This Is Gonna SUCK!!!

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As soon as I see this I know at least 3 times before I complete this job I'll be    This tells the tale..13"X78" Chrome plated roller that needs a new head on one side..And dont screw up the chrome!!! (I get all the fun jobs.. )Well I know its at least 1/2 full of oil...30 gallon barrell and a 3/16 drill to start...Gotta loose the journal first..Too big for the saw so we'll turn and chop as I call it...Turning the diameter down to about a 1/4" wall..(Journals are hollow..)Cut off tool...Next post.....zap!Last edited by zapster; 07-26-2007 at 03:45 PM.I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Notice how the cut off tool is ground on an angle opposed to straight like most do it..They work 10 times better this way..Chop Chop..Left over journal..Well its time to head home now...I'll continue with this fun tomorrow..Later.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Why for it be oil filled - dampen harmonics?John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:Originally Posted by MicroZoneWhy for it be oil filled - dampen harmonics?
Reply:Roger that, so the "drum is heated" or hot for it's purpose...got it! Thanks.John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:I stuck a cut off tool  in the ceiling once  David  Real world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Originally Posted by David RI stuck a cut off tool  in the ceiling once  David
Reply:Zap  I notice that when your building up a journal to then turn it down you always seem to Tig it.I would have thought Migging would be quicker?Why your preference for Tigging ?Cheers  Brett
Reply:Originally Posted by BrettZap  I notice that when your building up a journal to then turn it down you always seem to Tig it.I would have thought Migging would be quicker?Why your preference for Tigging ?Cheers  Brett
Reply:Ok after getting more done on the roller today we have decided that this is'nt just a "add a double head in there" and forget it job..Not now.. Far from it..You have to start somewhere..So after cutting off the journal yesterday its time to get the boring bar out and have at it..But before hand we figured out that the journal was not hollow to the inside of the tube..It had a plug welded on the end so I had to get the 1.5" drill out and open it up before boring thru..Boring..Getting bigger...What the...Its still full of oil!!More boring...This is what I ended up with after i decided to just loose the front head..I'll explane all about it next post.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Now try to understand whats going on here..This is what the head/journal assy is supposed to look like..The oil comes in thru the center..Goes out the holds and into the bottom of the tube..What we have here is a tube in a tube with angle inbetween the tubes..(Go back and fourth between the "print" and the last pic..The oil is supposed to be in the bottom only..But the inner tube is full because of the cracked journal..Fixing this just got real involved and expensive..I'll keep everyone up to speed as we progress..More tomorrow.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:I was just wondering...We had thought this was a regular roller..Oil filled instead of water cooled..When I drilled out the head we only got about a gallon out..We thought we got lucky and the maintenence people drained it before sending it..Guess not...But what do you think would have happened if we just took the torch to it to remove the heads?Or if we had a carbon arc gouge machine?Sometimes the slow way is the best way..I Dunno..Scarey thought......zap!Last edited by zapster; 07-27-2007 at 05:27 PM.I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Your posts continue to be nothing short of amazing.
Reply:well man... I´m gonna give you a small positive comment...at least you have some extra coolant for your tool there! !My Babies: HF Drill pressHF Pipe Bender3   4.5" Black and Decker angle grindersLincoln Electric PROMIG 175that´s it!
Reply:Originally Posted by rat4spdYour posts continue to be nothing short of amazing.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterI really did'nt think anyone cared..Thanx..
Reply:As we continue..This A.M. I needed to get the oil out of the inner tube..Drill and drain..Hole is dead center of the pic..Now I get to stand around for 2 hrs while the draining continues..Ok...Oil all gone time for a clean up pass for the two bore sizes..Ahhhhh thats much better..Here we are all cleaned with acetone and "ready to go"..I even cleaned out the inner tube...First thing Monday I'll take this out of the machine and fab up a new Head/Journal assy.. At least the dirty slimey part is over.. Untill monday......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Zap, go home.  It's saturday.
Reply:Oil soon looses all viscosity and turns into a charred gooey soot. It only flames up as the metal begins to super heat! The oil that still remains will of course make a huge mess. Judgeing by the amounts that you're dealing with, that would have been a big mess alright! Yesterday I welded a pair of greasy steel casters to immobilize them, and since there was no way to clean out all the grease, I had to weld around and through it. Intermittent weld with the intermission entertainment being putting out grease fires before the rest of the coach was involved!  It was certainly a Blob-2 job!City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Originally Posted by WelderBoyZap, go home.  It's saturday.
Reply:I swear,  Fussing about a little oil....   You shop guys are killing me...   You need to come spend a day with me out in the field welding on a log loader.......  You just weld awhile, put out fires awhile, Hope the fire doesn;t burn up any of the brake lines or oile lines, and then throw your clothes away at the end of the day from all the leaking hydraulic oil and grease that's on them....  Oh, btw............ nice work Zap. Glad to see someone was working today.  I caught a bad case of slack @$$ today.....    I'm a Lover, Fighter, Wild horse Rider, and a pretty good welding man......
Reply:You shop guys are killing me...
Reply:That's true,  We are all brothers in the end....  You know I was just messing with ya anyway...  That's one of the things I like about this site,  When you see jobs like this it makes you glad its not waiting for you in your own shop, heheheI'm a Lover, Fighter, Wild horse Rider, and a pretty good welding man......
Reply:Just looking at the initial construction of that thing----real piece of art looks like.
Reply:Originally Posted by SandyJust looking at the initial construction of that thing----real piece of art looks like.Originally Posted by zapsterI have learned that its offically called a "Hot oil turbine roller"...Now next time I know what I'm doing.....zap!
Reply:The challenge is getting a real tight shrink fit in the rear head..You can't weld the rear head so the shrink fit is the only way of sealing the inside tube to keep the oil out..Myself..I'd like to bore the whole back head out untill I get to the inner tube and make a double head that would fit the front and the rear..As it is the 2 heads are only 3"apart..I'd like to see them at least 7" apart so when the pressure is applied its spread out more to the center of the roller opposed to just 3" on the ends..The farther away the heads are from each other the more "abuse" they will put up with..This is still gonna suck.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:I was wondering what you were going to do with the rear head. I like your idea of making a new rear head farther back. Lots of work.
Reply:Well right now I'm kinda stuck untill the boss shows up @ 7 so I can discuss my idea..I can't just do it MY way without consulting the boss..or for that matter the owner if need be..But I can tell you this..Like I had stated earlier..I'll fix this side one way or another..But it will be back soon because the other side is the same way...Short and under alot of pressure when in use..Semi bad design from the start.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:And another thing..The original journal has a 1 1/4" NPT threads in the end and the hole dia. was 1 1/2 thru the Juornal.. After finishing for the bearing..the wall is not that thick anymore..I think the bearing size is 2 1/4"So I'll use a piece with a 3/4" hole in it instead and just bore the end enough for the thread..Much thicker wall now.. ...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterI really did'nt think anyone cared..Thanx.. And by the way..I'm allready at 4 of these..  ...zap!
Reply:Originally Posted by zapster.....Semi bad design from the start.....zap!
Reply:Originally Posted by Sober_PollockMaybe.....Maybe not.....I've been in mill maintenance for years and If there is one thing that you can be sure of, it is.....If the production line this roll came out of has been in service for any considerable time, it's doing more (turning faster, with higher loads, and at higher temperatures) than the engineers ever intended it to do!Every company i've ever seen opperate a mill does it, no matter what they are producing!
Reply:I sure care! Keep up the great posts, Mr. Zap. Since I got on this list and started reading your posts, I've quit drinking, started going to church and I smile a lot more.
Reply:Back after a nice weekend...Not much to show today..But after a lenghty conversation with my boss (less than 2 mins) we went ahead with what I felt we should do all along..Now thats more like it..Funny thing is that getting to this point took a good 8+ hours..Anyone that ever ran a lathe knows all about interrupted cuts and carbide tool bits.. I must have shattered 1/2 dozen 3 sided insert bits.. But now it gets easy..More tomorrow.. ...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Yeah, carbide plus interrupted cut = shattered carbide pieces all over the place.  Usually.   Project summary so far: Zap bitches, then spills oil, then breaks lots of carbide cutting inserts.   Tomorrow, Zap bitches, heats something up red-hot to get a shrink fit, then gets to play with his beloved TIG torch.
Reply:Originally Posted by MoonRiseYeah, carbide plus interrupted cut = shattered carbide pieces all over the place.  Usually.   Project summary so far: Zap bitches, then spills oil, then breaks lots of carbide cutting inserts.   Tomorrow, Zap bitches, heats something up red-hot to get a shrink fit, then gets to play with his beloved TIG torch.
Reply:Zap...do you ever need to produce these digipics to document a hefty repair bill?WeldingWeb forum--now more sophomoric banter than anything else!
Reply:Originally Posted by 69 chevyZap...do you ever need to produce these digipics to document a hefty repair bill?
Reply:Zap, are you using those HF carbide bits again?  John -  fabricator extraordinaire, car nut!-  bleeding Miller blue! http://www.weldfabzone.com
Reply:Originally Posted by MicroZoneZap, are you using those HF carbide bits again?
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterBack after a nice weekend...Not much to show today..But after a lenghty conversation with my boss (less than 2 mins) we went ahead with what I felt we should do all along..Now thats more like it..Funny thing is that getting to this point took a good 8+ hours..Anyone that ever ran a lathe knows all about interrupted cuts and carbide tool bits.. I must have shattered 1/2 dozen 3 sided insert bits.. But now it gets easy..More tomorrow.. ...zap!
Reply:What is all that angle iron for? Why is that being used?
Reply:OK now as we continue..The journal material comes with a hole down the middle anyway so we need to plug the end going inside the roller..Plug welded..After that it's down front for 4 holes for the oil to drain into the tube..Then get it set up for the head plates...Notice I made this a 3 step journal..We're using 3 heads this time..One in the back like I wanted all along and 1 where i had bored the orig head out..We felt that the oil should not be filling up any of the inner tube...Journal..The head placement would make it tough to weld "inside" like I do on 99% of the heads I make..Just not enough room..But thats ok..Thats why we made it a step journal..You'll see in a minute why..We also decided that we'll shrink the heads on the shaft also..Gave them .010..After you bore the head to size remember to face off the head so everything is running true with each other so you can "bump it up" to the shoulder..We'll continue next post......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Now we heat the front head up and install to the shoulder..Then tack the side without the shoulder first!Now flip it over and continue welding..Root pass..Weave cover pass..Now flip it over one more time and continue..Rear pass..Now heat the middle head up and install to the shoulder..Not enough space to get between the heads so just let the shrink work for you and just weld the rear..Next post..We're getting there.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Next Post!!!!C'mon!  Dont Leave Me Hangin'!ThermalArc 185MillerMatic 180 w/ AutosetVictor Cutskill Oxy/AcetyleneThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38and spite!
Reply:Just do the same thing with the last head..Heat install weld..There we have it..One triple head ready for turning..I gave the 2 inner heads .010 shrink..The outer head ..008..Why? Because I said so!  Now here it is all together..Man the smoke that was generated while heating was unbelieveable!!!But its done now..The strap and the vice grips hold it "straight" and up against the inside shoulder untill it cools off and gets tight..There..Done and ready for weld..But I'm letting this cool overnite before I do weld it so it gets a chance to "normalize" itself and get a real good "grab"..Oh Oh...My Hobart seems to be taking a pee for itself..No worries..Its just the drain hose that goes outside not the torch itself this time.. Little tape in the A.M. and we're good to go..I get all the fun jobs... ...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:See, I -told- you Zap was going to bitch-n-moan some more, then heat something red-hot for a shrink fit, and then TIG something.  So the heads are a shrink-fit onto the shaft/journal, and also TIG welded.  I see all that.But the only attachment of the head OD's to the roller ID is the heavy shrink-fit?  And the outermost head will be TIG welded to the roller?  There is no weld from the two inner heads to the roler, and just the shrink fit keeping the oil out of the inner tube of the roller, right?After attaching the heads to the shaft/journal, you had to cool that all down while you heated up the roller, and then had to slip the head-n-shaft subassembly into the hot roller, while not cocking anything and keeping it all pretty concentric?   Oh, nice pic of the oil smoke puffing out from the hollow shaft/journal from heating the roller and it's old sludge.   On your pic of the "flip it over one more time and continue.  Rear pass" (attachment 11525, or Rear9) looks like the toes of the weld to the shaft wet in OK but the toes of the weld to the head didn't wet and flow into the head and it looks a little cold. Attached Images
Reply:Thats the second time around..Root pass was burned in real good..And yes in any roller we make the inner head is held in by the shrink fit..No failures yet..Knock on wood.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:We make steel headed Aluminum rollers on occasion..The only thing tha holds them together is the shrink..I can take the roller I just did and turn the journal to finish without any weld there..Shrink fit is really strong..Its the only thing holding most ring gears to flywheels......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.