Generator Exercise

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I know there are a lot of generator guys here so I have a question about exercise. Onan recommends 2 hours every month at 50% load for my QD 3200 diesel RV generator. I can see the importance of this in certain climates, but how important is it in a desert climate for a unit stored indoors away from moisture and temperature extremes?Miller Challenger 172Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC 225/150Miller Maxstar 150 STLVictor 100CVictor JourneymanOxweld OAHarris O/ASmith O/A little torchNo, that's not my car.
Reply:If you want it to start when you really need it, then you need to exercise it. Otherwise you will end up with a plugged injector, gummed up pump, dead battery, etc. just let it transfer and run the house, might consider adding a load to give it something to work it, a handle of water heater elements, or even flood lights that come on when it exercises would do the job.
Reply:I think it is a lubrication thing more than anything. Engines need to be run regularly or they breakdown more rapidly. Things like bearings, bushings and seals will dry out if you don't run the engine once in a while to circulate oil throughout the engine. For gas engines, you need to exercise the electronics as well to make sure there is no moisture ingress. Finally there are things like mice, spiders, etc that get in there and cause damage as well if you don't regularly run an engineMiller Multimatic 255
Reply:Originally Posted by bigbI know there are a lot of generator guys here so I have a question about exercise. Onan recommends 2 hours every month at 50% load for my QD 3200 diesel RV generator. I can see the importance of this in certain climates, but how important is it in a desert climate for a unit stored indoors away from moisture and temperature extremes?
Reply:The biggest concern I’d think would and could be an immediate problem with today’s ethanol gases is clogging the carburetors or injectors.  I like to drain fuel tanks and run the fuel system dry till it peters out.  Never had a problem starting any engine regardless of how many years it sat using this method.  You mentioned it being diesel.  Diesel does not break down like gas or not as fast anyway.  Don’t run it out of fuel to store it.Seals on cranks and cams etc will go bad over time anyway.  They may go bad a little sooner if you don’t keep up on the maintenance “especially oil changes”. Prime the engine oil with out fuel by cranking it over for a little while before adding gas to a gas tank or installing the fuel fuses/relay for fuel pump etc when starting the engine after a period of rest.  The engine should be good to go after you prime it.  Oil degrades just sitting in an engine regardless of hours running or not so if you let something sit for longer than a year then change the oil before normal operations again.  Not familiar with that engine so not sure how to prime the engine with oil with out starting the engine.  On some 100% mechanical diesels there is no electronics to cut off the fuel delivery.  In those cases it might be best to run the engine every few months to cycle the oil.If you are going to let it sit for a long time and you are close to the oil change interval because of time since last oil change or hours on the clock it might be a good idea to change the oil and run the engine for a minute or so then run it out of fuel.  This will lubricate all the seals and bearings with fresh oil.  Once again don’t run the diesel out of fuelLast thing I’d consider is battery life.  If you are not running it every month or two keeping the battery charged then you want to keep an automatic trickle charger on the battery to keep it topped off and ready to go next time you need to use it.  Make sure the fluids in the battery are maintained as well so the battery charger does not burn up the battery.That was a lot of rambling lol.  Do what the manual says for best results Last edited by N2 Welding; 02-17-2021 at 12:22 PM.Lincoln, ESAB, Thermal Dynamics, Victor, Miller, Dewalt, Makita, Kalamzoo.  Hand tools, power tools, welding and cutting tools.
Reply:A few clarifications:1. It is diesel so no worries about ethanol or varnish.2. I wasn't planning on letting it sit for 6 months, just asking how important the monthly recommendation is considering it is stored in a dry, rodent free and somewhat temperature controlled environment. That has to matter, it certainly does with a vehicle.3. The battery is the coach battery which is maintained all of the time.So considering the storage environment I was wondering if skipping a month here and there would hurt anything. It does start and run great now, and it is 10 years old with 182 hours on it so doing the math it is apparent it has not been exercised 2 hours per month which would be 240 hours just for the exercise alone. I understand the lubrication aspect of the engine, what I don't understand it exactly how the generating section works and what benefit, if any, it gets from regular exercise.Again, hoping to hear from some of our resident generator experts.As a side note, I also have a Honda eu2000i that I put away for the winter. I first ran it to warm it up, then changed the oil, then ran it completely out of fuel and put it in a temperature controlled storage area. Is this a bad idea?Last edited by bigb; 02-17-2021 at 01:21 PM.Miller Challenger 172Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC 225/150Miller Maxstar 150 STLVictor 100CVictor JourneymanOxweld OAHarris O/ASmith O/A little torchNo, that's not my car.
Reply:Best thing I've found for small gas engines is non ethanol gas if you can buy it nearby. The ethanol absorbs moisture from the atmosphere and that's when fuel system problems arise. Since I've started buying it I don't have to run the fuel system dry.Ol' Stonebreaker  "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:Originally Posted by mla2ofusBest thing I've found for small gas engines is non ethanol gas if you can buy it nearby. The ethanol absorbs moisture from the atmosphere and that's when fuel system problems arise. Since I've started buying it I don't have to run the fuel system dry.
Reply:It may be a urban legend but i have heard of generators not charging if they had sit for a long time, loss of magnatisim or something.
Reply:Originally Posted by Ky farmerIt may be a urban legend but i have heard of generators not charging if they had sit for a long time, loss of magnatisim or something.
Reply:Originally Posted by mla2ofusWith one I worked on it's a fact. I'd heard of applying 12vDC to the fields and it worked. I think some have capacitors to store voltage for field excitation instead of magnets and the capacitors must drain down over time with non use. Another trick I've heard of but haven't had occasion to try is to plug an electric drill in while the gennie is running and by hand turn the drill so the drill motor's magnets can excite the fields.
Reply:Originally Posted by ronsiiThis would probably only work with an older brushed drill motor and then it would have to be a drill that would run on DC power too.
Reply:Diesel can be prone to fuel problems as well. Especially if it has any amount of biodiesel in it. We have 2 large standby generators. 1 is a 150kw that is 26 years old that doesn’t get exercised very often. We also have a 800 kw that we have had for 10 years. The bigger one has gotten exercised the last year on a regular basis but previously did not. We change fuel out seasonally. The biggest problems we have had are batteries when the trickle charger goes to potMillermatic 252millermatic 175miller 300 Thunderboltlincoln ranger 250smith torcheslots of bfh'sIf it dont fit get a bigger hammer
Reply:For the small honda generator you will want to drain the bowl as you stated. Preferable to add fuel stabilizer to any stored fuel or better yet drain it for long term. Even if methanol free fuel it will varnish and plug the jets which will require some work to fix. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by mcspeedFor the small honda generator you will want to drain the bowl as you stated. Preferable to add fuel stabilizer to any stored fuel or better yet drain it for long term. Even if methanol free fuel it will varnish and plug the jets which will require some work to fix. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by 12V71Don't waste your money on "fuel stabilizers" with ethanol fuel. They don't work. And ethanol fuel doesn't "varnish" carburetor passages, it corrodes the zinc base alloys they use now a days and plugs them with zinc oxide flakes that aren't going to be dissolved by anything that wont dissolve the carburetor body. Draining the fuel system is the only solution for preventing that problem. I've had to replace 3 carbs on small engines already that were beyond repair from ethanol gas. Now it's all non ethanol gas in all the small engines. First pull starts are a good thing after they have been sitting for a few months.
Reply:Originally Posted by bigbA few clarifications:1. It is diesel so no worries about ethanol or varnish.2. I wasn't planning on letting it sit for 6 months, just asking how important the monthly recommendation is considering it is stored in a dry, rodent free and somewhat temperature controlled environment. That has to matter, it certainly does with a vehicle.3. The battery is the coach battery which is maintained all of the time.So considering the storage environment I was wondering if skipping a month here and there would hurt anything. It does start and run great now, and it is 10 years old with 182 hours on it so doing the math it is apparent it has not been exercised 2 hours per month which would be 240 hours just for the exercise alone. I understand the lubrication aspect of the engine, what I don't understand it exactly how the generating section works and what benefit, if any, it gets from regular exercise.Again, hoping to hear from some of our resident generator experts.As a side note, I also have a Honda eu2000i that I put away for the winter. I first ran it to warm it up, then changed the oil, then ran it completely out of fuel and put it in a temperature controlled storage area. Is this a bad idea?
Reply:Originally Posted by Ky farmerIt may be a urban legend but i have heard of generators not charging if they had sit for a long time, loss of magnatisim or something.
Reply:Some things are hard to understand.  I have a chain saw I bought new 35 years ago. Never drained the tank or added stabilizer. Has been stored  without exercise for over a year and she fired after a few pulls. I’m thinking the two stroke oil in the gas helps tremendously.  Maybe add two stroke oil to 4 stroke fuel before storing?  Will likely help on the needle/seat issues as well as varnishing. Also on the corrosion from methanol. I have a jet ski that sat for 6 mos in the summer and it ran rough from bad fuel. Changed it and ran good.  Now using stabilizer so will see what happens. Just sharing my experiences.  No one size fits all but my experiences don’t align with what some folks claim to be true :-). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by mcspeedSome things are hard to understand.  I have a chain saw I bought new 35 years ago. Never drained the tank or added stabilizer. Has been stored  without exercise for over a year and she fired after a few pulls. I’m thinking the two stroke oil in the gas helps tremendously.  Maybe add two stroke oil to 4 stroke fuel before storing?  Will likely help on the needle/seat issues as well as varnishing. Also on the corrosion from methanol. I have a jet ski that sat for 6 mos in the summer and it ran rough from bad fuel. Changed it and ran good.  Now using stabilizer so will see what happens. Just sharing my experiences.  No one size fits all but my experiences don’t align with what some folks claim to be true :-). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by mcspeedSome things are hard to understand.  I have a chain saw I bought new 35 years ago. Never drained the tank or added stabilizer. Has been stored  without exercise for over a year and she fired after a few pulls. I’m thinking the two stroke oil in the gas helps tremendously.  Maybe add two stroke oil to 4 stroke fuel before storing?  Will likely help on the needle/seat issues as well as varnishing. Also on the corrosion from methanol. I have a jet ski that sat for 6 mos in the summer and it ran rough from bad fuel. Changed it and ran good.  Now using stabilizer so will see what happens. Just sharing my experiences.  No one size fits all but my experiences don’t align with what some folks claim to be true :-). Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Non ethanol gas is available in Arizona, by the quart in hardware stores and places that sell small engine equipped power tools. I found an article or write-up somewhere several years ago about gas, the author said you can remove the ethanol using water, and it does make sense, water and alcohol are soluble, add water to the gas and shake it up good and set it where you can siphon the gas off the top of the alcohol/water mix. I haven't personally tried it but it sounds logical. There are also additives that claim to remove or neutralize the ethanol. The links below talk about an "ethanator", I had no luck finding one online, but it's not needed.https://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Ethanol-from-Gashttps://sciencing.com/remove-ethanol...e-7830109.htmlLast edited by CAVEMANN; 02-18-2021 at 06:36 PM.IMPEACH BIDEN!NRA LIFE MEMBERUNITWELD 175 AMP 3 IN1 DCMIDSTATES 300 AMP AC MACHINEGOD HELP AMERICA!“Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.We didn’t pass it to our children in the bloodstream".RONALD REAGAN
Reply:Originally Posted by bigbI've heard a lot about the lubrication advantages of 2 stroke oil and a lot of people swear by it as a diesel fuel additive in pre-SCR engines. I believe there is probably some truth to it.
Reply:Originally Posted by CAVEMANNNon ethanol gas is available in Arizona, by the quart in hardware stores and places that sell small engine equipped power tools. I found an article or write-up somewhere several years ago about gas, the author said you can remove the ethanol using water, and it does make sense, water and alcohol are soluble, add water to the gas and shake it up good and set it where you can siphon the gas off the top of the alcohol/water mix. I haven't personally tried it but it sounds logical. There are also additives that claim to remove or neutralize the ethanol. The links below talk about an "ethanator", I had no luck finding one online, but it's not needed.https://www.wikihow.com/Remove-Ethanol-from-Gashttps://sciencing.com/remove-ethanol...e-7830109.html
Reply:Here in Minnesota non oxygenated gas is available as premium octane for off road and collector vehicles. If I was buying a small standby generator it would be a lp or natural gas to avoid fuel problemsMillermatic 252millermatic 175miller 300 Thunderboltlincoln ranger 250smith torcheslots of bfh'sIf it dont fit get a bigger hammerFortunately I can still buy (and do) ethanol free gas... can get 87 or 92... I just stick with the 87octane.. pretty much run the little service truck on it most of the time and there IS a big difference in performance and milage!!! also fill up my big genny in the truck with it and extra gas cans now and then for the small motors.. both the card lock fuel suppliers we use carry it in several locations as well as red for the machines and I have seen I think a shell station at one of the indian casinos that sells eth free... although they have a high price on theirs
Reply:Originally Posted by bigbInteresting. We used to have ethanol free gas in the summer but I guess by now they figure most of the old cars that were prone to vapor lock are gone now and we now get it year round with ethanol. I did buy a quart of the stuff you described at Ace once for a gas blower but it was so expensive it would be cheaper to replace or rebuild the carb.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmshopHere in Minnesota non oxygenated gas is available as premium octane for off road and collector vehicles. If I was buying a small standby generator it would be a lp or natural gas to avoid fuel problems
Reply:There is a guy on youtube who is a guru for quick and inexpensive fixes for carbs, fuel, ignition etc. problems on small engines such as mowers, blowers, generators, weed whackers, power washers etc.  He's got some really easy fixes for carbs that are plugged up in particular.  Check him out..."Steve's Small Engine Saloon".https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpq...YDN-BIHUQ2TfAA
Reply:Well if you can't get the ethanol free stuff where you live consider making your own... really!!!!  it's pretty simple   you don't even need a bunch of specialized equipment either.  Simple process -: All you need is a gas container with a tap in the bottom of it and a small valve on that.1. Fill a container with gasoline that has ethanol mixed with it.2. Dump some water in the same container you put the gas in.3. Shake/mix it up.4. Let it sit a little while.5. Draw the water/ethanol off the bottom of the container.6. Ethanol free gas is what's left in the container Fortunately we can still buy it here... or at least it says it's eth-free  but seriously it is a VERY noticeable difference in how the motors run when using it.Filled up yesterday  If the liberal leftist politicians do outlaw selling it here I WILL process it myself... in bulk
Reply:Originally Posted by ronsiiWell if you can't get the ethanol free stuff where you live consider making your own... really!!!!  it's pretty simple   you don't even need a bunch of specialized equipment either.  Simple process -: All you need is a gas container with a tap in the bottom of it and a small valve on that.1. Fill a container with gasoline that has ethanol mixed with it.2. Dump some water in the same container you put the gas in.3. Shake/mix it up.4. Let it sit a little while.5. Draw the water/ethanol off the bottom of the container.6. Ethanol free gas is what's left in the container Fortunately we can still buy it here... or at least it says it's eth-free  but seriously it is a VERY noticeable difference in how the motors run when using it.Filled up yesterday  If the liberal leftist politicians do outlaw selling it here I WILL process it myself... in bulk
Reply:Originally Posted by CAVEMANNI wonder if the non-ethanol is more readily available in the northwest because of the logging industry?
Reply:There are ethanol specific fuel stabilizers that work pretty well although if I buy a few cans of ethanol gas expecting to use it soon I pour it into a vehicle after a few months to keep it reasonably fresh.And I add a shot of Lucas injector/carb cleaner and before filling the cans or the tank of seldom used equipment, regardless of gas type or whether it's diesel, and that goes a long way to keeping occasional use carbs/injectors clean.Be very careful flashing a generator field as they all may have different needs.  Using 12 volts on a some engine drive welders will ruin circuit boards (some Rangers, if memory serves, only use 2.5 volts).  It's best to use an actual factory service/repair manual.Yes, from long military experience supervising nearly 70 mechanics maintaining wheeled and tracked vehicles, generators, water and bulk fuel pumps, construction equipment etc that often sat for too long, seals and gaskets often need to be exercised to keep their resiliency. Seal life is often drastically shortened when dis-used.  And over time literally all the lube would run off bearings and you'd be starting dry bearings with all the bad things that implies.  In fact after a specified number of days without operating some vehicles and equipment with separate starter and fuel switches had starting procedures that recommended cranking the engine without fuel for XX seconds before turning the fuel on to allow for pressure lubing the engine prior to starting.And if you do run things for exercise it needs to be for long enough and at a high enough load to dry all condensation out of the exhaust and crankcase and to get things hot enough prevent new condensation from forming when you shut down. Many engines, particularly diesels will not get hot enough to really seat the piston rings without a load and will have excessive "blow-by" of incomplete burnt fuel, which is now acidic, pass the rings and wind up in the crankcase where the oil system bathes the parts in newly acidic oil.  Hence the need to run long and hot enough to dry out the condensation that was there and to prevent new condensation.  Exhaust systems are particularly prone to corrosion when not heated high and long enough which is why some welders have weep holes in the bottom of elbows and muffler cans.Now please excuse me while I put this soapbox away and go make my wife breakfast. Best regards to all,LanceMultimatic 255 w/MDX-250 EZ-Select gunHypertherm Powermax45 XPHeck Bevel Mill 4000Miller/Smith heavy duty torch set9" Evolution circular saw
Reply:Originally Posted by ronsiiI really don't know... kinda doubt it if by that you mean gas for chainsaws??? most of the real logging is mechanized with 600+HP fellers  while we sthil  use 2stroke saws and lots of other little guys do it really doesn't use all that much gas to fell,limb and buck logs by hand... I would guess there are more people running way more gallons per month in recreation type things... boats, skidoos, atvs, motos, sleds, aircraft, etc... lots of water around here so lots of boats But seriously... back to the make it yourself eth-free gas.... There are plenty of DIY sites on how to do it and videos!!! very easy to do safely and cheaply   although given the current state of censoring going on you can bet that a lot of this info will be disappearing soon if it gets more 'light' shone on it  because they wouldn't want you making a non-clean fuel  as it's probably already against federal law to 'modify' fuel
Reply:Originally Posted by CAVEMANNI didn't stop to think about the fellers, I just know that the average person can't afford to buy it in 1 quart cans at the big box stores or farm & ranch stores. I guess they're counting on folks not knowing they can make their own.