HF 9KW Generators..

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Hi All,    I've been looking at these generators and find myself somewhat puzzled by two units which appear nearly identical.  The 8.75KW model (#63087) and the 9KW (#63970).  AFAICT they are effectively the same except for gas tank: 6.6G for the 8.75KW and 8G in the 9KW.  The parts manual suggests this to be true, except that 8.75KW parts list calls out a vapor collector for its tank and is missing from the 9KW parts list.  Looking at the generators in the store shows a vapor collector on both however the 8.75KW tank does appear smaller.  Same Chonda 13HP/420cc electric start engine, same generator head, functionally identical front panel, etc..  So except for the larger tank and an increase in the roll cage height of 1" to accommodate it, the difference between the two appears to be largely marketing with the 9KW listing for $100 more.Might anyone have researched this further, finding any other practical difference between these two?  Note the HF item numbers are subject to change with the weather.  However the 9KW, 8.75KW billing remains the same.Thanks!
Reply:Since they are made in china you'll have a hundred different factories(families) putting the same(more or less) unit together.... from day to day changes will be certain as with most chinese built stuff... used to be I could buy two or three of something just to have a backup and be able to interchange 100 percent of the parts.... with the import stuff you're lucky if the gas cap fits between the same model made a week later  


Reply:I'm not really trying to address a maintenance concern here, but rather curious whether anyone is aware of a concrete difference between these two units other than what I've found.  A slightly larger gas tank alone doesn't make a compelling argument for a $100 price premium.   I may well be missing something, but likely it is simply HF marketing at work here which also invented the additional 250W in the 9KW labelled unit.
Reply:

Originally Posted by ronsii

Since they are made in china you'll have a hundred different factories(families) putting the same(more or less) unit together.... from day to day changes will be certain as with most chinese built stuff... used to be I could buy two or three of something just to have a backup and be able to interchange 100 percent of the parts.... with the import stuff you're lucky if the gas cap fits between the same model made a week later  


Reply:

Originally Posted by uhmgawa

I'm not really trying to address a maintenance concern here, but rather curious whether anyone is aware of a concrete difference between these two units other than what I've found.  A slightly larger gas tank alone doesn't make a compelling argument for a $100 price premium.   I may well be missing something, but likely it is simply HF marketing at work here which also invented the additional 250W in the 9KW labelled unit.
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Originally Posted by FlaJoe

I don't consider a slightly larger fuel tank as a "feature" but as a sign that someone else is now making HF's generators and that their parts won't be interchangeable with the old model. Also, in all likelihood, the new ones were produced at a lower costs so, somewhere, they probably cut corners.
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Originally Posted by thegary

... The 9000W model as I suspected is Carb 3 compliant.
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Originally Posted by thegary

The 8750 watt is the old model and I am sure will be discontinued when they are gone.
Reply:So by california standards it should be 15 percent cleaner... cleanliness is equated to be double the inverse efficiency rating.
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Originally Posted by California

That's a California-compliant version if it has a vapor collector and the other one doesn't. Perhaps HF will only stock that one, now.
Reply:C.A.R.B. compliant for the nanny state of california, pisses me off.  That being said I've had great luck with the predator generators, they've been rock solid in heavy "agricultural" use.  Those chonda motors run surprisingly well, I hate to say it bc they're probably made using slave wages and recycled food cans but i've had better luck with predator engines over some of the bigger names.
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Originally Posted by thegary

The 8750 watt is the old model and I am sure will be discontinued when they are gone.
Reply:I was told by our HF store manager that the price would continue to be lowered on the 8750 watt unit until they were all gone, and were superseded by the 9000 watt unit.  Makes sense to me. Unlikely they would maintain two separate units that were only 250 watts apart in output.  BTW, I purchased the 9000 watt model when it first came out and it has been super.Miller Syncrowave 350Millermatic 252/ 30A spoolgunMiller Bobcat 225g w/ 3545 spoolgunLincoln PowerArc4000Lincoln 175 Mig  Lincoln 135 Mig Everlast 250EX TigCentury ac/dc 230 amp stickVictor O/AHypertherm 1000 plasma
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Originally Posted by DougAustinTX

I was told by our HF store manager that the price would continue to be lowered on the 8750 watt unit until they were all gone, and were superseded by the 9000 watt unit.  Makes sense to me. Unlikely they would maintain two separate units that were only 250 watts apart in output.  BTW, I purchased the 9000 watt model when it first came out and it has been super.
Reply:

Originally Posted by DougAustinTX

I was told by our HF store manager that the price would continue to be lowered on the 8750 watt unit until they were all gone
Reply:I don't think HF is hallucinating.Honda has done the same thing.Their old 6500 is rated at 5500watts/45amps  Max is 54ampsThe new 7000 is  still rated at 5500watts/45amps  max is 58amps  But now they are 7000watts but they are the same generator as the old 6500I'll have to dig deeper but I believe it was how they were allowed to rate the generators before- Not sure what changed but now they are allowed to advertise them as 7000watts instead of 6500.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:I'd look at the Northern Tool equivalent.  They offer clean power gensets for the same/less money.Esab Migmaster 250Lincoln SA 200Lincoln Ranger 8Smith Oxy Fuel setupEverlast PowerPlasma 80Everlast Power iMIG 160Everlast Power iMIG 205 Everlast Power iMIG 140EEverlast PowerARC 300Everlast PowerARC 140STEverlast PowerTIG 255EXT
Reply:Years ago Sears sold a shop vacuum. It went from 4 HP to 6.5 HP over a few years. No change except the label. I once owned a Jaguar XKE roadster with 4.2 liter engine. Jaguar claimed 300 HP. While it was an adequate engine to smoke tires, 300 HP seemed an exaggeration. Years later, I saw an evaluation of the car. The narrator asked the question: "How did Jaguar squeeze 300 HP from 4.2 liters?" .....Easy, they lied"An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.
Reply:

Originally Posted by lugweld

I'd look at the Northern Tool equivalent.  They offer clean power gensets for the same/less money.
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Originally Posted by Willie B

Years ago Sears sold a shop vacuum. It went from 4 HP to 6.5 HP over a few years. No change except the label.
Reply:Peak torque in a motor (gas or electric) does NOT occur at the peak RPM (go look up the torque of any moter).  However Sears and many others were calculating "Peak Horsepower" or "Developed Horsepower" as the product of the Peak RPM of the motor times the Peak torque of the motor.  "Peak Horsepower" or "Developed Horsepower" were nothing buy advertising trickery and had no basis in fact or in physics.