Anybody Pull Liner With Seized Piston Inside?

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Engine has wet liners, but I don't know how much space there is between the liner, and block/cooling gallery.  If there's space, I'll maybe blow through the liner with plasma, and put a rod in the holes to pull it from the top.  Don't care to jack it out from the bottom if I don't have to.Entire stinkin' front axle has to come off to remove the crankcase.  Lovely.Same thing happened to the first Allis some time ago.  Now I have two identical paperweights.They start to run like they're running out of fuel, then seize up.  This one still barely turns, but the other one can't be turned with the starter.Both engines started stumbling before they went, blowing heavy black smoke for short periods.  Something, a hunch I guess, tells me it isn't the crank.
Reply:Doesn't do you any good now but it sounds like your original problem was a injector pump issue.Since the piston is toast anyway just bust it up with an air chisel.My machine shop buddy would cut a groove in the liner from top to bottom.Sorry, that's all I got.
Reply:You will still have to remove the pan to get at the rod bolts/nuts. I'll get a pic of my liner puller up later it's all done from the topside. First thing I would do is drain the oil into a clean pan and check for metal shavings, coppery stuff is bearings. Then cut the oil filters open and look for more metal. This could be a spun main bearing.  Also see if the crank has any end play,. 015 to 025 should be normal. If it wont move, again maybe a bearing problem.
Reply:Originally Posted by 12V71You will still have to remove the pan to get at the rod bolts/nuts. I'll get a pic of my liner puller up later it's all done from the topside. First thing I would do is drain the oil into a clean pan and check for metal shavings, coppery stuff is bearings. Then cut the oil filters open and look for more metal. This could be a spun main bearing.  Also see if the crank has any end play,. 015 to 025 should be normal. If it wont move, again maybe a bearing problem.
Reply:Soon as I eat lunch, it's out to the shop to make a set of adapters for the towbar, so I can get the POS home.  We have a guy that's gonna show up when we need air to inflate that rear tire,, my compressor runs off the welder for electricity, and the welder is down.
Reply:I worked on a Lincoln Towncar once that had engine problems.When I dropped the pan I saw 4 caps all with a number 2 stamped on them.  Someone in a junkyard went through and replaced parts with used ones (including bearings) that allowed it to run, but it started tapping after a month.Bearings were mismatched and the scoring on the crank had been clumsily filed off in some areas as well...Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmSoon as I eat lunch, it's out to the shop to make a set of adapters for the towbar, so I can get the POS home.  We have a guy that's gonna show up when we need air to inflate that rear tire,, my compressor runs off the welder for electricity, and the welder is down.
Reply:If the piston is down in the bore a ways I would make up a piece of steel with a 3/4" or so hole dead center to fit the bore. Weld that piece inside the bore on the sleeve. After getting the connecting rod cap off attach your bridge and threaded rod to pull the sleeve. The heat from the weld should cause the sleeve to shrink and break it's bond at the top of the block. You could try breaking up the piston as mentioned but you will still have issues getting the wrist pin busted out of the piston.
Reply:I've used that trick on liners that had a piston welded into them, normally I just welded a nut in the center of the plate.  All my liner pulling stuff is 7/8" fine thread.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmEngine has wet liners, but I don't know how much space there is between the liner, and block/cooling gallery.  If there's space, I'll maybe blow through the liner with plasma, and put a rod in the holes to pull it from the top.  Don't care to jack it out from the bottom if I don't have to.Entire stinkin' front axle has to come off to remove the crankcase.  Lovely.Same thing happened to the first Allis some time ago.  Now I have two identical paperweights.They start to run like they're running out of fuel, then seize up.  This one still barely turns, but the other one can't be turned with the starter.Both engines started stumbling before they went, blowing heavy black smoke for short periods.  Something, a hunch I guess, tells me it isn't the crank.
Reply:That's just what I wanted to hearI was so disgusted last night, I looked at some Deere's online.  Something in the 90-100hp range.  I just about fell out of my chair!!!  I simply can't afford even a well used one.When the first Allis seized, I talked to a salvage guy, forget what state he was in.............but he could set me up with a used engine for around 3K.  The only problem being, the 301cd motor was also used in combines..............If it came from a combine, it won't fit the tractors.  He said he needs the engine serial number to find a motor that would actually fit the tractor.  I forget what state it was....somewhere in the Midwest.  But worth it for a motor I guess.Your symptoms sound very like what happened to both tractors.  Started the last time ok, then restarts during the day got progressively harder (slow cranking), and then it finally quit.  Allis #1 is completely seized, Allis #2 stil turns over, but like molasses.   I quit after a few seconds, and let it be.The one that seized yesterday was running strange for about 3 days.  Acted like it wasn't getting any fuel.  Loping idle, with occasional large cloud of black smoke.I'd wager that neither tractor ever had a valve cover lifted in the 50ish years they've been around.  God only knows how many hours they have on them.  Hell.......the Oliver is brushing up against 7000hrs.  I believe it was built in 1964.  Still runs good, but.................................  Cleanest oil I've ever seen on a diesel, just starting to show some soot the last year or so.  Only thing I've had to do to the Perkins is replace a piston, rings, pin, and liner, when I broke a ring and scored the liner.  That was TWENTY years ago.  The Oliver is strictly a hay tractor these days.
Reply:Was a time, you could simply go out and buy another tractor for about 4-5K.  These were not popular tractors UNTIL NOW.  The market is hot for the old tractors that can still be fixed without all the computer BS.  There's a few cheap 190XT's out there, but they're all up North.  Saw one listed for TEN GRAND...........new paint  Ad says it has 2500 original hrs if I recall...........Hell, might be legit.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmThat's just what I wanted to hearI was so disgusted last night, I looked at some Deere's online.  Something in the 90-100hp range.  I just about fell out of my chair!!!  I simply can't afford even a well used one.When the first Allis seized, I talked to a salvage guy, forget what state he was in.............but he could set me up with a used engine for around 3K.  The only problem being, the 301cd motor was also used in combines..............If it came from a combine, it won't fit the tractors.  He said he needs the engine serial number to find a motor that would actually fit the tractor.  I forget what state it was....somewhere in the Midwest.  But worth it for a motor I guess.Your symptoms sound very like what happened to both tractors.  Started the last time ok, then restarts during the day got progressively harder (slow cranking), and then it finally quit.  Allis #1 is completely seized, Allis #2 stil turns over, but like molasses.   I quit after a few seconds, and let it be.The one that seized yesterday was running strange for about 3 days.  Acted like it wasn't getting any fuel.  Loping idle, with occasional large cloud of black smoke.I'd wager that neither tractor ever had a valve cover lifted in the 50ish years they've been around.  God only knows how many hours they have on them.  Hell.......the Oliver is brushing up against 7000hrs.  I believe it was built in 1964.  Still runs good, but.................................  Cleanest oil I've ever seen on a diesel, just starting to show some soot the last year or so.  Only thing I've had to do to the Perkins is replace a piston, rings, pin, and liner, when I broke a ring and scored the liner.  That was TWENTY years ago.  The Oliver is strictly a hay tractor these days.
Reply:I did a wet-sleeve engine once and once you got the head off, you just turned the crank and the sleeves popped out with the pistons. Then you undid the crank bearing and out it came. You would have to make a plate to keep the good sleeves in place when you turned the crank but the untethered one should pop. I hope I understood your dilemma and I’m not teaching you how to suck eggs…?Do not believe everything that you think.
Reply:If the LN was in good condition (never got around to putting the new hood on), I'd run up and snag this one  https://www.purplewave.com/auction/2...Tractor-KansasTruck needs front tires, and new hood and inside fender skirts (blowout when I was hauling hay out of Texas back in 2012).  Haven't even fired it up in years.  Probably ok, but needs oil pressure put to it before it even gets cranked.  Was a tough old bird.  Wonderful running 6-71, 10spd, single axle.  Used as a backup to the cabover, when the cabover needed work.
Reply:I'd bet that Massey has the same motor as the Oliver.  Perkins is almost indestructible.  It looks the same as the Oliver.
Reply:Originally Posted by XsbankI did a wet-sleeve engine once and once you got the head off, you just turned the crank and the sleeves popped out with the pistons. Then you undid the crank bearing and out it came. You would have to make a plate to keep the good sleeves in place when you turned the crank but the untethered one should pop. I hope I understood your dilemma and I’m not teaching you how to suck eggs…?
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveI worked on a Lincoln Towncar once that had engine problems.When I dropped the pan I saw 4 caps all with a number 2 stamped on them.  Someone in a junkyard went through and replaced parts with used ones (including bearings) that allowed it to run, but it started tapping after a month.Bearings were mismatched and the scoring on the crank had been clumsily filed off in some areas as well...
Reply:Originally Posted by 123weldthem things were a boat.   late 70's - maybe  early 80's were the last of the last real cars, as i see it.      i was more into cadillacs (had 2), lincolns ride was just a lil too spongy for my taste.     first complete rebuild i ever did, was a 472 cad.    i miss them old cars, get in,  pull that big door closed, tilt that wheel in ur lap, and all the room u need.  all that chrome/wire wheels, i miss that
Reply:You could get in, and out, of a Crown Vic........................these crappy little new cars are like a sardine can.Only thing with any room is a pickup truck.....but they're making them nowdays so that you need a ladder to get in and out of them.I miss the good ol' bench seats.  Bucket seats are like sitting in a prison.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmWas a time, you could simply go out and buy another tractor for about 4-5K.  These were not popular tractors UNTIL NOW.  The market is hot for the old tractors that can still be fixed without all the computer BS.  There's a few cheap 190XT's out there, but they're all up North.  Saw one listed for TEN GRAND...........new paint  Ad says it has 2500 original hrs if I recall...........Hell, might be legit.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmIf the LN was in good condition (never got around to putting the new hood on), I'd run up and snag this one  https://www.purplewave.com/auction/2...Tractor-KansasTruck needs front tires, and new hood and inside fender skirts (blowout when I was hauling hay out of Texas back in 2012).  Haven't even fired it up in years.  Probably ok, but needs oil pressure put to it before it even gets cranked.  Was a tough old bird.  Wonderful running 6-71, 10spd, single axle.  Used as a backup to the cabover, when the cabover needed work.
Reply:[QUOTE=farmersammm;8822867]Only thing with any room is a pickup truck.....but they're making them nowdays so that you need a ladder to get in and out of them./QUOTE]And, a college degree in computer science to read and use the dang dashboard stuff.........Heck, some of them even advertise they'll electrify your house in case of a power failure...I GOTTA SEE THAT!  (Hope they use a power disconnect...that ain't shown in the commercials.  Wonder how many people have electrified the grid using those trucks!!!)
Reply:Think green. You'll only cry once.250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC StickF-225 amp Forney AC Stick230 amp Sears AC StickLincoln 180C MIGVictor Medalist 350 O/ACut 50 PlasmaLes
Reply:Originally Posted by bassboy1If the only thing stopping you from getting it is a non running truck, wouldn't it make sense to just pay someone to bring that tractor down, if it solves the problem?Originally Posted by whtbaronThink green. You'll only cry once.
Reply:lol... those tractors are more than 50 yrs old. The only place you'll find a pristine Oliver is in an antique collection, and it won't be under $10k.250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC StickF-225 amp Forney AC Stick230 amp Sears AC StickLincoln 180C MIGVictor Medalist 350 O/ACut 50 PlasmaLes
Reply:Funny thing.  Having been born on the farm ( and yes I’m STILL here /FINISH  high school kids) we mostly had Fords and Massey’s on the island. Only saw ACs, John Deeres, IH, and Olivers in magazines.Sent from my iPad using TapatalkLast edited by Lis2323; 2 Weeks Ago at 12:41 PM.:
Reply:So you're saying you led a deprived childhood?250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC StickF-225 amp Forney AC Stick230 amp Sears AC StickLincoln 180C MIGVictor Medalist 350 O/ACut 50 PlasmaLes
Reply:Yeah poor me LOL.   Back then tractors ( in my area) were either  red or blue.  Just like welding machines. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk:
Reply:Originally Posted by 12V71A buddy has a giant Lincoln 4 door (77-78ish) with 60K original miles, that thing just seems to float down the road. Almost makes my truck loving azz carsick.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmYou could get in, and out, of a Crown Vic........................these crappy little new cars are like a sardine can..
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammmI miss the good ol' bench seats.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammm Bucket seats are like sitting in a prison.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammm.......these crappy little new cars are like a sardine can..
Reply:Originally Posted by 123weldyea, i been "in, and out of a Crwon Vic", a couple times (involuntarily), the back seat - to be more specific,  i also sorta  had my own black and white.      my dad lost in a poker game one night,  but ended up w/ a retired cop car from it (dodge st regis) .    he made it a designated ranch car, for the guys to run parts/errands.     i managed to snag it,  and had a ton of fun w/ it in high school.  when i'd get on freeway,  people/cars on freeway sometimes herd.        that was a time, when it was almost fair between the civilians and cops.     they drove diplomats /capric/ltd's/etc.      almost always having them evil square headlights.     even at night, u stood a chance, as there lights were always adjusted perfect, and i mean perfect.     many civilian cars one light would  be a lil  outa line or something from being changed/etc.        also, them chp had them big push bars, and that tall long rear antenna, that would flex/whip around as they drove.    so if u watched/kept ur eyes in ur side view mirror, u could sometimes catch a shining glimpse of the sun hitting that antenna (even from far away)