Trailer upgrade project

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Hey yall been out after my surgery and recovering now I'm bout done with that I'm starting on my welding trailer project. I bought this trailer from a friend for 200 it is made from 4"c and 3" supports and two supports are 2" on the frame. The walls are 2x2x1/4 angle with 2x2x1/8 angle supports. I started with  the wood it wasn't great some good some bad so I pulled it off. Next I ripped off the loading gate because it was a absolute hack job! I broke the welds on it by using a pry bar to lift the wood  " you can see the welds in the pic if you zoom). The next thing I did was grind the horrible welds off the fenders. I'm going to groove them out and reweld them Thursday. I also noticed some missed welds underneath and some I just didn't like that will be redone. I was also thinking of adding another support right up at the front in the middle because the machine will be sitting there.I will also be building on to the walls to make 15" walls and then I'm gonna build a lead holder and some bottle racks for oxy/actyl. Any ideas or input lets hear it!  I have 3 20'ft sticks of 2x2x1/8 angle 9ft 2x2x1/4 tubing and about 5' of 1x1 tubing and some solid steel half inch bar for the lead wraps.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Hey yall been out after my surgery and recovering now I'm bout done with that I'm starting on my welding trailer project. I bought this trailer from a friend for 200 it is made from 4"c and 3" supports and two supports are 2" on the frame. The walls are 2x2x1/4 angle with 2x2x1/8 angle supports. I started with  the wood it wasn't great some good some bad so I pulled it off. Next I ripped off the loading gate because it was a absolute hack job! I broke the welds on it by using a pry bar to lift the wood  " you can see the welds in the pic if you zoom). The next thing I did was grind the horrible welds off the fenders. I'm going to groove them out and reweld them Thursday. I also noticed some missed welds underneath and some I just didn't like that will be redone. I was also thinking of adding another support right up at the front in the middle because the machine will be sitting there.I will also be building on to the walls to make 15" walls and then I'm gonna build a lead holder and some bottle racks for oxy/actyl. Any ideas or input lets hear it!  I have 3 20'ft sticks of 2x2x1/8 angle 9ft 2x2x1/4 tubing and about 5' of 1x1 tubing and some solid steel half inch bar for the lead wraps.
Reply:Is the frame an old camper with the leveling jacks on the rear? best of luck.
Reply:Originally Posted by John K.Is the frame an old camper with the leveling jacks on the rear? best of luck.
Reply:I would add an upright in front and back of each fender to help that area.Yeah, I know, but it'll be ok!Lincoln Square wave 255Miller Vintage mig30a spoolgunThermal Dynamics Pacmaster 100xl plasmaSmith mc torchEllis 1600 band saw
Reply:Looks like it will be a good project. Good luck. Also, nice choice of tape measure, I use that same model also.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Yea it's a 82 Starcraft according to the vin I kinda like the little jacks and thanks
Reply:Originally Posted by BistineauThose jacks, if they still work right, will come in handy on the welding trailer. If it will be only used as a welding trailer, you won't need a loading ramp any more, but a small fold down work table could be a real asset for the back end.Are you going to mount the Champion lengthwise or crosswise to the trailer?
Reply:Originally Posted by TypeLooks like it will be a good project. Good luck. Also, nice choice of tape measure, I use that same model also.
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjI would add an upright in front and back of each fender to help that area.
Reply:[QUOTE=drussell0104;5450331] I'm gonna get a new axle and some rims for bigger tires./QUOTE]When you get the rims and tires, be sure to get THREE of them. You will be needing a spare for the trailer, so you don't have to leave it on the side of the road while you go get a replacement. You might come back only to find the PLACE you left the trailer. So while your redoing the trailer, figure on where you want to make a spare tire mount. There will most likely come a time when you are glad to have the spare on board.
Reply:Looks like it's going to be a good project. Want to see updated pictures as you move along.Lincoln Pro Mig 180Lincoln Pro Core 125Hypertherm 30xpPorter Cable Drill PressAcra 7x12 bandsaw48" sheet metal brakeCrap load of other tools, working on metal now.
Reply:[QUOTE=Bistineau;5451141] Originally Posted by drussell0104 I'm gonna get a new axle and some rims for bigger tires./QUOTE]When you get the rims and tires, be sure to get THREE of them. You will be needing a spare for the trailer, so you don't have to leave it on the side of the road while you go get a replacement. You might come back only to find the PLACE you left the trailer. So while your redoing the trailer, figure on where you want to make a spare tire mount. There will most likely come a time when you are glad to have the spare on board.
Reply:Originally Posted by KMcCurdyLooks like it's going to be a good project. Want to see updated pictures as you move along.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104I'll keep  updating pics as I go. I've gotta figure out the measurements for the new axle tommrow answer how I'm gonna do the hangers. Then once that's decided get to chopping after I get the stuff this weekend
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjWhere are you going to get your axle? I could probly get you a discount at redneck.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Hey yall been out after my surgery and recovering now I'm bout done with that I'm starting on my welding trailer project. I bought this trailer from a friend for 200 it is made from 4"c and 3" supports and two supports are 2" on the frame. The walls are 2x2x1/4 angle with 2x2x1/8 angle supports. I started with  the wood it wasn't great some good some bad so I pulled it off. Next I ripped off the loading gate because it was a absolute hack job! I broke the welds on it by using a pry bar to lift the wood  " you can see the welds in the pic if you zoom). The next thing I did was grind the horrible welds off the fenders. I'm going to groove them out and reweld them Thursday. I also noticed some missed welds underneath and some I just didn't like that will be redone. I was also thinking of adding another support right up at the front in the middle because the machine will be sitting there.I will also be building on to the walls to make 15" walls and then I'm gonna build a lead holder and some bottle racks for oxy/actyl. Any ideas or input lets hear it!  I have 3 20'ft sticks of 2x2x1/8 angle 9ft 2x2x1/4 tubing and about 5' of 1x1 tubing and some solid steel half inch bar for the lead wraps.
Reply:If it was my trailer I would put something across where the old wheels were. Between the spring perches this will strengthen up the frame and give you something to attach the floor to there.Ypop
Reply:Hate to be the bearer of bad news You mounted your axle upside down.  Way you have it mounted it's in negative camber, the bend in the middle is supposed to be on the top."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Hey, I got to thinking while I was running water to the cows.I wondered if you were trying to gain additional clearance by flipping the axle.As I mentioned, it's necessary to install the axle with positive camber.  Camber is for tire wear, it flattens out as the trailer is loaded, and the wheels run relatively square to the pavement.So, If you need to flip an axle, it's necessary to place the pad on the opposite side from where it is, to preserve the factory camber.Not a biggy.Clamp the pad on the opposite side, then measure the distance between both ears, they should measure the same. Remember to make sure the distance between perches is the same as original. Tack and weld.I called the Dexter plant in Oklahoma with a question when I did this.  "Is it ok to weld on the other side from the original pad?"  They gave me the thumbsup, and I called it good.  Make sure it's above 50 degrees, if not, preheat a bit.  There will be a slight camber change due to the welds, but it's superficial.  I did the welds in 4 segments.  Halfway to the middle on each side of the pad alternately, then repeat.  Keeps distortion down.Like I say, it's not a biggy.You'll probably have to remove the old pad, maybe not.  It depends on whether the u bolts will fit.  If you have to remove the old pad, make sure that you don't nick the axle tube with the grinder, this will create a weak spot in the tube.Last edited by farmersamm; 02-27-2015 at 03:35 PM."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Sams right!And your rear spring hanger is too far back.The shackle should be just forward of vertical with no load.
Reply:Originally Posted by YpopIf it was my trailer I would put something across where the old wheels were. Between the spring perches this will strengthen up the frame and give you something to attach the floor to there.Ypop
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersamm  Hate to be the bearer of bad news You mounted your axle upside down.  Way you have it mounted it's in negative camber, the bend in the middle is supposed to be on the top.
Reply:Originally Posted by rexcormackSams right!And your rear spring hanger is too far back.The shackle should be just forward of vertical with no load.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammHey, I got to thinking while I was running water to the cows.I wondered if you were trying to gain additional clearance by flipping the axle.As I mentioned, it's necessary to install the axle with positive camber.  Camber is for tire wear, it flattens out as the trailer is loaded, and the wheels run relatively square to the pavement.So, If you need to flip an axle, it's necessary to place the pad on the opposite side from where it is, to preserve the factory camber.Not a biggy.Clamp the pad on the opposite side, then measure the distance between both ears, they should measure the same. Remember to make sure the distance between perches is the same as original. Tack and weld.I called the Dexter plant in Oklahoma with a question when I did this.  "Is it ok to weld on the other side from the original pad?"  They gave me the thumbsup, and I called it good.  Make sure it's above 50 degrees, if not, preheat a bit.  There will be a slight camber change due to the welds, but it's superficial.  I did the welds in 4 segments.  Halfway to the middle on each side of the pad alternately, then repeat.  Keeps distortion down.Like I say, it's not a biggy.You'll probably have to remove the old pad, maybe not.  It depends on whether the u bolts will fit.  If you have to remove the old pad, make sure that you don't nick the axle tube with the grinder, this will create a weak spot in the tube.Originally Posted by farmersamm  Hate to be the bearer of bad news You mounted your axle upside down.  Way you have it mounted it's in negative camber, the bend in the middle is supposed to be on the top.
Reply:Just wondering, how good of welds are on that trailer? I got an old torsion axle trailer last year from a lawn care business and the welds on it were horrible. It looks like they were trying to MIG weld it without any form of shielding.
Reply:Originally Posted by TypeJust wondering, how good of welds are on that trailer? I got an old torsion axle trailer last year from a lawn care business and the welds on it were horrible. It looks like they were trying to MIG weld it without any form of shielding.
Reply:All you need to do is set the axle on TOP of the springs instead of under it.  That's how most stock axles are now for lower profile.  The axle is hung with the u-bolts and over the top of the springs.  Might sound wrong, but it is right. If you use a straight tube axle, you can mount it either way.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:As lugweld said, your axle is made right. Unless you ask for otherwise, they come setup for springs under the axle which is the best way. Most axle manufacturers allow for under the spring mounting tho. If you choose to go under the springs you should be able to get new spring seats where you got your axle, otherwise you can order a pair from Redneck Trailer. If you can wait, I have a bunch on my shelf at home and I'll send you a pair on thurs. next week when I'm home next if you pm me your address.  If you do run it under the springs bent springs and broken hangers are much more likely. If I was doing this job I would put the axles over the springs then use a tube as a spacer to get the ride height you want. You could use that tube as a tie for your main rails where the space is that you need to bridge. If your plan is to use just one flat on the side of the frame I don't think that would be good enough.Yeah, I know, but it'll be ok!Lincoln Square wave 255Miller Vintage mig30a spoolgunThermal Dynamics Pacmaster 100xl plasmaSmith mc torchEllis 1600 band saw
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjAs lugweld said, your axle is made right. Unless you ask for otherwise, they come setup for springs under the axle which is the best way. Most axle manufacturers allow for under the spring mounting tho. If you choose to go under the springs you should be able to get new spring seats where you got your axle, otherwise you can order a pair from Redneck Trailer. If you can wait, I have a bunch on my shelf at home and I'll send you a pair on thurs. next week when I'm home next if you pm me your address.  If you do run it under the springs bent springs and broken hangers are much more likely. If I was doing this job I would put the axles over the springs then use a tube as a spacer to get the ride height you want. You could use that tube as a tie for your main rails where the space is that you need to bridge. If your plan is to use just one flat on the side of the frame I don't think that would be good enough.
Reply:Originally Posted by lugweldAll you need to do is set the axle on TOP of the springs instead of under it.  That's how most stock axles are now for lower profile.  The axle is hung with the u-bolts and over the top of the springs.  Might sound wrong, but it is right. If you use a straight tube axle, you can mount it either way.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Now that I keep looking at it I think I'm gonna do as you say and put the axle under the springs. A few inches will not make a big difference in what I want out of the trailer and especially if it's safer with less wear and tear. Also as I look I don't think I'll have a clearance problem with the tires losing 4-6 inches when I flip everything. As for the bracing your talking about no it will be two 4x1/4 plates on the inside and the outside and a 2 x 1/4 inch strip cut from the 4 in plates welded to the bottom and the top and everything welded together.     I don't want that thing flexing at all! I've got the materials to do everything I just need to get a stick or 2x2 tubing for the top bed rail this week. I changed doing it from angle to the tubing as I like the look better and it should hold well with the 2x2x1/4 angle supporting it. I've got 3 sticks of 2x2x1/8 angle to replace some old supports and add some more support in the frame. I think that will be plenty strong enough for this trailer. Sound good?
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjYes, but you may have misspoke, the axle should be above the springs. Just to make sure you have it right. The 4 flats should work fine, it's just more work than I would do. If that's your material then it's a good plan.As far as other supports a better description of your plan would be helpfull. The side rail plan sounds good as long as you get the uprights in the right place and join the front corners properly. Make sure you get your spring hangers set right too, they won't work like they are now.
Reply:Your hangers need to be prolly 2" closer together.You can find the correct bolt to bolt distance on the web.  Or I think Farmersamm posted a chart in my trailer thread.  I don't remember if it had single axle set ups on it or not.My name's not Jim....
Reply:Go to this link and scroll about two thirds to three quarters of the way down, look for "Parts Needed to Complete a Trailer Suspension System Single-Axle Suspension".. Look at the tiny pic below it. That's what folks are suggesting you try. http://www.etrailer.com/faq-Double-E...on-Review.aspxYeh the link says double eye but they do show the single axle way down on the page."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmYour hangers need to be prolly 2" closer together.You can find the correct bolt to bolt distance on the web.  Or I think Farmersamm posted a chart in my trailer thread.  I don't remember if it had single axle set ups on it or not.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyGo to this link and scroll about two thirds to three quarters of the way down, look for "Parts Needed to Complete a Trailer Suspension System Single-Axle Suspension".. Look at the tiny pic below it. That's what folks are suggesting you try. http://www.etrailer.com/faq-Double-E...on-Review.aspxYeh the link says double eye but they do show the single axle way down on the page.
Reply:Here is a pic of the proper way to mount an axle with a graph showing proper hanger spacing. Everything you need for a single axle setup should be here unless you have nonstandard parts.Yeah, I know, but it'll be ok!Lincoln Square wave 255Miller Vintage mig30a spoolgunThermal Dynamics Pacmaster 100xl plasmaSmith mc torchEllis 1600 band saw
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjAs lugweld said, your axle is made right. Unless you ask for otherwise, they come setup for springs under the axle which is the best way. Most axle manufacturers allow for under the spring mounting tho. If you choose to go under the springs you should be able to get new spring seats where you got your axle, otherwise you can order a pair from Redneck Trailer. If you can wait, I have a bunch on my shelf at home and I'll send you a pair on thurs. next week when I'm home next if you pm me your address.  If you do run it under the springs bent springs and broken hangers are much more likely. If I was doing this job I would put the axles over the springs then use a tube as a spacer to get the ride height you want. You could use that tube as a tie for your main rails where the space is that you need to bridge. If your plan is to use just one flat on the side of the frame I don't think that would be good enough.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammWhere do you come up with this bull****??  "Bent springs and broken hangers are much more likely"
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Hey yall been out after my surgery and recovering now I'm bout done with that I'm starting on my welding trailer project. I bought this trailer from a friend for 200 it is made from 4"c and 3" supports and two supports are 2" on the frame. The walls are 2x2x1/4 angle with 2x2x1/8 angle supports. I started with  the wood it wasn't great some good some bad so I pulled it off. Next I ripped off the loading gate because it was a absolute hack job! I broke the welds on it by using a pry bar to lift the wood  " you can see the welds in the pic if you zoom). The next thing I did was grind the horrible welds off the fenders. I'm going to groove them out and reweld them Thursday. I also noticed some missed welds underneath and some I just didn't like that will be redone. I was also thinking of adding another support right up at the front in the middle because the machine will be sitting there.I will also be building on to the walls to make 15" walls and then I'm gonna build a lead holder and some bottle racks for oxy/actyl. Any ideas or input lets hear it!  I have 3 20'ft sticks of 2x2x1/8 angle 9ft 2x2x1/4 tubing and about 5' of 1x1 tubing and some solid steel half inch bar for the lead wraps.Attachment 1009401Attachment 1009411Attachment 1009421Attachment 1009431Attachment 1009441
Reply:One of your springs is backwards.My name's not Jim....
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmOne of your springs is backwards.
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmOne of your springs is backwards.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104Motherf****  never again on a trailer
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmLOL.  No big deal.  I just would put the rivet holding the leafs together on the same side.  I'd put them towards the front, but I'm not sure it matters.
Reply:Originally Posted by drussell0104I'm not either I'll have to look into it idk if it will even affect it... This things been frustrating
Reply:Your spring hangers are still too far apart. Look at the pic I posted and you can see what they should look like. The table I posted will give you the proper measurements too. Yours may work like that, but they are not right. I would want to move them closer. I know they are at the edge of your frame, but that's why I suggested the tube filler, so you can mount your hangers correctly. At this point I don't know what to suggest about moving them again. They will probly work, but I'm not sure.Yeah, I know, but it'll be ok!Lincoln Square wave 255Miller Vintage mig30a spoolgunThermal Dynamics Pacmaster 100xl plasmaSmith mc torchEllis 1600 band saw
Reply:Originally Posted by welderjYour spring hangers are still too far apart. Look at the pic I posted and you can see what they should look like. The table I posted will give you the proper measurements too. Yours may work like that, but they are not right. I would want to move them closer. I know they are at the edge of your frame, but that's why I suggested the tube filler, so you can mount your hangers correctly. At this point I don't know what to suggest about moving them again. They will probly work, but I'm not sure.