Education question

admin

I've been thinking about this lately and the more I ponder it the more I realize that there may be a problem.  The school I go to has the welding program set up to where everything is done in 5 week long modules.  First module went over class room theory for two weeks then we started going into the lab to play around.  Second 5 weeks was working on the Hobart training book which has 34 topics in it.  Third week was Hobart basic mig training with 24 topics in it, basically all modules are five weeks long.  So what I'm thinking is that 5 weeks is not enough time to allow for those who have never welded before or those who have very very little welding experience to get enough time with learning how to do the basics.  The school week si 5 days at 5 hours with the first hour in the class room and 50 minutes of break time and shut down time of 30 minutes so its more like 2 hours and 40 mins of welding time each day.The local community college doesn't even come close to these numbers and really the lack of time and shortness of the module seems to work against us while benefiting the school money wise.
Reply:The key is the number of hours in each Hobart module.  Many schools/instructors attempt to emulate Hobart (to try and attach some credibility to their program) but fail to have the same amount of hours allotted as Hobart would for a given module.  The other key factor to welding training is the acceptance standards of the instructor.  When their standards of acceptability are low the results the students achieve are low, I see it every day.Whatever it is the school you attend does, that’s what you’re stuck with.  My advice is to make the best use of the time you have and pick your instructors brain for as much information as you can.Good luck!
Reply:Sure seems that they are rushing through all those topics VERY FAST. The instructor may be limited by the schools program/curriculum. The school actually dictate to the instructors what will be taught and approve their lesson plans. The instructor may be lucky to influence the plans a little with their inputs put its ultimately the school the chooses and approves the lesson plans and materials to be used. The instructor maybe as frustrated as you regarding the lesson plans and materials they have to work with.If you can talk to the instructor and see if  they own a shop and would be willing to take you on as a helper or apprentice. Instructors like to see some initative on the students part.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:Originally Posted by specterIf you can talk to the instructor and see if  they own a shop and would be willing to take you on as a helper or apprentice. Instructors like to see some initiative on the students part.
Reply:Definetly show some initative. The instructors will find your enthusiasm contageous. They may let you come in early, or stay late. It helps if your class mates are enthusiastic too. When I went to tech school, my whole class was very gung ho to get stuff done. We actually caught up with the group that started 6 weeks befor us. I was advanced another 2 terms myself because i used my break period to do extra study. And since there was a lunch break between the morning and afternoon groups I would ask if any teachers were sticking around the lab, and if they were if I could do some extra welding untill the afternoon class came in.
Reply:Sounds like an 'intro to welding' class, usually a pre-requisite to taking more advanced classes.  The short sections in each area of the intro class are enough to expose the students to the major aspects of welding.   There should be other, second-level classes in the curriculum that concentrate their whole time one process so you can become proficient at each.  Most welding curriculums have classes beyond the intro class that spend an entire semester in just stick on plate, another of just tig, another of just mig and fluxcore, another of plasma and oxy/fuel, another of welding symbols and blueprints, then the pipe classes, etc etc.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:This is the only class offered but it goes to advanced modules that ultimately get into structural and into all phases of pipe to get the 6G certification at the end of the program, I have however decided that it will be best for me to return to the stick basics when we get into the advanced stick to get those down first because it would be foolish to jump ahead.The instructors ( all 5 ) either work at the school full time, one runs a bakery overnight, and another works in the pipe union at a shop so no chances for anything like a hire on.  Initiative I have but I also have frustration so I am still working on getting things down but there's only so much one instructor can do with 16 students.  I'd consider going back through the program again but it would be hard to swallow a second year at $28K so I will be looking at an apprenticeship program either through the pipe fitters union or through one of the military contractors or Liehber ( they'll be hiring next year ) and deal with a 4 year apprenticeship and get it right.Here's a funny thing, I sat down early this morning and figured out the amount of time that is lost per student each day as an average and for individual students.  Overall the average per student would come out to 2 hours and 10 minutes out of a 5 hour class day.  Out of all the students three shave the lost time down to 1 hour 20 minutes because they skip breaks while others extend the hours all the way up to 4 hours because they start a social circle and the one hour they do weld they zip through the topics because they have previous welding experience.  I brought this up in class during a break and several guys thought it was odd that I would have spent time doing this so I explained when your 39 with a family and have worked in service industries you learn to watch where your money and time goes.  Well at the end of class the instructor announced that starting tomorrow we would all be in the booth starting 20 minutes after the bell so I'm not sure if what I said had anything to do with it but coincidental or not its a good thing.
Reply:$28K?! Get an apprenticeship or find a welding shop that will take you on when you're done with your schooling. You'll learn plenty on the job. Small shops wont expect you to know everything when you come out of school.
Reply:I just finished a four month welding course that covered just the basics. I took MIG and stick welding and passed with a "B" in MIG and an "A" in stick..(My favorite.) The courses were two days a week each for 2 1/2 hours per class. Total cost at the community college was under $500.00.. These courses covered the basics and if one is still interested they could continue on with the advanced classes. I took the classes for my own purposes. I will never make a living at it. Too old and creaky. But I learned enough to do my home projects with some confidence. It got me out of the house and I met some really neat people. I just may go back and take the advanced SMAW class as I enjoyed it very much.
Reply:Hi, Now welding is a important field.Educated people are coming in this field and improving it gradually.
Reply:Originally Posted by SteveburnerHi, Now welding is a important field.Educated people are coming in this field and improving it gradually.
Reply:^^^^I disagree, I have a teaching degree and half a Masters in Quality Management.Over 7 years of "higher" education.Started out wanting to teach and found I could not get a job due to economy and competition in my area. Well hell, what am I going to do now? I have a major in History, Minor in English, and a Minor in Secondary Education. No real job out there for History, or English. And if you can't get into a school, the education degree is almost worthless. It did however, teach me how to research, write, critically analyze, solve problems, and develop an original opinion. Now I sound like an ARMY commercial...It taught me how to be a leader instead of a follower..Higher education is the best option anyone can make.So, I went back to school to learn welding and make my way into Quality...I'd never seen a welder!Cost was/is $4500Just finished the structural course which was around 500 hours. Certified all positions AWSD1.1My original money also carries me through the pipe class where I'll certify all positions.Just took my test for CQIand will test next available, for CQAMy teacher is ridiculously good! Times are/ will change with the lack of work in other areas. I'm out to get money by any means. Hopefully it'll be in the area of Quality but, if it's Sticking or running a Tig unit is what is required to egt paid, I'll be there.Last edited by jsm11; 12-11-2009 at 09:40 AM.
Reply:I actually have a guy from Virginia in my class. He moved here to certify SMAW and move back.It does seem that your classes are pretty short.I just spent the last three weeks trying to lay a root into a beveled plate in preperation for pipe.I got the technique, speed, and angle now though!
Reply:I'm thinking of dropping the program at this point, now the aluminum portion of the tig book is going to be incorporated into a new aluminum tig module in the middle of my school year.  I'm one week into tig and have burned through a whole stick of thorated trying to get the basics down of lap and t joints on 11G plate that the shear is twisting as it cuts it and the gun has issues as well.  I asked why the program is done the way it is with 5 week long modules that jump from one to another type of welding and was told it was for repetition, I always thought repetition was doing the same thing not something different.