plasma cutter decisions decisions

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I am looking at buying a plasma cutter.  the regular name brand stuff just is out of my range and i really need something quick to get this job done. I would like to say that i am not new to plasma cutters.  I had a econopak 50 that i owned free and clear for two weeks after two years of making payments.  It was stolen by some dirtbag so im sure it could be sold and shoved up his nose.  I hope he ODed.   I have two models that i am seriously considering.  1st  http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=95136   It is on sale for $649 and with the 15%off coupon and tax it would be just under $600 to get this one.  It looks ruggedly built and is very simple.  it advertises to be able to cut up to 1/2" mild steel and has a nice long 18 foot torch cable.  90 day manufacturer warr and can buy the extended which is always a good thing with harbor frieght since more often than not your gona use it.  unfortunatly there isnt much on the net for reviews of this product.  i havent seen any videos of this unit at work but the tip looks much like the econopak unit i had which made a very nice thin pencil line wide cut.2nd  http://cgi.ebay.com/GIANTTECH-PLASMA...item4cecfa459f   I see these regularly sell for around $400 if you look at the completed listing.  with a $33 shipping its gona cost $433 - $450 to get this one in your shop.  it is very similar to the harbor frieght but advertises it will cut 3/4".  Much better warranty with 3 years and seems there is a really good rep here in the states.  Consumables seem to be cheaper to.  I have seen some reviews on this machine and everyone seems happy with it.  I also have seen some videos of it in action and it looks to me like it makes a wide rough cut much like my dads very old hypertherm unit.  not at all like the econopak 50 thin pencil line cut that was made.  To be fair the video may not do it justice and i have not seen this unit in person like i have the harbor frieght one.It would be nice to demo either machine to make a decision but that just isnt possible i know.One thing i did notice while looking a the spec was the weight of the machine.  the HF machine weighs darn near 50 lbs and the GT machine weighs only 19 lbs.  In most things lighter is better but in this instance im just not sure about that.  My old econopak 50 weighed 70 lbs and would cut 1/2" like the HF cutter does.  I dont know why but this difference in weight really bothers me and i think i would tend to lean twords the heavier machine.Is there anyone that would know why the weight on these machines is so much different and which is the better unit????????
Reply:The weight difference is due to the newer machines being inverter based which makes them much lighter.  There are a few different inverter based designs but it how modern plasma cutters are made.  I looked at the imports and ended up buying a PowerMax 30 though an import cutter would have worked for me.  I wanted a pilot arc, local service and consumables and was concerned about long term parts availability.Gianttech would be my first look for import gear.  Larry is here on the forum and seems like a stand up guy. There is also Everlast and Longevity and all have space in the manufacturers section and are active here.  Those would be the only three at this point I'd even look at.  You'll be able to find something in your budget that suits your needs.Dave
Reply:yea there is one horror story on the everlast on the web.  i think their out.  it says they advertise the high dollar mossfets in the machine and when ya open them up thye are anything but. besides that they blow out pretty quick.the harbor frieght machine has the pilot arc.  i think getting consumables shouldnt ever be much of a problem.the thing that scares me about the giant tech machine is if they are bringing them in through canada.  if they are then they dont pay the high tarrifs that harbor frieght pays due to nafta.  all it takes is one little thing to happen and they have to start paying the tarrifs and all of the sudden there company just evaporates and so does the supply of parts.  also harbor freight i can get consumables locally.  witht he giantech i have to order them as there is nowhere to get this stuff local.
Reply:Ditto DStevens advice. If you are going to buy an import...go with GiantTech.....I have met Larry on a couple of occasions.....and he is a straigh shooter. Don't forget to look on Craigslist for a used Hypertherm. There are over 50,000 Powermax600's out there....I have seen them listed for around $400 to $500........parts will be available for many years, made in USA.....Or, bite the bullet and buy the Powermax30....shop around for the best price.  Good luck any way you choose to go.....we'll try to help with advice!Jim Colt
Reply:I second that advice from dstevens and jim colt.  You can find Larry of GiantTech i here everyday. He gives honest straight forward advice, he has good prices and GiantTech also has a sub forum under Other Manufacturers. In GiantTech's forum you'll see they have a great rep.Of course you can search Craigslist searching for plasma cutters and welding  equipment and find some great deals as well.Ps Don't base a plasma cutters ability based upon the weight of the plasma cutter!! Plasma cutters have increased in power and cutting performance while becoming smaller in size and weight. The Hypertherm PowerMax 30 is extremely light and powerful just ask any PowerMax 30 owner.Last edited by specter; 01-10-2010 at 09:46 AM.Reason: PsCo-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:I too was considering between  a HF and other import machines at one time.  Decided to go with the GiantTech so that I would have a live person in the "states" to talk to for customers service if and when I needed it.  And to have someone who really knew what they were talking about when I had a question.  Have had mine about 4 months now and it does what I need it to do which is occassional use and not all day week long use.  Not to say it couldnt do it, but for my use, suits me fine.  If you would rather have a namebrand unit, I agree with jimcolt, look around for a good used one.  Goodluck in your choice.A few of my toys !LinuxMintManjaroMiller Roughneck 2E Lincoln WeldPak 100HTP MTS 160 Chicago Electric 80amp Inverter   Victor O/A
Reply:The other thing you have to look at is whether or not you want a MOSFET based plasma or IGBT (newer tech) based plasma.ChrisLincoln Pro Mig 180TMiller Spectrum 375
Reply:Originally Posted by MrBullfrog92yea there is one horror story on the everlast on the web.  i think their out.  it says they advertise the high dollar mossfets in the machine and when ya open them up thye are anything but. besides that they blow out pretty quick.the harbor frieght machine has the pilot arc.  i think getting consumables shouldnt ever be much of a problem.the thing that scares me about the giant tech machine is if they are bringing them in through canada.  if they are then they dont pay the high tarrifs that harbor frieght pays due to nafta.  all it takes is one little thing to happen and they have to start paying the tarrifs and all of the sudden there company just evaporates and so does the supply of parts.  also harbor freight i can get consumables locally.  witht he giantech i have to order them as there is nowhere to get this stuff local.
Reply:WE do not sell but basically one MOSFET unit
Reply:Mrbullfrog,The Hypertherm Powermax600 is a 40 Amp air plasma system....probably the most popular air plasma ever on the market (based on its sales numbers of over 50,000 units). It has been replaced in the Hypertherm line with the Powermax45......but they are relatively easy to find on the used market. It is conservatively rated to pierce 3/8" with severance cut to 7/8"....it is an IGBT inverter power supply (Hypertherm stopped using MOSFETS for power supply switching almost 18 years ago). It will have full parts and consumables support from Hypertherm for many years to come, outperforms many more powerful import plasma systems.....and can often be found in the $450 to $600 dollar range. Its a good safe value in most cases!Jim Colt
Reply:it is an IGBT inverter power supply (Hypertherm stopped using MOSFETS for power supply switching almost 18 years ago).
Reply:IGBT's devices do not necessarily weigh any more than MOSFET's...A transformer power supply (which can also use either IGBT's or MOSFET's to control output current) generally will weigh about 3 to 5 times the weight of an inverter based power supply...due to the size of the main transformer that has to operate at power line frequency (vs inverter transformers that operate at inverter frequency).The reason to buy MOSFET units.....or IGBT units that are imported from China.....is simply because they are far less expensive as compared to US major brand units. From my experiences with heat rise tests on the Chinese import units....the MOSFET units and the IGBT units all have very similar failure rates when operated at their specified output power and duty cycles. MOSFET's, properly applied to a power supply design can be perfectly reliable.....the more normal issue with MOSFET's is with line voltage spikes and electrical noise.....IGBT's seem to be more robust in this area. If I could not justify spending the money for a major brand.....and I had to have a new plasma cutter, I would buy from the most trusted source...hoping that I would get service and support in the event of failure. There seem to be quite a few happy users (on this and other forums) of quite a few different chinese import brands.......from what I have read- the biggest issues are out of the box failures....and most of the suppliers seem to replace these without much issue.I would urge potential buyers to at least try a major brand before buying a low cost import.....usually the 30 to 45 amp US brands will cut thicker and better, and with longer consumable life as compared to 40 to 60 Amp imports.Jim
Reply:I would urge potential buyers to at least try a major brand before buying a low cost import.....usually the 30 to 45 amp US brands will cut thicker and better, and with longer consumable life as compared to 40 to 60 Amp imports.
Reply:Oh yea BTW I tried to contact gianttech today.  every time i called their number it said this extention is unavalible leave message.  I left message and left an e-mail and still no call back.  NOT real encouraging.  if this is their idea of customer service I may just pass.
Reply:Today you can get a Powermax30.....more power with 30 amps than the Esab 50....for under a grand. Thats why I say you should try it...don't give up on american made product!Jim
Reply:Originally Posted by MrBullfrog92yea there is one horror story on the everlast on the web.  i think their out.  it says they advertise the high dollar mossfets in the machine and when ya open them up thye are anything but. besides that they blow out pretty quick.the harbor frieght machine has the pilot arc.  i think getting consumables shouldnt ever be much of a problem.the thing that scares me about the giant tech machine is if they are bringing them in through canada.  if they are then they dont pay the high tarrifs that harbor frieght pays due to nafta.  all it takes is one little thing to happen and they have to start paying the tarrifs and all of the sudden there company just evaporates and so does the supply of parts.  also harbor freight i can get consumables locally.  witht he giantech i have to order them as there is nowhere to get this stuff local.
Reply:my 36 amp HF plasma cutter cuts beautifully...luv it. When it broke , took it to a local shop , they said they knew what was wrong with it. I asked how , he said "50 years of experience" but would'nt fix it.....instead insisted on selling me an $1800 miller cutter that looked almost exactly the same as my HF with less amps....i opened it up myself , and with help from people on this web-site , repaired and UPGRADED my HF machine with 2 - 99 cent parts....there's a monopoly and biased people for No reason but to name brand brag , or rob you.  Seemed like a nice guy , and i told him i'd be back with my income tax return for the miller...Hell No.!        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:Well.....there isn't a Miller cutter that looks anything like your unit......so I know that story isn't 100%!  Well......except the the power supply is in a metal box, and the torch leads and the ground clamp come out of that box....damn, I guess they are quite similar!You clearly had a bad experience with the LWS!  I'd like to have a side by side compaison with my little Hypertherm and that 36 amp unit!Jim
Reply:this is exactly one of the people i'm talking about.....o.k. smartass , they look the same to me....oops , one is red and one is blue.....- and your on.!   I'll make the first cut ,  let's see if your brand name cutter makes a $1400 better cut ...Each and every ($1400) Cut..?it's 29 degrees and ran 100 yards back to the shop just to prove this.....my cutter is set for thin body panels so i did'nt make any fine adjustments , just turned it on.....and made a pretty clean cut on 1/4" right off the bat..........your turn.  let me see that $1400 better cut. Attached Images        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:Originally Posted by woi2ldthis is exactly one of the people i'm talking about.....o.k. smartass , they look the same to me....oops , one is red and one is blue.....- and your on.!   I'll make the first cut ,  let's see if your brand name cutter makes a $1400 better cut ...Each and every ($1400) Cut..?it's 29 degrees and ran 100 yards back to the shop just to prove this.....my cutter is set for thin body panels so i did'nt make any fine adjustments , just turned it on.....and made a pretty clean cut on 1/4" right off the bat..........your turn.  let me see that $1400 better cut.
Reply:your an idiot .....that's a CNC (Computer . Numerically . Controlled ) Machine $2000 for the machine + $2000 for the software + $2000 for the plasma cutter and special torch head...................this is a free hand thread.........cheater        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:I could make a better cut than that red box made with a torch with a beat up tip.The man obviously has no idea what a quality plasma cutter can do.With those machines they should put a hammer on the other side of the torch, opposite the tip (for knocking off the excess dross).Sure does like to call other posters names though.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:DeletedLast edited by SundownIII; 01-12-2010 at 01:21 AM.Reason: deleted postSyncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:if u read in my original post.....i said my machine "looks ALMOST the same"....i would have paid the LWS (Local Weld Shop)  Miller prices to fix my machine , but they're just as biased as you....- I'm up for the challenge ...let's do it...makes some cuts and post'm , i'll post back...- in the meantime , i'm gonna check with some freinds..slap my machine on a CNC to match that hypertherm , if not , i can probably match it on a tracer........but dont be a baby , show some freehand cuts.        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:The torch is a hand held torch I believe. Jim may have a straight machine torch on it, but the Powermax 45 is a hand held machine, not some big money commercial CNC specific unit. Even so is $2000 that much more than the $1800 example you wanted shown? Do some research before you call people names. The table and the program don't cut the metal, the torch does. All the table does is let you see just how good the cut can be when you run it under optimal conditions with out errors induced by human error in movement. The operator still has to set the amps, air pressure and cut speed, the computer doesn't do any of that. Just because you have a hard on for cheap tools doesn't change the facts. That's the quality of cut that comes from a good quality machine, and I've seen cuts very close to that done by hand with a straight edge and experience. I can cut better than your example with an O/A torch by hand, a whole lot cheaper than your plasma.I do note that you made no response to the comments on the Miller vs HF plasma. Edit:  but they are nowhere near "almost" the same other than they are about the same size and a plasma.You need to seriously loose the attitude you've got my friend. I did nothing other than point out the error in your post and you want to start calling people names like a small child. You wanted a comparison and I gave it to you. If you acted this way at the LWS it's no surprise no one wanted to spend and time with you and your cheap broken POS. Especially when they have to reverse engineer the design to trouble shoot the issues because they don't have a manual for the item and then find nonstandard components to repair it. That all takes time. I'm betting like most places they don't service anything in house now days. At $65/hr plus, I can tell you, that they know you won't be willing to spend what it takes to fix the problem, so why bother to send it out to be torn down and looked at, just to have you whine because it costs too much and you don't want to pay. A place I use has tons of older machines sitting that the owners dumped because they were too expensive to repair, at least with those name brand machines, the company can do a bit of work and sell them as used to recover costs, or save them for useful parts. If you treat people like this here regularly, you'll probably find no one will be interested in helping you in the future. There is a big difference between quality name brand machines and imports. Thats just a fact. The decision whether the lower cost of an import or HF machine has to be weighed against the pluses of name brand machines, longer consumable life, better technology, a larger service network, long term parts and support and so on. That's the choice that people have to make. You chose to go cheap, and if that works for you, good. You dodged the bullet when the guys here were able to help you fix your machine. If not, you'd have to spend the same money again, and you'd have an expensive door stop with the old one. You bought it from HF, how was their service and repair center?The OP was concerned with GiantTech and service and parts availability. It sounds like he uses this to make money, not twiddle in the garage. Down time in business costs money, often BIG money. Waiting days to try and find parts for a discontinued HF machine that no one is willing to work on could cost him more than just going out and buying a new Hypertherm/ Miller machine in some cases. At $75 / hr or more in pay, how many hours did it take for you to fix your machine? Not just the repair time to plug in the parts, but the time to take it to the LWS, the time to hunt around or wait for someone to solve your problem for you, to wait for the new parts to arrive and then install them? What if they were wrong and that didn't solve the issue? You are out all that time/money and still don't have a working unit. You can ignore that if you are a hobbyist, it's tough to do that if thats how you earn a living.The OP has a tough decision to make. He knows he would love to have the quality of a name brand, but with the economy slow, he has to balance the good points of the units with the extra costs. On the other side if he buys a cheap machine and it goes down, or he can't get parts, he's worse off than he is now. No machine to use and no money to get a replacement.Last edited by DSW; 01-12-2010 at 01:59 AM..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald ReaganOriginally Posted by woi2ldand made a pretty clean cut on 1/4" right off the bat.
Reply:Here, about 40-42 amps ( forgot to check if it was all the way after cut and was not )Over 1 1/2" thick tram rail.  Hypertherm PowerMax 45, drag tip, cut all in one hit with little pause.  Over suggested cut thickness.Not a lot of clean up.  That was almost 12 month ago and still using the same tip with considerably more cut time.Cut/severance looks as good or better in places than your RED BOX on MUCH thinner material. Attached Images
Reply:OMG this thread took a turn for the worse.  Ok since we got the gloves off heres my swing at it all.The current HF 30 amp cutter would cost me $755.74 out the door
Reply:Originally Posted by woi2ldif u read in my original post.....i said my machine "looks ALMOST the same"....i would have paid the LWS (Local Weld Shop)  Miller prices to fix my machine , but they're just as biased as you....- I'm up for the challenge ...let's do it...makes some cuts and post'm , i'll post back...- in the meantime , i'm gonna check with some freinds..slap my machine on a CNC to match that hypertherm , if not , i can probably match it on a tracer........but dont be a baby , show some freehand cuts.
Reply:BTW over the years i have bought several welders.  over 10 as i count them up.  some portable and some not.  Most of all of them were american made.  and yes every one of them has been in for repair at some time or another.  I had a miller portable welder that they would not waranty.  engine went bad at under 100 hours of uses despite folowing all the break in procedure.  I was so pissed i dragged it out of the truck and ran it over with the cat loader and went and bought a brand new lincoln which in my opinion turned out to be a POS and got rid of it to. so ya see USA does not mean trouble free and I really resent the notion that it does.  THEY ALL SUCK WHEN THERE BROKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply:Quote:Originally Posted by woi2ld  if u read in my original post.....i said my machine "looks ALMOST the same"....i would have paid the LWS (Local Weld Shop) Miller prices to fix my machine , but they're just as biased as you....- I'm up for the challenge ...let's do it...makes some cuts and post'm , i'll post back...- in the meantime , i'm gonna check with some freinds..slap my machine on a CNC to match that hypertherm , if not , i can probably match it on a tracer........but dont be a baby , show some freehand cuts. I guess I'll put you down on the list....... A little pride in what you own is a natural thing; we all tell ourselves what we have/ what we chose is good, to reinforce our belief in ourselves. That is fine. But as to your belief that your cut is all that and a bag of chips, i am thinking maybe I should go out in the yard and have Raul take a 55 year old Victor flame torch and have him cut a thinner, cleaner hole out of a piece of 1/2" steel. Don't go in the room talking like you've got the goods unless you've GOT the goods. Your cut looks about what a sawzall would do to a Thanksgiving turkey. It would never, not in a hundred years be accepted at our shop.Not to bust your chops; you cut 1/4" steel in under a minute, and that's nice. Calling out people here is counter-productive at best. And your cut is not the best, so don't bother. __________________Know Chi-coms, no peace. No Chi-coms?? Know peace.  Let us all now bow down to the all mighy proffesional.  Shut up go away.  we dont care what you do in your shop or any other shop for that matter.  If you dont have any usefull info on the Giantech or HF machine GO AWAY.  tell it to someone who cares.
Reply:I am trying to get ahold of gianttech again today with no luck.  the number i have is 617-334-9441.  Does anyone have a different number????
Reply:Say Bull I do not know where you are locate but I found this on Cragslisthttp://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/tls/1526325058.htmlPlasma Cutter - $750 (Pittsburgh)--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Date: 2009-12-27, 2:52PM ESTReply to: [email protected] [Errors when replying to ads?]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------This is a ThermalDynamics Econopak 50 all solid-state plasma cutter, 35 amps maximum output cutting current.. It will cut 1/2" steel or any material of that or lesser thickness that can conduct electricity. It runs on 220v single phase power and requires a 60 psi 135 scfh (64 lpm) compressed air supply. (My 2 hp Sears 6.3 scfm @ 90 psi air compressor can easily keep up with this). Included are all of the consumables I have for the torch.. Also included is a shopmade downdraft cutting table that measures approximately 78" long by 24-1/2" deep by 37" high. There are leveling screws on the end of each leg. (Air compressor not included).   Location: Pittsburgh if interested in putting your location on your post instead of answering every one's request where you are located trymiddle left corner of screen click on USER CP, Your Control Panel, Edit your Details, then Additional Information    there you can add you location as well as other info you might want to share.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:Originally Posted by MrBullfrog92I am trying to get ahold of gianttech again today with no luck.  the number i have is 617-334-9441.  Does anyone have a different number????
Reply:Whew......I speent the last few hours travelling.....away from the internet. This topic sure got pretty intense in just a few hours!I certainly would not compare a cnc cut (as in the pics I posted) vs a hand cut...any good running cnc machine will win.....besides, the cnc cuts were done with a Hypertherm Powermax45 (which you can get in the $1500 range).....which is a 45 amp plasma. Rather, when I get back to New Hampshire on Thursday....I'll go out to my shop and do a few hand cuts with the Powermax30.....which runs on either 120 volts or 220 volts....whichever voltage you plug into it will self select. I'll cut some gauge material, then some 1/4", 3/8" (which is the manufacturers rated max cut), then some 1/2" and some 5/8" by hand. The cuts will be dross free and about 2-1/2 times the speed of the HF unit on 1/4", above 1/4" I will expect some dross....and this will be done by hand with a 30 Amp unit running on 120 volts, drag cutting......and the unit can be purchased new (3 year warranty from Hypertherm, with tech centers all over the world) for under $1000.  I fully understand that there is a market for imported units that cost less than that.....Hypertherm chooses not to build units for that market at this time. What I do disagree with is that the performance between the Hypertherm unit and the Harbor Freight system is the same.....you get a lot more for the extra money. Cut samples coming.....I'm in Dallas today, back in NH to cut on Thursday......and it will be about 5 degrees in my shop!Jim ColtLast edited by jimcolt; 01-12-2010 at 02:25 PM.
Reply:Agreed, decisions decisionsresearch is a great benefit the web offers for anyone's need to be informed prior to a wise purchase. Which you have and are doing.I believe most are trying to express their personal opinions in an effort to further inform. Both the Harbor Freight and Giant Tech units use torches that are of older technology, to update the torch would cost roughly $500 +. A Radnor model would be an option.From my readings I would purchase the Giant Tech unit before the Harbor Freight one if I were to choose a low end unitI stumbled upon this short clip that is very informative and will be helpfull to readers that are interested and never owned a plasma cutter.http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/...cutter/248323/Yup, I tote a chipping hammer, file and wire brush in my bucket.Good Luck with what ever you decide on.It seems heated debates are the norm for discussion about imports, oh well.
Reply:thank you for the video link in this last post , that hypertherm "kinda" "almost" looks like my little red box...and made the same 1/4" cut with the same dross/slag...Chris admits , in the video, that IT IS Normal/Typical for the HyperTherm....my tips also "nonconductive" like in the video , you can drag it..NO need for a $500 torch......HF consumables electrodes,tips are like 48 cents apiece if u order from the 800# In the Manual with the parts#..........maybe my little red box is competeing against his brother or cousin , who will not except him , because he's the wrong creed , color or something.-so i assume the New Blue HF Plasmas even better , being digital and all.        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:thanks BuLL , i felt alone there for a while....i thought i entered a harbor freight thread and instead , triggerd a lynch mob.. i found on this site , you have one little section to stay in , if your even to mention the words "harbor freight".....guess i crossed the tracks, and the bashing started imediatly.  A hypertherm and CNC owner wants to beat up my little red box........man , there was no Lynch Posse for GiantTech , was there.?  I need to make sure i sit at the back of the bus and keep quiet.        thermal arc 252i  -  millermatic 350P -   miller XMT, cp300ts, 30a 22a feeders, buttload of other millers, handfull of lincolns, couple of esabs  -   Hypertherm 1250 G3
Reply:I don't really know what you have against Hypertherm....or against a cnc owner. I happen to have a PlasmaCam cnc and 3 Hypertherm's......and I have a lot of Harbor Freight tools as well. I replaced an old Campbell Hausfeld compressor head 4 or 5 years ago with one from HF....and it works great! My Harbor Freight air dryer works awesome...and it is a hell of a value compared to some others I looked at.If you happen to have a great value in an import plasma from Harbor Freight...that is what this forum is for. Lets figure that out......as I said, I'll be in my shop on Thursday...it is in NH, I'm currently in Dallas....I'll try cutting some materials with my Powermax30 (I also have a 45 and a 1000).....I'll take photos, and we'll see how the little thing performs...then we can compare with what you have. No real need for mud slinging and accusations of a "lynch mob".  Personally I have never operated a Gianttech Machine.....I have met the owner of Gianttech, he seems to be a great guy...and that is the only reason I suggested that he would be a good person to buy an import plasma from.I have used the Harbor freight unit that is in the pictures, I'm well aware of its capability....and now, give me a day to get home and I'll show you what the Hypertherm can do. Calm down.....you could pop a vein with that attitude!  Also...you keep quoting wild price estimates....the Hypertherm torch is not anywhere near $500. On Thursday I'll look up the suggested list if you would like...then we won't need to speculate!Jim Colt Originally Posted by woi2ldthanks BuLL , i felt alone there for a while....i thought i entered a harbor freight thread and instead , triggerd a lynch mob.. i found on this site , you have one little section to stay in , if your even to mention the words "harbor freight".....guess i crossed the tracks, and the bashing started imediatly.  A hypertherm and CNC owner wants to beat up my little red box........man , there was no Lynch Posse for GiantTech , was there.?  I need to make sure i sit at the back of the bus and keep quiet.
Reply:Well I am standing by on the sidelines for this one . I did my self sacrifice last year when I put my PowerMax 45 up against two more powerful Chinese units. We all know what a war that turned out as. Plus we all know who won. Harbor Freight is OK for entry level machines to be used by hobbyist and for occasional repairs or fabrication. But when it comes down to a business, shop, or individual doing daily use and having to depend on a unit for their lively hood I doubt many businesses would solely rely on a Harbor Freight unit. Downtime is jobs and money going elsewhere than your pocket or stomach.add:  http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/...cutter/248323/is an excellent video of Jay Leno's shop  Pictured was his head mechanic. And those that have seen Jay's shop either in person or on TV knows his shop only uses American products and then only top of the line products.Last edited by specter; 01-12-2010 at 08:50 PM.Reason: addCo-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:I doggone near had a sexual experience when I saw what an industrial Hypertherm can do on a CNC table.  THE BIG OI gladly paid 100 for 12 pieces to be cut.  They had to be absolutely accurate, for the frame they're gonna be part of, to be accurate.And the cuts were in thin material.  3/16 plate.  No distorion whatsoever.Could the cuts have been made with a consumer version of the plasma cutter???  Yes.Templates, repeated setups, difficulty holding proper distance from material, and waste.And, BTW........... the cuts could have been made with OA.  Not as pretty, or as accurate.  But doable.  (freehand cutting)Balance the one time cost to have a shop do cuts that I will never make on a daily basis, and it's cost effective.  The shop probably puts mega hours on that machine.  I would never recoup a large investment in plasma for the need I have for it.Before you go out and plunk over a grand down on a machine, you'd better sit back and have a good hard look at just what your needs are.  If your needs match your desire, then, by all means go out and buy the box.I constantly see "plasmatics" compare the capabilities of their units to OA.  It's sorta silly.  If the doggone thing will do the same as an OA, why buy it?Instead..........look at the area where plasma excels head and shoulders above OA.  THAT'S THE REASON TO OWN ONE.  It has to be cost effective(big failure there), and it has to have no substitutes(non ferrous stuff, and thin stuff are winners).If it is simply a matter of not having the skills to cut with gas, then develop the skills.  It'll make you feel ten feet tall.(Personally, never having used one, I'd imagine travel speed, distance from material, setting parameters, etc. is just about as difficult as using a torch)If you do go out and buy the machine, I'd go with the Hypertherm.  Proven, and reliable from what I hear, and not on the interweb, from people I deal with."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by MrBullfrog92If you pay that for the harbor frieght machine your just a dumb A$$.there on sale for $649.49.
Reply:Originally Posted by specterWell I am standing by on the sidelines for this one .
Reply:Well Dave!! Jim Colt is younger than I am! Hopefully his blood pressure is lower. No brother in laws on this this one (unless they co-own Harbor Freight??) For an entry level cutter to go up against one of the plasma industries cutters will be interesting after last years results of two 60 amp cutters against the 45 amp Hypertherm.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:Originally Posted by specterWell Dave!! Jim Colt is younger than I am! Hopefully his blood pressure is lower. No brother in laws on this this one (unless they co-own Harbor Freight??) For an entry level cutter to go up against one of the plasma industries cutters will be interesting after last years results of two 60 amp cutters against the 45 amp Hypertherm.