Hydraulic cylinder rod eye reattached. Play the ball where it lands.

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A buddy had a hurry up emergency job today.I sent it to lurkingjoe, a lurking member here.One of these days he'll speak up. He'd have a lot say.I sent him this nice job in exchange for a promise to travel with me to Fabtech in Chicago this November. He agreed, if, I would pay for his nerve pill prescription!Here's Joe's repair on a big wheel loader,  hydraulic cylinder, eye had been completely snapped off the rod.Joe repaired it in place, on the machine, at customer's shop using customer's power source.Attachment 12010Sorry, no before pics. Eye was snapped completely off the rod. I left after introductions, by the time I got back with camera it was almost done. It was big, at least about a 3.5" rod.Attachment 12012A dollar wait'n on a dime!Attachment 12011I told Joe I would post this. Joe, step up and give us the details.Last edited by denrep; 10-19-2010 at 11:25 PM.
Reply:Back together. Ready to dig after the almighty dollar!Attachment 12013Nice work Joe.Joe, if you don't come forward, I'm gonna tell all. Starting with the story about the time you changed fender flags on your Galaxie to disguised your 427 as a 390!Last edited by denrep; 10-19-2010 at 11:25 PM.
Reply:He just welded the snapped off eye back on...........Just like that? I'm gonna go out on a limb here..Because we repair stuff like that every day...It won't last.Nope no way...Not in the long run..It already snapped off once..It will do it again even faster next time..Those shafts with the eye in it are made in one piece..The shaft is turned hardend and chrome plated..One must "marry" those pieces with a shrunk in pin between the two..I'm sorry but 10 to 1 says snap once again.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:The ends that I have had to reattach have always been beveled to the root, so things wouldn't break there again.  I've never done a center pin before.Common sense in an uncommon degree is what the world calls wisdom.
Reply:Originally Posted by BrainfarthThe ends that I have had to reattach have always been beveled to the root, so things wouldn't break there again.  I've never done a center pin before.
Reply:I'll take you up on that 10 to 1.A knowledgeable experienced machine owner called the shot.The pressure's off, machine's back on the job. Repair decision can be reviewed in time. Owner's idea of a successful repair, may be; to be able to run long enough to schedule a replacement.Rod was not a one piece forging. Looked like the eye had been welded on at rebuild, maybe not so well. I'll try to take a micro pic of the cut out weld. An unusual event caused this failure. I think the repair will hold.  I'll be 100% with you about success or failure.All bets to be paid in Chicago.Get in here Joe, I have enough fights of my own!Last edited by denrep; 08-18-2007 at 11:27 PM.
Reply:Dont get all hot under the collar now... No need for  And whats with Chicago anyway?I would never ever even think of "just weld the eye back on" if it had anything to do with a Excavator arm or 'Dozer arm..No way no how..Thats just how we do it..Nothing ever goes back together the way it came apart..Stress and fatigue is what made it crap out in the first place..Stretch..bend..snap..Thats usually how it goes..You will never match the two pieces "grain for grain" again..Thats just the way it is..So the marry pin comes into play..Something that both ends agree on...We pronounce you two pieces married..Now apply the take over forever weld......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapsterHe just welded the snapped off eye back on...........Just like that? It won't last.
Reply:Originally Posted by zapster Dont get all hot under the collar now... And whats with Chicago anyway?
Reply:denrep, that's why I wanted to keep quiet.  I don't want to alienate a potential contributor to this forum, or even a lurker.  But a fix like that with a forum full of welders is going to spark some discussion on his methods.I've had bosses tell me to do things I know wouldn't hold but they would not put anybody at harm and it was their call even though I explained to them that it would fail.  I did it anyways.  An onlooker would probably think I was at fault being the welder doing the work but it was the decision of my boss, and I did it.However, if a boss told me to weld something that could put people's safety in jeopardy if not done the right way I would put my foot down and tell him no.
Reply:This kind of thing happens one heck of a lot. These owners of equipement know what they are doing or they wouldn't be in business, they'd be working for wages. Make a field repair with the best in the field. If it breaks again they'll weld it again. Most of the time it's done the same day regardless of the time of day.  One of these days when that chunk of iron isn't out there making five hundred to a thousand bucks a day they'll send that ram in to get it repaired right, or just buy a new one.
Reply:Originally Posted by Sandy...This kind of thing happens one heck of a lot. These owners of equipement know what they are doing or they wouldn't be in business
Reply:There is no question about that repair. Time is money! I would have done the same thing. The machine owner knows whats up. Like Denrep said, it's a REAL WORLD repair, not a perfect world repair.Come on out Joe! We're all friends here!Miller EconotigCutmaster 38Yes ma'am, that IS a screwdriver in my pocket!
Reply:Sandy I work in the mining industry and yes they tend to make repairs to get by till a component comes in, also the cyl is the bucket tilt cylinder and there are one on each side so if it was to fail the other would have to fail before a major incident could happen. As for the size of weld I don't believe the manufacturer preps the joint all that much either but they usually have more surface weld showing.AWS CWI Hypertherm 850 plasmaLincoln LN-25Lincoln SAE 400Miller Big 40D28' X 36' X 14' Shop_____________________________________Tools are not the the skill but simply tools!
Reply:Its all denreps fault if his buddy becomes alienated, since he's been weldin fer fourtee years, I am sure there is much better examples to take pictures of and blow his whistle about. "All good intentions do NOT get thee all good rewards" .   And derep wants to know why Jim is just a "lurkee" instead of a poster. There AIN'T no one here that hasn't taken a persistent customers money at one time or another, even knowingly and fully assplaing it to the customer that its not the right way to fix yer stuff.  There are always those types of people and situations that risks are worth it to them. No matter how many internet reported facts you show them.   Or simply your many years of Expirience and liscencing and the sign out front that brough them to you. You still can't change their minds and if you don't take their money and " DOOwiT "  someone else will.   Where you draw yer line on repairs depends on the situation, and we were't there with denrep and Jim. We are......... ooonly getting denreps part of the story, who knows how much he missed while getting that camera.  Now denrep go get some good pictures worthy of the mans fourtee years...... cheers  500 AMP AIRCO TIG LINCOLN PT185 100% DC @ 128 AMP-WTFSPEED GLASS 9002X MILLER THUNDERBOLT 225HOBBIEST TURNED WELDING JUNKIE8 2ND FIRECAT - SNOWMOBILE RACE CHASSIS FABRICATORPRIDE IS WHAT MAKES YOUR WORK SO GOOD
Reply:PLUMMER, you talk like a 13 year old gangster wannabe girl in a chatroom...
Reply:Originally Posted by WelderBoyPLUMMER, you talk like a 13 year old gangster wannabe girl in a chatroom...
Reply:It is a good "field repair", will it last ?...no, but it should until a replacement shows up. As was stated, it wasn't a safety issue so fix it and get it back on line. It could have been correctly repaired without a pin but it would have had to have the bearing removed because of the heat involved.PLUMMER, your stuff reads fine.Anything worth doing is worth doing RIGHT
Reply:Originally Posted by PLUMMER...who knows how much he missed while getting that camera...Now denrep go get some good pictures worthy of the mans fourtee years......
Reply:i have worked in the rock quarries for a few years, although i didnt ever really mess with anything that small, the fact of the matter is: GET IT UP GET IT RUNNING NO SLEEP UNTIL THAT MACHINE MOVES. famous quarry quote...i have "field repaired" some cylinder rods this way. some hold some dont. mostly depends on the operator. it does last long enough for the local hydraulic shop to machine a new rod and for the wrenches to install it. i have run into this often enough that "if i had a nickel......" a pic of a hitachi ex1100 shovel that i had to weld a stick cylinder back together on. the machine is behind the rig truck Attached Imagesnothing fancy, just a few hot glue guns for metalwww.sicfabrications.com
Reply:it's all about production. one of our excavators went down with a broken lift cyinder. i was told to weld it up until a new could be sent from the CAT store. so i run out to the pit, grind fit and weld. 2 hours later a new one shows up and me and the mechanic put it on. in those 2 hours of digging, he loaded 21 dump trucks at $375/truck. and thats the bottom line."Retreat hell, were just fighting in the other direction"Miller Trailblazer 302, Extreme 12 VS, Dimension 400, Spectrum 375, HF 251D-1, Milermatic 251 w/ spoolgun  Hypertherm 1000Lincoln sp 1702000 F-450 to haul it
Reply:Originally Posted by welder_one a pic of a hitachi ex1100 shovel that i had to weld a stick cylinder back together on. the machine is behind the rig truck
Reply:I dont think we really have a debate at all, just have 2 conversations running in one thread in a sense...Some of us are discussing how the part was welded and the likelihood of the repair failing...  Which I am not personally experienced enough with to say one way or the other...And the other conversation is about how field repairs may not be intended to be a lifetime fix, but to keep the forward progress rolling along...  Which I can totally understand, as I have changed an axle shaft in a dump truck in a mud hole before to save the company time, money, and a tow...  Axle shaft was 280 bucks used from a place 30 miles from where the truck broke, so me and my old chevy dump went off to find parts and supplies... In the end it was a 600 dollar mess, but the towing fee out of there would have been more than that!  And the truck got up and going and drove itself home that night... Nobody knows how long that used shaft will be good for, but I can tell ya its close to a year old and still going...
Reply:Originally Posted by WelderBoyPLUMMER, you talk like a 13 year old gangster wannabe girl in a chatroom...
Reply:Originally Posted by PLUMMERNow thats a phrase/saying  I've never heard before. I'll be sure to leave out the humorous to some but not all ....slang/accent in my posts. As I said before there's not enuff smilie's or slang to convey your intent or attitude in a post. Maybe I should add a few more of these          next time, so then I won't sound like a whatever you mentioned above again......  Cheers boywelder no harm eh...Umm please no personal attacks.David Real world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Originally Posted by David RUmm please no personal attacks.
Reply:I have welded rod ends on.  Almost all of them were threaded to the rod.  Wrap rod with wet towels......Welcome Joe DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Welder boy maybe some people aren't as good with the 3 r's as you are cut em some slack bro.AWS CWI Hypertherm 850 plasmaLincoln LN-25Lincoln SAE 400Miller Big 40D28' X 36' X 14' Shop_____________________________________Tools are not the the skill but simply tools!
Reply:Originally Posted by Dipper Welder64Welder boy maybe some people aren't as good with the 3 r's as you are cut em some slack bro.
Reply:Originally Posted by denrepI'll take you up on that 10 to 1.A knowledgeable experienced machine owner called the shot.The pressure's off, machine's back on the job. Repair decision can be reviewed in time. Owner's idea of a successful repair, may be; to be able to run long enough to schedule a replacement.Rod was not a one piece forging. Looked like the eye had been welded on at rebuild, maybe not so well. I'll try to take a micro pic of the cut out weld. An unusual event caused this failure. I think the repair will hold.  I'll be 100% with you about success or failure.All bets to be paid in Chicago.Get in here Joe, I have enough fights of my own!
Reply:ive seen my dad weld plenty of things like this in our business because time equals money get out weld it together you are back on the machine a couple hours later instead of waiting up to 2 weeks for a replacement .
Reply:Originally Posted by olddadIt is a good "field repair", will it last ?...no, but it should until a replacement shows up.
Reply:Originally Posted by denrep... hurry up emergency job......Here's Joe's repair on a big wheel loader,  hydraulic cylinder, eye had been completely snapped off the rod...
Reply:Good stuff here guys  I enjoy the different views and respect them all weld it like you own it
Reply:Originally Posted by denrepUpdate 11/19/07, Jupiter was aligned with Mars then Mercury showed up! Welder, machine owner and denrep collided today.Tigweldjoe has been working 6.5 day weeks, says "hello" and hopes to log on to weldingweb this winter.  He looked over the "ARC" thread, told me about a 10,000 amp anode job he's worked on, part of a boat building operation,  -I'm not joking-  details will be right up WMJ's alley.Owner said machine's been working hard, ever since tigweldjoe reattached the eye. Anticipates no further attention to cylinder, or rod, until cylinder starts leaking from normal wear, he guessed; minimium 2 - 3 years.
Reply:Seems like the right course of action to me time is money and a quick repair like that doesn't cost much money and is minimal on time, even if it breaks again what did you really lose?
Reply:As long as that loader is sitting idle, it's not making anyone money.  The reapir was done in a very timely fashion based on the owner's requirements using the best practices Joe had to offer.  The owner got back to making money and Joe did the job he the best he could under the given conditions.  All parties appear to have been satisfied with the end results.Not everyone gets to do the perfect fix under shop conditions, the real world just doesn't work that way.
Reply:im a heavy equipment operator for a local eletrical union and all i do is abuse the life out of equipment...make things pick up and move objects that they were never intended to move is the name of the game sometimes...good fix you got the machine back up and running..was it a permanent repair..i doubt it but then again it depends on how badly the guy is gonna beat the machine knowing that there is a weak link in the machine now..