Proper Way To Weld A Truck Frame???

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Hi, I Have 1985 Toyota Pickup truck and am planning on Cutting out the bad rusted rotten parts of my frame and welding in new pieces of steel. I am just wondering as to what you guys think is the best way to go about this?... Is it best to stitch weld the pieces of plate in or weld one long bead in?, The worst size patch i'm looking at welding in is probably about 4X8 inches, the rest of the frame is in rather good condition except for that large effected area. I have posted two pictures of the two parts of the frame that need repair. Any help is very very much appreciated as far as the best (strongest) way to weld these patches in. Thanks. Attached Images
Reply:1-You need to show pics of all the damage, the locations on the frame2-Frame repair starts by analyzing the above--it's not slapping in a few patches.3-By the looks of just what you've posted--that frame is toast.Blackbird
Reply:I'd be hunting another Yota to play "make one out of two" and scrap that frame.
Reply:Hey thanks for the quick reply, These old trucks are hard to find in my area, Especially in good shape, which is why i would really like to fix this frame up as everything else is in good shape other then those two spots on the frame and if you guys thought it was plausible I would change out the cross member at the back for one i would make. Here are some more pictures of the frame, I would really really like to some how fix this frame properly. Thanks. Attached Images
Reply:First you need to be a WELDER And the first thing i will tell as a Welder is YOU CANNOT WELD RUSTSquare oneBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:It looks like junk to me.If you are dead set on fixing this, first thing you need to do is strip it completely.  Second, plant a money tree.  Third, take it to somebody for media blasting.  You can't fix what you can't see.  Fourth, look over the newly cleaned frame and think real hard about whether or not it's worth saving. Nearly anything can be saved with unlimited time and money.My name's not Jim....
Reply:I agree, it looks like junk.Leo
Reply:^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^He's rightI don't see sinking the amount of money were talking about here into an 85 toyotaif your going to do a frame up restore at least do it to something worthwhile That frame is junk and rusted through junk at thatBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmIt looks like junk to me.If you are dead set on fixing this, first thing you need to do is strip it completely.  Second, plant a money tree.  Third, take it to somebody for media blasting.  You can't fix what you can't see.  Fourth, look over the newly cleaned frame and think real hard about whether or not it's worth saving. Nearly anything can be saved with unlimited time and money.
Reply:I did a 84 Toy snow plow truck with my son years ago (mostly me for the wrenching, but he did a crap ton of welding with me). It started with the 22R re-man + Bison gears front & back. It ended up much larger... Here is the scoop...(1) The frame will be gone from half way down from the torque tube near the front of the back tire to the middle of the passenger area, BOTH SIDES. It will look 1/2" thick but there is really no iron left, just rust & dirt. I'm suprised the spring mounts haven't caved into the frame yet.(2) the cab mounts are also prolly toast and will have to be re-built by hand, much of the floor will be gone also...(3) the fuel tank catches dirt & stays wet around the front where the inlet-return flange is and may be rusted through but the dirt is keeping it sealed for now... maybe.(4) the brake lines to the rear are just waiting to fail...As for the frame we needle scaled the outside after lifting the cab and removing the fuel tank and all fuel & brake lines. We boxed the frame, about 3-4 feet both sides which required 3 seperate side plates each side of both frame rails & 1 piece top & bottom. We used 7 ga & had to grind into what was left of the frame until we could get the filler to bite into what little iron was left, maybe grinding 1/8-3/16" in on the sides. After welding the side pieces to the frame and together the top and bottom pieces were shaped and welded to the sides.After that all the bed mounts were fixed by plating the inside and a flatbed flopped on the top.All the frame & cab work took hundreds of hours & the gas tank got cleaned & welded also, this is not a weekend job.This was mostly a project for learning for Dusty but he used the truck for some 3-4 years to plow a large estate he was caretaking and the lot for my shop. It now sits behind my shop with a very strong 22R in it with maybe 500 hrs on it. I got tired of starting it every month and fogged the motor for storage a few years ago. I'm sure the brakes are toast by now... Maybe I should part it out... It DOES have the solid front Dana axle.I was always amazed at how well that little truck pushed a plow though, in tight spots you could let the clutch out and putt-putt away, stacking over hood high at a walking pace was pretty easy, it just bit the ground hard.Live & learn, I was younger then.Matt
Reply:Have to agree with the prognosis looks like you need a donor . Frame needs to be cleaned to be able to assess the damage . You could blast or try a needle scaler to remove the flaky material . It will also quickly show how much rot there is . Repaired a Mazda pickup my buddy son purchased ,  it was a money pit . I set things up he cleaned. I had 14 hours of set up  / cutting and fitting . It would have been faster and cheaper to find a new frame. Or build one
Reply:PS would i take on another similar project again ???    NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply:Thank you very much for all your honest opinions, I was very dissapointed to find there to be two very big holes I'n my frame, I do still however plan on going ahead with this one way or another, now would it be better to stitch weld pieces to the frame or weld one long continuous bead? .. I plan on using a torch and brazing the pieces of metal on to all the rust. .. Lol just kidding I'll be cleaning up the rust and using a Lincoln 180 mig. Thanks for the input and help.
Reply:Originally Posted by Jeff25Thank you very much for all your honest opinions, I was very dissapointed to find there to be two very big holes I'n my frame, I do still however plan on going ahead with this one way or another, now would it be better to stitch weld pieces to the frame or weld one long continuous bead? .. I plan on using a torch and brazing the pieces of metal on to all the rust. .. Lol just kidding I'll be cleaning up the rust and using a Lincoln 180 mig. Thanks for the input and help.
Reply:Custom 3x2x1/4   TS , build a new frame  , Just need correct spring and shock hanger location , back in stock car stock frames we made 4130 custom frame to a Ford Coupe  design never was caught. Jojn
Reply:Originally Posted by Jeff25I do still however plan on going ahead with this one way or another........
Reply:JeffI dont know where your at, but those trucks are a dime a dozen around here. No rust in the upstate of SCI lived up north for 27 yrs, thats the worst frame Ive ever seen. Lord help you if your in a crash, that things gonna fold like a gum wrapper. Just my .02Learning one rod at a time
Reply:Jeff...Do not bother.Diving head first into this is like diving into the shallow end of the pool off a 1000 foot ladder..You will crash.You will burn.And there will be no remains.Trust us....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Hey guy's there is no hope here Attached Images
Reply:Originally Posted by killdozerd11First you need to be a WELDER And the first thing i will tell as a Welder is YOU CANNOT WELD RUSTSquare one
Reply:worthless repair... even if this were a paying job, i would not take it on... there just isnt a good way to go about this unless just like said before, strip the frame and then toss it int he scrap bin, get another one n start from fresh... them lil yoters were kinda famous for rusting out in cab floors n the frames...nothing fancy, just a few hot glue guns for metalwww.sicfabrications.com
Reply:i backhalfed an old dodge D50 back in the early 90's that was just like that.  another guy had started on it and my buddy had me come look at the truck while the guy was working on it to make sure he was doing a good job..  the guy that was doing it had already started on it and had actually used the old frame and cut a foot out of the crossmembers and welded it back together effectively narrowing the frame rails..  well, we were standing there and i asked the guy if he was actually going to use the stock frame like that or if he was doing some kind of mock up, he replied yes sir thats what i'm using, i replied what are you trying to do kill my buddy? he looked at me snarling up his nose and replied what are you talking about thats plenty strong..  i simply asked if i could borrow a ballpeen hammer, he went and got me one, i drew back and smacked the side of the frame and the hammer stuck through it.  the frame looked good on the outside but it was rusting through from the inside out..   my buddy's eyes got about as big as plates when he seen me stick the hammer head through the frame rail....  the next day the truck was on a rollback at my shop.. when i backhalfed his truck i had to unbolt the cab and raised the cab up about 8 inches and Z cut the frame with a grinder and cutoff wheel at about 8 inches from the backside of the cab to get into good metal.. i then made a rear subframe from 2x3 tubing and grafted it onto the front portion of the frame. then i fish plated over the joint where the z cuts were welded. i also incorporated a K frame and driveshaft safety loop at the joint.. i also had to make new rear cab mounts and new bed mounts, no bumper mounts as he was running a rollpan.. i also put a 6 point cage in the truck so that added alot of strength..  what your wanting to do is not a small task by no means.  its not simply just a patch job..  the rear of the frame is junk, i would almost bet you will have to cut the frame a foot under the cab to find good metal, and you might not find it then...  if your not very familiar with welding and fabricating this isnt a job for you, and that your even contemplating just patching it, your not experienced enough to tackle this job and do it right...tackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:I am only looking at the pictures but I don't know why you think the largest patch you will need is 4x8. Those boxed frames held water and mud and were notorious for rotting out. I have fixed 1 similar to this. I can't see how bad it really is in the pictures but keep in mind, you have to get to a place that is solid, and remove anything that is bad. make cardboard templates by tracing the areas you need to replace. Keep in mind the areas that look good are not far behind the bad areas. Best way is to replace the frame. 4x4 magazines and internet co.'s have aftermarket frames that are usually superior to OEM.  May I ask how many miles are on and 85 driveline and it also appears the body in not very good cond. either. You can put much more money into this than it would take to replace it. Can't find 1 in your area, get a trailer, go on ebay and take a ride.  I think "Boostin" said anything can be fixed with enough time/money,  This 1 is not worth it frame wise. You could build your own custom frame if you can patch this 1 with better results. Good luck"Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:Replace with new and good truck.Disclaimer; "I am just an a$$hole welder, don't take it personally ."
Reply:Why bother giving advice at this point? this dude obviously came in here with the expectation that he would get a "hey, cool project" and not a "dude toss that pile o crap"I had a '82 back in high school. One afternoon an insane downpour managed to pop a man hole cover so that it was sitting at an angle in the street. I hit that bad boy doing about 25mph and it ripped the rear axle clean off the car and spun the me around twice. Wasn't till after towing it back to my dads garage that we realized how rusted out the frame was, it was a bit worse that these pics.ESAB Heliarc 252Don't be intimidated by driving some distance for a good truck. It beats spending FAR MORE TIME and MUCH MORE MONEY and having MUCH MORE DOWN TIME trying to save an expendable consumer good. You wouldn't make heroic repairs on a toaster.The US is full of trucks. Better trucks than that go to the shredder every day. I dont know where your at, but those trucks are a dime a dozen around here. No rust in the upstate of SC
Reply:Well once again thank you very much for your input, I have posted some pictures of the frame after i went around with a chipping hammer and removed the fuel tank. The frame is most definitely in worse shape then I thought. All the inside of the frame and underneath of the frame is garbage/scrap. The outside of the frame and top of the frame is good, I have just not cleaned the surface rust off of it. I am now just planning on running all new metal from the cross member under the cab all the way back, also making a new cross member for the back, because that is shot as well.The reasons why I would like to still go ahead with this is because:1. Toyota truck frames are known for rusting out. and if i bought one with a better frame it probably wont be long before that 25 year old frame starts looking like mine.2. I plan on keeping this truck for a very long time.3. The body is in good shape for the age.4. It has fresh rebuilt Turbocharged Diesel engine in it.5. I love the truck and have the time money and tools to do this job.I started this thread to see what other people would have to say as to what a good way of repairing the frame would be (past experiences and that type of thing) hopping to maybe get some different ideas how to go about my repair. My plan right now is to run angle iron from the crossmember under the cab all the way to the back cutting a V on the inside face of the angle iron to allow me to bend it, then welding the closed V solid once i have the right angle. once i have the piece made i will make it fit perfect and weld it in along the top of the inside frame and along the bottom of the out side of the frame effectively replacing the rotten inside and bottom of my frame. What do you guys think of this idea? And which would be better to use Cold Rolled steel or Hot Rolled? Thanks you very much for the input. Attached Images
Reply:Go to a different state and get a good frame!!!!!
Reply:I'd only replace the crossmember.The frame rails i would just foam fill and bondo over the top.  I would also add a little chicken mesh to the inside for added strength.
Reply:My father always told meSon there's just some lessons your just destined to learn the hard wayYou really should reconsider this folly and get something worth your time effort and moneyto restoreAll the money i tied up in this old rusty truck went into the running gear for right nowBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:Originally Posted by LarryOThe frame rails i would just foam fill and bondo over the top.  I would also add a little chicken mesh to the inside for added strength.
Reply:Originally Posted by Jeff25My plan right now is to run angle iron from the crossmember under the cab all the way to the back cutting a V on the inside face of the angle iron to allow me to bend it, then welding the closed V solid once i have the right angle. once i have the piece made i will make it fit perfect and weld it in along the top of the inside frame and along the bottom of the out side of the frame effectively replacing the rotten inside and bottom of my frame. What do you guys think of this idea?
Reply:This is a joke, right?  Some kind of TROLL thread.Gordie -- "I believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Reply:I have been in similar situations. I have tackled hopeless projects, and put in 10X the effort, time and money, because I was stubborn. Up here in Wisconsin we're called Polacks. But you dont have to be Polish to be in the "hardheaded" family, you just have to be a mule.  And in my 52 years of experience, I have gained some wisdom, that has occasionally offset the "knucklehead" syndrome. The worst thing that you can say to advise a stubborn person not to do something, is say any of the following:1) No.2) Can't be done.3) It'll never work.4) It's a lost cause.5) It will cost too much in time, money, effort, etc.6) You dont know what you're doing.The best thing I have found, is just tell them (and sometimes myself) this:If you are going through with this be ready to fail repeatedly, and you may also end up with an expensive pile of crappier crap than what you started with.People will not only think you are an idiot, you will have provided them with proof of the fact. Be prepared.-az-[RedneckJazz]Miller Bobcat 225Miller S32p FeederMiller 251D Hi FreqMillermatic 211
Reply:If you decide to pursue this project, please provide pictures and identification information so I can drive directly away from this truck if I ever see it on the road.
Reply:Originally Posted by DSW...you will want to build the entire new section from rectangular box tube....
Reply:Dude, dont. Just. Dont.Heres a little story for you. A few years ago when I was like 14, I decided that for some reason I wanted an antique tractor. I discovered there were lots of Allis Chalmers Bs around here. And I found one that needed a ton of work for $450. I could have saved my money and bought a good running, straight one for $1000-$1500 and listened to peoples advice, but no, I bought the POS with a stuck engine and good sheetmetal that needed one of everything. Fast forward to July of 2010. Last summer. I stopped keeping track of what I had in this tractor when it passed the $3k mark, and it had a rebuilt engine and new paint and everything. It would never run right, that thing was friggin' cursed. I had a mechanic come out and he couldnt even figure it out. Everything was right, but it just wouldnt run. So after years of hard work, thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours in the shop, I scrapped it when scrap was up. Financially it was the biggest mistake I ever made. I could have bought a ton of tools for 3K, infact, my whole setup now cost just a little above that. I would really be rollin now if Id saved my money and spent it on something useful. But Im getting side tracked here.Why did I fail so hard?1)I didnt have a CLUE what I was doing2)I didnt have a CLUE what I was getting into3)I was too dumb to listen to the wisdom of the interwebz. YOU are heading down the road I went down. Only your road could end when the thing folds in half as you go down the highway at 80 miles an hour because you made a weld too cold. My road ended with a pretty girl behind the window of the scrap yard office counting out money for me.Where am I going with this?Lose the frame while you still can. If you try to take this on, it probably just wont end well. Think about it:Lets say you try to repair this thing.Figure in a couple hundred dollars for new steelAnd then some more for wire, electrodes, grinding wheels (youll need a lot of them), gas for your welder(s), etc.And you sound like you might need some new tools, so figure in some for this or that little thing which you will need. And then the wireing and other little things which will need to be replacedAnd youre talking probably like $400-$500. And this is gonna take a LOT of time to do, when you figure in disassembly, reassembly, etc.Orrrr.....You could get a parts truck, for say, $1000 off of craigslist or whateverAnd take it apart, and keep the frame and whatever else you wantAnd send the rest back to where from it came (craigslist). If youre lucky, you can make you money back off of parts and maybe even turn a profit when you scrap the leftovers.Weigh your options... Think about.[Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:Originally Posted by Jeff251. Toyota truck frames are known for rusting out. and if i bought one with a better frame it probably wont be long before that 25 year old frame starts looking like mine.2. I plan on keeping this truck for a very long time.3. The body is in good shape for the age.4. It has fresh rebuilt Turbocharged Diesel engine in it.5. I love the truck and have the time money and tools to do this job.I started this thread to see what other people would have to say as to what a good way of repairing the frame would be (past experiences and that type of thing) hopping to maybe get some different ideas how to go about my repair. My plan right now is to run angle iron from the crossmember under the cab all the way to the back cutting a V on the inside face of the angle iron to allow me to bend it, then welding the closed V solid once i have the right angle. once i have the piece made i will make it fit perfect and weld it in along the top of the inside frame and along the bottom of the out side of the frame effectively replacing the rotten inside and bottom of my frame. What do you guys think of this idea? And which would be better to use Cold Rolled steel or Hot Rolled? Thanks you very much for the input.
Reply:Originally Posted by Jeff25Thank you very much for all your honest opinions, I was very dissapointed to find there to be two very big holes I'n my frame, I do still however plan on going ahead with this one way or another, now would it be better to stitch weld pieces to the frame or weld one long continuous bead? .. I plan on using a torch and brazing the pieces of metal on to all the rust. .. Lol just kidding I'll be cleaning up the rust and using a Lincoln 180 mig. Thanks for the input and help.
Reply:Buy new 40' A-500 Tubing' 3x2x1/4=285 lbs 20' 1/4x4"x20'=68 lbs total 353 lbs @1.00 lb = $ 353.00  5lb E-7018 @1/8 " Dia $25.00   misc grinding and cutoff wheels and saw blades $75.00  40 Hr  fab time @ $35.00hr = $1400.00 Total 1853.00  Job Done
Reply:Originally Posted by VinnieHey guy's there is no hope here
Reply:Here is a link take your pickhttp://www.tundrasolutions.com/forum...otas-solution/
Reply:1. Toyota truck frames are known for rusting out. and if i bought one with a better frame it probably wont be long before that 25 year old frame starts looking like mine.