Getting started with stick

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I just got a lincoln welder ac180 (from 50's?) and was looking to weld up a steel 2x1x1/8" rectangular tube frame for a tool stand. It will be a ladder frame spread out horizontally so some 1g and 3g welds. Since the edges are radiused, would the joints where the metal come together be considered filet welds instead?Anyway, I need recommendations on proper stick to use. I was thinking 1/8" 7018 AC for the vertical down and 1/8" 6011 on the flat. I was also thinking about using a 5/32" 7024 since I have no experience at watching a puddle and just drag weld it..... Your thoughts please.Also, what are my best procedures to ensure this project stays flat and square? The ladder frame will be 5' long by ~27" wide with a crosspiece (ladder rung) every 1'. Flattest worksurface I have for assembly is going to be a sheet of plywood.  and I have some woodworking clamps and a 12" starett combi. square. I was thinking of tacking each piece from the top 1g in two spots and then tweaking square after the piece cools, flipping over and repeating on the formerly bottom surface and then just filling in the 1g welds on both sides and finally moving on to the 3g down welds. Again your thoughts and tips are appreciated.Thanks
Reply:the "drag" part of 7024 really means that it fills so quickly, you can drag it a long a fillet. you still need to make a puddle. I usually run 5/32 7024 at around 225 amps. You can use 7018 for the entire thing. If you are willing to roll the piece, you can probably make all of them in the flat position. Try not to dump too much heat into it at once or it will warp as it cools. You should probably practice with all of the above mentioned rods before you try your project, or you might be disappointed with how it turns out.Weldanpower 225 G7Ironworkers Local #24
Reply:1/8-inch thick tube?5/32-inch 7024! Good luck with that!I'd use 3/32-inch 6011 myself.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Originally Posted by CEP1/8-inch thick tube?5/32-inch 7024! Good luck with that!I'd use 3/32-inch 6011 myself.
Reply:as has  been said, the challenge will be not burning through..3/32 6011  60 amps or so   my vote...have you had good results with 7018 downhill?
Reply:3/32" 7018"Where's Stick man????????" - 7A749"SHHHHHH!! I sent him over to snag that MIC-4 while tbone wasn't looking!" - duaneb55"I have bought a few of Tbone's things unlike Stick-Man who helps himself" - TozziWelding"Stick-man"
Reply:Thanks guys. As you can see I have no experience in stick, but I am reading as much as I can which leads me to these silly questions Tenpins - thanks for the explanation. Good thought about rolling the piece on its side to make all the welds flat!Lanse - ty for filling me in on uphill only in 7018CEP -  I thought it was 5/32 because the larger diameter spaced the electrode further away from the weld allowing you to just touch the stick and drag, i get it now, thanksWeldbead - no experience lolBeing that the pieces are so thin I was defi. worried about burn through and warpage. 3/32" is the size consensus, now why 6011 over 7018 and vice versa? I read that 6011 was a deeper penetrating stick, do I necessarily want that on a thin tube?Any tips on spotting and clamping for square?Thanks again :-)
Reply:6011 would be my first choice, because it takes a little less amps to run than 7018. But 7018 is a fine too. You could also use 6013 for shallow penetration. Clamp this frame down everywhere you can, skip around with your welding, only make one weld in a location, then move as far from that location as possible to make your next weld, skip around until it's completely welded up, don't be afraid to take breaks to let it cool from time to time. No matter what, it's going to warp! Now on the heat shrinking 101! Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Thanks CEP, when you say skip around and only make one weld per section, do you mean to just tack it or do one entire face of the joint? I was kinda thinking that by tacking one or two spots per joint around the entire frame I could come back and check for square everywhere. To be honest, the critical dimension is really going to be in the vertical plane - it would be a bitch if the frame hour-glassed on me in the horizontal plane (up and below the flat line). I did watch a video where someone tacked up a pipe to a base plate and as the joint cooled it actually pulled the piece from out of square to square by a 1/16"!!...funny, I thought it only shrunk when you came out of a cold pool I got some rods from the old fella that sold me the machine, some look like the outer covering are rust, didnt know if that was normal for that grade or not. They are a few years old, should I use them for practice and fresh 6011's?Thanks guys.
Reply:Originally Posted by Stick-man3/32" 7018
Reply:If you have a nice flat table to work on, and a lot of clamps it will make it easier. Make nice tight fits, gaps will make the product pull more. Make as small a weld as you can, heat is the enemy! The more heat that builds up in one location the more the joint will pull. I'd make 3 to 4 tacks at each joint. I generally make two opposite tacks, check for alignment, make the 3rd tack to correct for the pull of the first two tacks, sometimes this 3rd tack will be bigger than the other two to help pull the direction I want it to go! Then the 4th tack to lock in the alignment. Bad news is, square tube is very reactive to heat, good news is it can be saved with heat shrinking.  Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Got it! Will defin. play with scraps to learn the feel of what your saying. Does rectangular tube react the same was as square?
Reply:1/8 7018 all around. No 6010, unless you have some gap to fill. When doing the downhands with 18 run it at about 150 and the slag will just fall to the side, use slight weave pattern if you want. Also instead of doing the downhands with 1/8 go down a sizw3/32 and run them uphand ( more of a dynamic load) but seeing as how its only a tool stand giver **** with the downhands buddy!
Reply:Originally Posted by chopnhackDoes rectangular tube react the same was as square?
Reply:Thanks CEP.  - The red areas are to be heated and allowed to cool - when cool it shrinks in that direction, the last three make sense, basically no matter what direction you heat the t section's top face, the point is the bar will shrink up in that direction. The first picture though?? The bar is already curved upward, wouldn't you want to heat the underside to cause it to shrink down?Millerkiller, I think I will use the 6011, I've been doing some more reading and the 7018's have to be kept in a low temp oven? Something about those rods not producing enough shielding gas and you end up with hydrogen coming out of the weld making the weld weak on high carbon steel? I am just starting out so its K.I.S.S for me!
Reply:On small shapes, I like to use a welding tip or cutting tip to heat, and a spray bottle of water to cool. Large beams I'll use a #12 rose bud, and a garden hose to cool.The first pictures shows the direction the tube will go when it cools.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Thanks CEP, I don't have an oxy setup, will a mapp tank work (plumbing soldering gas).
Reply:Never tried it, but it should work. May take longer is all.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:1/8 inch wall hollow tube?With 1/8 inch stick electrodes of almost any type?  You are a much better man than me to be able to do that.  I'd go more for a nice 'soft' arc.  Maybe some 3/32 inch Lincoln Fleetweld 37 (6013).  [tried some recently, not bad at all.  Lit up pretty easily, laid down the metal, what more could you ask for?    ]Or some 3/32 electrodes of other 'soft' types (not a hard/violent/deep-penetration electrode).Or for 1/8 inch wall, I'd be more likely to reach for the MIG with some 0.030 solid wire and C25 gas.Practice first with whatever method/electrodes you are considering.And post pics in the project section (we like pics).  The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:Will do as soon as I get some lead cables ordered. Thanks for throwing in your recommendation for 6013, what I read about it so far is that its less penetrating and smoother running. I may have to get a box of each and play around to see what's gonna work best with me. Thanks again. :-)