turn the orange knob to raise/lower.  The problem is, the orange knob is not so easy to tun by hand under an 800 pound table.  They also sell a model with a ratcheting lever that can be extended out:Gar Attached ImagesLast edited by Gar; 06-02-2013 at 07:18 PM.Lincoln Electric, Power MIG 256Hypertherm Powermax 45 Miller Dynasty 280DXSmith O/A torchGenesis of a welding table
Reply:Thanks for the response Gar thats how i thought they worked. Nice looking casters.
Reply:Alas! Our welding n fabrication table has been sold. The end of the beginning, and the start of a new journey. The star that shines twice as bright burns for half as long.  As she has burned so very bright for two and one-half years.Now.  We're "Go for Throttle Up" with a new vehicle. "Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
Reply:Hi Kai,What are your plans for the next table?Jerry30+ yrs Army Infantry & Field Artillery, 25 yrs agoMiller 350LX Tig Runner TA 210, spool gunLincoln 250/250 IdealArcESAB PCM 500i PlasmaKazoo 30"  vert BSKazoo 9x16 horiz BSClausing 12x24 lathe20T Air Press
Reply:@ storeman - aloha Jerry. Optioning across the tradespace. Used Acorn, Used Bluco, New Siegmund, and New BuildPro.  Decided to forego the custom design/build route as our requirement is for a Nitrided (58-60 HRC) precision fixturing table.  Discovered, after obtaining several time n material quotes for water jetting/CNC milling & fly-cutting services, that an OEM solution trumps the cost/schedule for a DIY table.The 16 Series Siegmunds (Germany) sure are trick.The journey continues. Last edited by ManoKai; 10-27-2015 at 03:48 PM."Discovery is to see what everybody else has seen, and to think what nobody else has thought" - Albert Szent-Gyorgyi