|
|
Hey guys, I've read around quite a bit, and just gotten more confused the further I go...maybe you can help?I will be buying 6' long pieces of "welding steel" from Lowes, 1/8" thick, 1" angle pieces, and 2" flat pieces. I will be cutting them, and would like the cuts to be as burr-free as possible to save time on my finished product. The cuts will be straight through, and the pieces will be welded later, used as legs and cross-members for heavy duty tables.I have a miter saw, and a table saw. They are woodworking saws. Can I use metal cutting blades, for steel, with these machines? What types of blades work best?. Which brand/type blades are best, last the longest, etc? How many cuts (or total length) of 1/8" thick "welding steel" can I typically cut per blade, if operated correctly?I took a welding class years ago, and learned on an arc welder. We did all of our cutting with the welder, or an oxyacetylene torch. The cuts were too rough for my current needs. Even a plasma cutter I fear won't be able to get the straight cuts I'm desiring.Thanks for your help
Reply:Cutting metal on a table saw? Aluminum cutting, yes, steel, no. But those blades are expensive.Hard to beat a horizontal bandsaw for cutting metal and leaving a nice finish.A high tension hacksaw works really well on the small stuff. Even better if you lube the blade. If you have a disk sander (even one you use for wood, I use mine all the time for metal), that cleans up cuts real nice.XMT304 (school)SP125+ (home)HF 4x6 BandsawGood judgement comes from experience and much of that comes from bad judgement.
Reply:As a hobbyist woodworker and welder I have picked up some nicetools for both ventures and some (few) are compatible for both butone thing is sure, most cutting tools are not. The woodworking cutting tools are nice and sharp (check my scars) and accurate but usuallythey take too big of a bite and/or go way too fast and over heat. I haveused wood jig saws and recip saws (sawzall) for metal with success. You have to use the blades designated for metal that have many more teeth that they do for wood though. Metal really requires it's own set of accurate tools like most else for best results.With that being said though, you can get good cuts with a jig saw using blades that have a very high number of teeth and using somethingclamped to the steel to use as an edge/guide to let the base of thesaw ride along. They will end up straight and the blades can be usedagain if you don't force your way through. Very little burr with be leftfor you to deal with. If you force wood into a cutting tool with too much force, or too fast, orwith a tool that doesn't have enough teeth you usually end up damagingthe wood. Of course you can end hurt with kickback and what not. If you do something similar with metal you will definitely damage/ruin the cutting tool and have a much higher chance of winning the lotto, er um....I mean hurting yourself badly.I didn't get my great figure by working extra hard though
and will do most anything to find a faster/easier way to cut than using a hacksawthough. I'm considered a hack enough of the time without using the saw
Good LuckHow do you know the blacksmith's dog? When you hollar at him he makes a bolt for the door!
Reply:Do you own a sawzall, they will cut anything. For cross-cutting steel use as short a blade as possible. Long blades deflect and cause your cut to be crooked.I have even cut steel with a jig-saw. You have to take your time and touch it up with a file.
Reply:I made parts for guns and such using just a hacksaw and files, long before I even owned an electric drill. For the few cuts you seem to need, doing that would just put a bit more effort into the project and thereby make the finished product more personal.
Reply:With some quick math I determined that the cutting speed in SFM (surface feet per minute) of a table saw with a 5000 RPM spindle and an 8" blade to be 10,466.With a carbide blade of the correct geometry for cutting metal, Aluminum is cut at a maximum of 1500 SFM and steel at 400 SFM.A few seconds into your first cut you would be creating a new alloy when the carbide saw teeth friction weld to the steel.JoeLast edited by scudzuki; 03-09-2012 at 10:03 PM.Miller Syncrowave 200Mac/Miller MW130 MIGKalamazoo bandsawCincinnati Arrow 500 VMCColchester Dominion 15 x 36 lathe with 2 axis DRO
Reply:If you have a circular saw you could get a metal cutting blade for that. Just make sure you get one that is made for the RPMs the saw spins.
Reply:If you were to find a local, large scale steel supplier and have them make all the cuts for you, it would be cheaper than buying your steel from Lowes.Miller 302GMIller 12RC SuitecaseMIller 30A spoolgunHF-251D-1WP17 Tig torchSmith HD torchHypertherm 45Jet drill pressHF 7X12 wet cut horizontal band sawPlasmacam CNC table
Reply:Yeah, I'm sure lowes rapes you on steel, in those short lengths. MOST suppliers around here will make your cuts for you, and you should get a much better deal on the steel to begin with. Most of the angle, strap, tubing etc will be sold in lengths of 20'-24' depending on what it is. The supplier I use most of the time charges $1/cut with o/a torch, or $2/saw cut. That said, I would invest in a 4.5" angle grinder if I were you. The grinder and array of different type and styles of abrasives are available at the Depot, Lowes, etc. This would allow you to cut/grind/etc.....
Reply:Cheap and clean really don't go together. You can get an inexpensive abrasive chop saw, but there will be a heavy burr to clean up afterwords and accuracy is +/- 1/16" to 1/8" in many cases. On the other end you can buy a horizontal bandsaw or one of the carbide metal cutting chopsaws, and have clean burr free cuts that are super accurate, but the machines will cost significantly more.As far as running a different blade in a wood saw, I would not recommend it. Wood saws run at a much higher RPM to run any of the carbide metal blades. You'll simply destroy an expensive blade with the 1st cut at best, and seriously injure yourself at worst. Metal saws always have a way to clamp the material to the saw. Woods saws generally don't, or the clamp system isn't designed to hold things tight enough. If the metal moves, things get ugly fast. Wood saws also are not generally designed to take the abuse of abrasive blades. The motors are not sealed to keep out the fine grinding dust and metal particles and that will destroy the motor. Also the saws are usually made up with quite a bit of plastic, and the hot sparks and metal bits will quickly melt or set fire to the plastic parts, especially in the blade guard area..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Do not buy steel at a hardware store or big box store. Ever. You're paying like ten times the price that you'd get from a steel retailer.Now that I've saved you hundreds of dollars, get a portaband second hand for a hundred bucks and go to town.A woodworking saw will spin too fast for metal cutting blades (there are a few exceptions, but they're hard to find and probably don't last very long). Metal cutting blades usually need a saw that's less than 1500 rpm.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:Horizontal band saw.Lacking the funds for a band saw I would recommend a hack saw with a guide... similar to the a hand miter saw.Goodell-Pratt used to make a bench hack saw. Keep your eyes open.
Reply:The Diablo steel demon blades are awesome. They run about $35 at the big box stores.I just got done cutting 1/4" thick 4X4 tubing and they did it without a problem. I used a worm drive saw and went slow. Great addition to any shop.HOWEVER, for what you are doing I agree with the 4.5" angle grinder and cut off wheels.I also Highly recommend taking the others advise and do not buy steel from box stores.Just search "steel" and your zip code on the web and you will find suppliers in your area. I also go to scrap yards for supplies. Lots of companies scrap new steel at the end of their projects.and you can get it for 1/2 of new cost.
Reply:X2 what jack olsen said....portaband is my first choice, bur free, colder cuts, pretty accurate and semi fast cuts if you control the saw proper....
Reply:I'm in agreement with everyone else about not buying your steel at Lowes or Home Depot. Get it at a local steel supplier in 20' joints instead. Just check their price for that 6' piece vs. the price of a 20' piece and figure your price per foot and you will see you are money ahead in that respect. The suggestions on the saw cuts are right on, also the angle grinder/zip wheel combo for the thin stuff you are talking about. If you don't already have a 4 1/2" grinder and you do some welding you need to get one, or 2 or 3 or 4 anyway. It's handy to have several, each fitted with a different type of wheel, cutoff, grinder, wire brush wheel or cup, etc. That way you don't spend a lot of time switching back and forth from one to another when you need different wheel types, just set one down and pick up the one with the wheel type you need for the moment and vice versa. You say you are going to use 1"x1"x1/8" angle to build Heavy Duty tables. To me these will be Light Duty with that small of material. Just to Start getting into the heavy duty catagory you need 2"x2"x1/4" angle iron at a minimum. Square tubing in this size is even better for legs for a table. Light material equals light duty, heavy material equals heavy duty. Don't forget to post up pictures while welding your tables, everyone here likes to see project pictures and you may get extra advice on what to do as you go along with the project.
Reply:Thanks for all the help guys! A wealth of information.....And a local metals retailer is definitely on my list. I looked at other alternatives online, but shipping was going to make the price comparable to buying at Lowes anyway. I'll begin my search.Thanks again
Reply:Sawzall is the cheapest solution that will provide decent cuts. I once sliced two feet off a 17.25 lb S-Beam (aka i - beam, 6" x 3.525") with a Milwaukee Sawzall. It took a while but the cut was clean and square. I needed to make only one cut to shorten the beam and I already owned the Sawzall for general carpentry work so investment in another machine was not economical.I later procured an abrasive chop saw and used that for a couple of years. Then I got smart and bought a horizontal band saw. Since I bought the band saw the chop saw has done nothing but sit in a corner and collect dust.- MondoMember, AWSLincoln ProMIG 140Lincoln AC TombstoneCraftsman Lathe 12 x 24 c1935Atlas MFC Horizontal MillCraftsman Commercial Lathe 12 x 36 c1970- - - I'll just keep on keepin' on.
Reply:
Originally Posted by scudzuki
With some quick math I determined that the cutting speed in SFM (surface feet per minute) of a table saw with a 5000 RPM spindle and an 8" blade to be 10,466.With a carbide blade of the correct geometry for cutting metal,and steel at 400 SFM. Aluminum is cut at a maximum of 1500 SFM A few seconds into your first cut you would be creating a new alloy when the carbide saw teeth friction weld to the steel.Joe
Reply:Nice solid hand held hack saw. Purchase blades with the correct # of teeth for your application. Little bit of bluing (or a felt tip or paint pen). Machinist's scribe AND a small machinist's square. Hand files for clean up. Nirvana. Oops.. gotta have a nice vise mounted somewhere. Good tunes in the shop, and I will say.. when I'm cutting lots with hand hack saw, leather work gloves improve the ride.
Reply:I'm like the OP and finally sucked up a cheap horizontal band saw that works fine for my limited needs. Before that I used 3 options:angle grinder - watch out she will turn on you in a heart beat. make sure the blade is spinning "up" at the front of the cut or it will try to ride over the top. lots of sparks and don't forget the eye protection.jig saw - I have a good Bosch and it eats 1/8" steel very well with a fine tooth bimetal blade. i would cut from both sides on the angle iron and meet at the corner.circular saw - with a lennox type dry cut blade. still lots of sparks and not worth the price if you're just cutting small stuff.You want an angle grinder no matter what, so that might be your tool purchase. just clamp a guide to keep it straight if your a bozo like me. But I'd also get a pack of bimetal blades if you have a decent (hi amps) jigsaw. No sparks and a little oil will cut very well for what you or I need.Good luck
Reply:
Originally Posted by losttreasure
Hey guys, I've read around quite a bit, and just gotten more confused the further I go...maybe you can help?I will be buying 6' long pieces of "welding steel" from Lowes, 1/8" thick, 1" angle pieces, and 2" flat pieces.Thanks for your help
Reply:Where are you located ?? This would help sending you in the right direction and you maybe near a member too that would help.
Reply:
Originally Posted by dave powelson
-1 x 1 x 1/8" angle and 1/8" x 2" flat is barely capable of constructing the lightest duty table I can imagine.-Have you studied/planned/thought-out, this part of the build?
Reply:
Originally Posted by BD1
Where are you located ?? This would help sending you in the right direction and you maybe near a member too that would help.
Reply:
Originally Posted by losttreasure
Yeah, haha that would be a pretty limp table
....Its actually a simple frame that resembles a table, for an invention I applied for a patent on recently. I thought about going with aluminum, but I actually need the extra weight of the steel for its application.I gotta head over to the welding area...got a few questions. Its been 20 years since I took a welding class....
i didnt see any one mention a cut off wheel on a hand held grinder, i get really good cuts with these wearing a full face mask and the mateial clamped in a vise. kind of noisy for the neighbors but it i get good cuts pretty fast.bobs77vet/37ford4drEastwood digital TIG200HH190Lincoln Invertec 155sLincoln weldpak 100sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz boxO/A rig Harris gaugesnexion cut 50 dxchicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder
Reply:
Originally Posted by 37ford4dr
i didnt see any one mention a cut off wheel on a hand held grinder, i get really good cuts with these wearing a full face mask and the mateial clamped in a vise. kind of noisy for the neighbors but it i get good cuts pretty fast.
Reply:Seems like the OP is doing some prototyping and needs nice clean cuts. I don't think anyone has brought up porta-band saws which are certainly a useful way of making a clean cut and if mated to a simple stand can make quite precise cuts. Not cheap but not horribly expensive either at about $250-300 for a Milwaukee or Dewalt. HF sells one for $90. Lots of home made stands on Youtube or you can buy a chop saw like stand from Milwaukee or a bench mount table from SWAG off road. Far quieter than the abrasive saws.
Reply:I'd just get a 7" grinder and some 3/32" zip discs, setup yourself a guide for both angles and flats.If you've got steady hands, you can do great with just a grinder. After that, I would just find a place that you can purchase your angles and flats from that will do all of your cuts for you, I'm sure that there has to be at least one supplier around you that offers that kind of service.
Reply:Bandsaws are quite similar to jigsaws. The critical difference is that they are table-mounted and powerful enough to easily cut through metal and wood, depending on the blade used. WEN 3975T 4-7/8-inch x 5-inch Metal-Cutting Benchtop Band Saw is effective for cutting brass, copper, aluminum, steel, and more pipes up to 5 inches in diameter and 5 x 4-7/8 inches rectangular materials. Here is the list of Bandsaws & their reviews that may help you to choose because those performs exceptionally well when cutting metal.
Reply:Let me guess.... that link you posted is somehow related to what you do ??? maybe get compensated for it too
Reply:That is good way.It green power no more gym membership need.Win winDave
Originally Posted by forhire
Horizontal band saw.Lacking the funds for a band saw I would recommend a hack saw with a guide... similar to the a hand miter saw.Goodell-Pratt used to make a bench hack saw. Keep your eyes open.
Reply:I'm a little late to the party but a cutoff wheel on a RA grinder would work very well. Also, when I have to cut 1/8" I automatically pull out my jig saw with a metal blade if I have long cuts, not cutoff types. For cutoff types of cuts, it's either a cutoff wheel or my metal bandsaw. You'll have to deburr any cuts with any process, bench grinder/wire brush or flap wheel on an RA grinder.Last edited by JD1; 11-06-2020 at 12:04 PM.
Reply:Hi,Could someone tell me how to post a comment on this site ? I'm new here and can't figure the site out.Thank you,MAC
Reply:Click on the reply to thread button, bottom left below the comments. But obviously you figured it out since you posted a comment in this thread.
Reply:
Originally Posted by Macsr
I want to post in the general comment section I guess. I just had some Miller gas welder parts info I wanted to share with folks out there who may have had the same issue I had is all....Thank you
Reply:
Originally Posted by Macsr
Hi,Could someone tell me how to post a comment on this site ? I'm new here and can't figure the site out.Thank you,MAC |
|
发表于 2021-9-1 23:17:56