tig welding process

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Lets say money is no object.  And lets also say I was going to welding school to learn tig.  Since there are so many choices out there, what are some of the best high end machines out there.  The best of the best.  Your imput is sincerly appreciated.  Thanks!!!
Reply:Probably the big miller dynasty, but that's just a guess.  Maybe the big miller aerowave also.  They both have some really advanced features, but tend to get used for different jobs.  Lincoln probably has a competitive model for each, I am just not as familiar with lincoln's bigger machines.  There may be some more exotic custom machinery, but these above are both off-the-shelf items, so to speak.  They are both quite pricey.  Take this from a guy that still uses an old-school tig where you have to walk up hill both to and from the welder and arc starting is done with a flint.Last edited by smithboy; 04-27-2006 at 12:23 AM.Smithboy...if it ain't broke, you ain't tryin'.
Reply:Well youre asking the best of the best, but as Smith is stating it depends on what you want it for.  What application, yes TIG, but what application of TIG do you wish to use this machine for?   I would say depending on what youre doing with it an inverter might be the best, or a pro 300 would even be good lol.  It just depends on what you are planning to do with it.IF it Catches...Let it Burn
Reply:As the other's have said, what are you going to do with it?  Once that's sorted then we can get down to machines.StephenI'd rather be hunting........USE ENOUGH HEAT.......Drifting around Aussie welding more pipe up, for something different.....wanting to get home.
Reply:I will be putting aluminum end caps on pontoons on poontoon boats, aluminum lower units on outboard motors, aluminum engine blocks.  Also I will be doing a lot of stainless pipe welding.  Again, thank you all for your super inputs, I sincerly appreciate all of them.  Thanks!!!
Reply:ambition...i love it ...zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:All that aluminum  you're talkin  about, i'd think on getting a 200 or 250 amp wire feeder (mig) and a spool gun to go with it. at least if you're doing new work, on the pontoons . even on lower units , it might come in handy . and , when mig alum  is   indicated , it goes like   h  e   double  l . look at aluminum boats . mostly mig welded , except at the ends  of seams . they are tigged . I mention this only cause nobody else  did
Reply:Again, please forgive me for the stupid questions but this is all new to me I am as green as they come.  Please explain to me or give me an example when tig should be used and mig should be used so I can get a sense between the two.  Thank you soooooo much.
Reply:A syncrowave 250 dx is a fine tig welder and will do any tig jobs
Reply:Originally Posted by irocAgain, please forgive me for the stupid questions but this is all new to me I am as green as they come.  Please explain to me or give me an example when tig should be used and mig should be used so I can get a sense between the two.  Thank you soooooo much.
Reply:On aluminum, power is everything.  I believe in buying the most power you can afford.  The duty cycle is better also.  I have an old Miller 330 a b/p which I can do most Aluminum on the mid range.  It is still working great after almost 35 years.
Reply:By the way.  On the other part of your question.  With tig there is no dought about whether you have penetrated and have a good weld because you can see that the filler has fused with the base metal plus you can slowly come off the heat at the end of the weld to prevent cratering.  With mig it is possible to have a pretty bead that didn't fuse with the base metal.
Reply:Maybe a Thermal Arc Pro-Wave 300. I've heard very good things about this unit.
Reply:If the 300 is as good as the 185 then it's a peach.DennisThermal Arc 185-TSWMillermatic Challenger 172VictorO/AAtlas Craftsman 12 by 24 LatheEsab PCM-875Wholesalem Tool Mill-Drill
Reply:Your really talking about needing three different set-up's, one mig, one tig ali. and another tig s/s.How many metres of weld is invovled with these pontoons per day? If you go tig with this then you'll want a water cooled torch for a starter, where as with s/s (if it's light that's is) the last thing you want is a cooled torch. Same deal with AC-DC, if your doing enough of both then you want two seperate set-up's so your not having to swap all day.If your doing heaps of this stuff with the pontoon's life would be a lot easier with a mig to do the bulk of the work then a tig to finish off and tidy up.And you thought you asked a simple question StephenI'd rather be hunting........USE ENOUGH HEAT.......Drifting around Aussie welding more pipe up, for something different.....wanting to get home.
Reply:i dont use 2 different set ups and i weld s/s and alum. allday same welder idealarc-250 just change from ac  -to-dc i use aargon with both and 1/16 rod sometimes i use 3/32 rod  mig does run a pretty bead but tig is the way to go. the hardest to do is holes in the bottom of the pontoons --dont  ya luv to weld alum upside down  what a life
Reply:I dont mind overhead alum...till the fit up aint perfect lmaoIF it Catches...Let it Burn
Reply:I want to thank each and everyone of you for all you great support and input.  You have know idea how much I appreciate all the info.  I am as green as they come but with all the help from everyone how can I go wrong.  Thanks everyone you all are greatly appreciated.
Reply:I have a Lincoln Power Mig 255C and was wondering what would be a good wire to use on light metal that is on the dirty side.  (some rust and scale)  Thanks!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by irocI have a Lincoln Power Mig 255C and was wondering what would be a good wire to use on light metal that is on the dirty side.  (some rust and scale)  Thanks!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by welder ROBA syncrowave 250 dx is a fine tig welder and will do any tig jobs
Reply:Originally Posted by irocI have a Lincoln Power Mig 255C and was wondering what would be a good wire to use on light metal that is on the dirty side.  (some rust and scale)  Thanks!!!
Reply:Thank you all for the great info I sincerly appreciate everyones input.  You all have been a great help.  THANKS!!!!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by TxRedneckI dont mind overhead alum...till the fit up aint perfect lmao
Reply:From a production standpoint, I'd use a spoolgun mig on the pontoon boat pontoons, use the TIG on the lower units and engine blocks. For the stainless, depends on the size and thickness, but probably mig.I have a Miller Syncrowave 250, with all the bells and whistles.  You can do just about anything with it.  The Aerowave is supposed to be a really trick machine too.Originally Posted by MAC702There's no question it's a fine welder, but if that were true, there'd be no need for the Syncrowave 350LX or the Aerowave or the Dynasty 700.
Reply:Originally Posted by riley mcmillanWhat does imao mean?  By the way, did you ask the welding professor about the cv for tig?
Reply:Okay, let me try.  Basically, CC machines are where welding began.  The current is what is doing the work and is the desired controlled variable.  The welder tries to maintain the correct arc length, but his variations are compensated by the relatively fixed output of the CC power source.  Of course, too long an arclength will cause poor welding.However, while developing wire feeding machines, it became apparent that a CV source was going to be necessary because the weldor wasn't able to control arc length anymore, as he does with SMAW and GTAW.  But a constant-speed wire feeder provides a relatively consistent arclength when you find the equilibrium between wire speed and wire burn-off rate for a specific voltage setting.Now, if one attempts to go backwards and try to Stick or TIG weld with a CV power source, then the small fluctuations in the arc distance from the imperfect operator would cause much wider variations in the machine's output.
Reply:I just thought of another way to put it.In reality, the GMAW process is still one of "constant current."  Notice that I said the PROCESS is one of relatively constant current.  But this time, to get the constant current (which is controlled by the wire speed dial) you use a constant voltage POWER SOURCE and combine it with a constant speed fed wire electrode.If you take the constant wire speed away, you really take away the control of the variable you need to control the most, the amperage.
Reply:I did try to stick weld with a CV source once, just for research, yeah research, that what it was; I swear...Anyway, it was extremely difficult to maintain an arc, and when I could it just danced on top of the steel with no useable penetration, and burned off a lot of rod.  This was with a 3-phase Miller CP-200 CV power source, usually hooked up to my Millermatic 80A feeder when I've access to a 3-phase shop.  Currently, that power source is in storage waiting for another 3-phase shop and the feeder is with the Trailblazer.
Reply:This is something Ive thought of trying Mac.  Ive got my bobus.  But I was worried without ever being told one way or the other if Id damage it.  Im aware you can run wire off CC with a voltage sensing unit.  For instance Don uses his bobus in CC even though it has a CV mode because he gets more power and I think better control out of hte CC than he does CV.   Im aware that the pulsed GMAW machiens are essentially a CC machine, but I believe its more complicated than to say that really.  Anyway, Thanks for the input. The story on the CP 200 sure is interesting....I am thinking, and have that the dia of the wire vs the dia of the stick rod would make a differnce too...but I dont know how important this variable is.  But I going on the thoght of resistance being greater with a 1/8"" rod compared to a .045 or less wire.  If volts were to remain the same the amperage had no choice but to be lower because of the resistance.  Correct?IF it Catches...Let it Burn
Reply:The bigger the conductors (steel wires in this case) the smaller the resistance.  A 1/8" diameter electrode will have a much smaller resistance than a solid .045" wire.Voltage-sensing feeders can be used on CC machines because they vary the wire speed constantly to keep a consistent arclength (wire burn-off rate.)Don's old Bobcat is, well, OLD!!  He'll acknowledge that on Trailblazers and such, the CV is way better for wire feeding.Yeah, don't even bring up pulsed machines.  Next, you'll want me to get into Surface Tension Transfer!!
Reply:STT I have read about and dont understand...there using on the pipeline I understand.  Very interested in ...although I have no real time to bother researching something i have no applicable use right nowIF it Catches...Let it Burn
Reply:Thanks to all.  Lots of smarts on this forem!
Reply:Thanks Riley,Its my understanding youve got some good input though as well!   thanks!IF it Catches...Let it Burn
Reply:Hi,Here is my opinion, I've used and or owned all the above welding machines metioned. Rojodiablo answered you best (my opinion) Tig will give you the best control over the weld and is very forgiving with regard to repair/rework. If I were pressed to make a decision and could only choose one unit and not a combo unit it would be a Lincoln Precision Tig machine.These workhorses have the power to do the job you metioned and you would only have to determine the amperage based on your job as to the size machine you would purchase. They start as follows Precision Tig 185...Precision Tig 275 and lastly Precision Tig 375..(my choice) You should consider before buying a welder what will you be welding in 6 mos.or a year from now and make your purchase decision based on that answer. Better to buy a unit that may at this moment larger then needed than to buy for todays job only to outgrow that unit by the next job. These unit are available as "ready to weld " that include all the necessary items to allow you to plug and add bottle of shied gas and weld. If you are not restrained by cost, consider a Lincoln Power Mig 350Mp with a Python push pull gun option (needed for aluminum) to do the bulk of the welding. Learn to utilize the pulse feature this machine has and you could greatly speed up your production using the mig machine with the pulse and Python gun to do the job. However Mig does not offer the forgiving qualities of the Tig Process and in my opinion would be my second choice or as I stated to be used in conjunction with the Tig machine that also has a pulsing feature and auto balance feature as standard equipment both of which give the operator a leg up on the burn through issues and require much less adjustments during the welding operation. The Power Mig 350MP is a new machine in the line of Mig machines, that as delivered offer a multi process capable unit to include: Stick, Tig (DC) only Mig, Pulsed,and Flux Cored welding. Ric
Reply:Originally Posted by wirehuntYour really talking about needing three different set-up's, one mig, one tig ali. and another tig s/s.How many metres of weld is invovled with these pontoons per day? If you go tig with this then you'll want a water cooled torch for a starter, where as with s/s (if it's light that's is) the last thing you want is a cooled torch. Same deal with AC-DC, if your doing enough of both then you want two seperate set-up's so your not having to swap all day.If your doing heaps of this stuff with the pontoon's life would be a lot easier with a mig to do the bulk of the work then a tig to finish off and tidy up.And you thought you asked a simple question Stephen
Reply:You don't need a second machine unless your workload is so much that you literally don't want to take the time to switch your settings around for the different jobs.The only disadvantage I can think of to a water-cooled torch (versus a gas-cooled torch - they are all "cooled torches") is that it is physically larger, plus has two more lines running in and out of it of which to keep track.  Smaller jobs would be handier with a more nimble torch.
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