Demolition on old fence

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I'm bidding a job to repair a wrought iron fence.  The posts are 3x3 square steel tube.  I'm visiting the job site tomorrow.  I've been thinking about how to remove the old concrete bases so I can set new posts and pour new quikcrete.Anybody have a good method for pulling old chunks of concrete out of the ground?  Preferably wihout a lot of digging to expose the concrete?  If the old posts are set correctly, there should be a 9" diameter, 36" tall plug of concrete buried in the ground as the foundation for each post...If I win this bid, I'll have a bobcat with an auger on hand to ream out the old holes, and make sure they're the correct depth.  I'll also have a set of forks and a bucket for the bobcat.thanks.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:you could try wrapping a chain around the post and lifting them out with the forks. hook the chain on the forks and go up. If that wont work maybe get a good rock bar and try workin around the concrete a bit to loosen it up and then lift it out. Or Work it around a bit with the skid steer then give it a go.TJ
Reply:Did the customer specifically say that you must remove the old posts from the ground?  If not, and if they are still in decent shape, maybe it would be more expedient to repair them or cut them off short and weld new posts to the stubs.Tim
Reply:I use the wheel trick to remove posts.  Wrap a chain around the bottom of the post with a choker.  Run the chain up and over an old truck rim.  Then pull the end of the chain with a truck.  I don't know how well this will work in your case since I use it on farm fences without much concrete if any.Dynasty200DX w/coolmate1MM210MM VintageESAB miniarc161ltsLincoln AC225Victor O/A, Smith AW1ACutmaster 81IR 2475N7.5FPRage3Jancy USA1019" SBAEAD-200LE
Reply:Dig about 2 inches around it, and take a pry bar to it so it wiggles slightly. Then wrap a chain around the bottom of the post and either tow it out or use a come along.25 years of age.Been welding since Feb 23rd 2009.LU1007 Millwright (A1)
Reply:If your bobcat has a 4-1 bucket, you could just grab em, wiggle and pull.Was doing it the other day with some concrete set poles myself.
Reply:I just did this the other day. I was pulling round posts. I took a piece of heavy flat stock, burned a hole slightly larger than the posts, burned another hole for a hook and chain hooked to the bucket. I would first wiggle the post back and forth with the bucket to loosen it up. Then slip the puller on and when you lift, it binds and you can pull it out. I have used just the chain in a choker wrap and it slips off too much and I think that becomes dangerous. I would post a pic, but my "puller tool" ended up in the scrap pile on accident. I will have to make another."Where's Stick man????????" - 7A749"SHHHHHH!! I sent him over to snag that MIC-4 while tbone wasn't looking!" - duaneb55"I have bought a few of Tbone's things unlike Stick-Man who helps himself" - TozziWelding"Stick-man"
Reply:I was shown a trick once for pulling old phone poles. Warp a chain like a choaker and then hook the chain to a high lift jack, the kind offroaders use or like the old bumper jacks for cars. You will probably need to lay down some lumber to spread the load as you jack. You'll probably need to reset the chain a couple of times.I've also used this trick to pull 4x4 wood fence posts using a bottle jack or 2 and a couple of 2x4's nailed to the post so the jack can lift. 2 jacks works well with concreted posts, since you can extend the 2x4's out farther past the post base and then alternate pumping the jacks.The wrap a chain and pull with a machine, works great as long as your machine has the balls to do the job. That usually wasn't a problem for us, we had big machines, but tearing the post apart if it was weak or rotted was.Good luck..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by timrbDid the customer specifically say that you must remove the old posts from the ground?  If not, and if they are still in decent shape, maybe it would be more expedient to repair them or cut them off short and weld new posts to the stubs.Tim
Reply:That's not much concrete. Three 60 pound sacks of quickcrete, or 0.05 yards per post. The skid steer with forks will pop it right out. Just wrap the chain around a few times to choke it and then lift straight up.-Jim
Reply:Cut them off at the ground, slide a piece of the next smaller size in it and slide the right size over that and weld it. That is if the old posts are still solid in the ground.
Reply:Thanks for all the suggestions.  I left out some details in my original posting.The reason the job is being done is that the original posts are corroded away at ground level. In some locations, there is litterally nothing connecting the fence to the ground any more.  I posted a picture of what's typical.  The owner sent me this photo.  I'm headed out to the site today, to take a close look at the job.  Looks to me like water has sat inside these posts and rotted them out from the inside.  Some of the others look like they burst from the inside, from ice forming inside the posts during the winter. The posts have to be replaced because I'm pretty sure they're rotten from the inside and that the paint is the only thing holding them together.I can't set new posts next to the old ones.  The fence must be restored to original condition; as close as humanly possible.There's nothing solid in the old posts to attach to.  Stick-man, I wish you had a picture of what you described, because I think that's likely the best way to go.  There's nothing remaining of the posts that is solid enough to wrap a chain around.  There's 15-20 posts that need replacing.  I'm trying to avoid as much digging as I can with this job.  But it looks like I'll have to dig out around the base of the posts a few inches, so I can wrap a choker around the concrete and pull them out.... Attached ImagesBenson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:Bob, that might work, but I'm thinking the original posts are so badly rotted that they'll just burn away when I try to weld to them.  Not to mention I dont know if I get anything inside the base of the original posts below ground...Still I'll keep this in mind as a possible way to go. Originally Posted by BobCut them off at the ground, slide a piece of the next smaller size in it and slide the right size over that and weld it. That is if the old posts are still solid in the ground.
Reply:If I take this job, I'll be renting a bobcat to do the heavy lifting and augering out of the holes to make certain they're plumb and the right depth.  I asked the fellow at the rental place about some sort of grapple or claw that I could use to grab the chunk of concrete and wiggle, then pull them from the ground.  He didn't have an attachement for his machines that would do this....sigh. Originally Posted by LarryOIf your bobcat has a 4-1 bucket, you could just grab em, wiggle and pull.Was doing it the other day with some concrete set poles myself.
Reply:Just curious if rust is the problem, then why not just take care of that.  If all existing post are still plumb and stable, then why not use what is there.Perhaps, pour cement in the existing holes with  plate/stubs and weld new posts to the  plates.
Reply:Good idea Bob, but having the pic's to see, yeah they're pooched!! I did a fence that looked like this but they were on a wall. Just cut them off flush and made foot plates with four expander bolts into the concrete and stone. I do love a Bosch SDS hammer drill!!!!  Hey.......Just throwing out what drifts through my brain as I sit here, , What about chipping out whats left of the old posts, fill the hole with re-enforced concrete. Make a mounting plate with a rebar peg out the bottom that will stick in the new concrete and the top side would have two or four threaded studs to bolt a corresponding plate to, that's welded to the bottom of the new fence posts. No digging, so no BOB cat. Save some good bucks on that. Put a squiggle in the rebar so it can't twist. I like it, sounds good in my head. I can draw it if it's not clearCan't think of any holes in the idea, but I'll think about it more.Whatcha think?BertLast edited by bert the welder; 05-28-2010 at 01:18 PM.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:auger and a stick of dynamite per pole --Wintermute"No man's knowledge here can go beyond his experience." - John Lockewww.improvised-engineering.comManufacturer Agnostic:Blood----------Sweat---------Tears----|------------------|----------------|----Lincoln Red, Miller Blue, Esab Yellow
Reply:Tempting.....But, no.     Originally Posted by wintermuteauger and a stick of dynamite per pole --Wintermute
Reply:After seeing the picture, dig around the top of the post about 2-3" clear, by about 6" deep. 2 wraps of chain around the post as a choker, and use the bobcat bucket to rock it back and forth, then rip it out of the ground. That's going to be the easiest way. Second easiest is to bust the base with a breaker/ jackhammer, sledge and wedge. It will come out in pieces, and it's a slow process.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:So, I've seen the jobsite and it's just like the photo.  There are about 15 posts like the photo I posted, and about 50, yes, 50, that are swollen and split from ice being trapped inside.And to boot, all the posts were set in wet concrete, so the bottoms of the posts are full to flush with the ground.  I'd have been much happier if the posts had been set, and concrete poured in around them....leaving the posts empty inside.Bert, The idea of cutting off the bottoms and installing a 'foot' on each post might have some merit.  It's a temporary fix, as the rest of each post is also in bad shape.  But I think my customer might choke at full replacement cost for 65 posts.I might propose that foot idea as an alternative plan to deal with the 15 worst posts....Each foot could be bolted down into the existing concrete, or grouted down by capping each concrete pad with a layer of the proper cement/grout/...The problem is that it only delays the inevitable failure of all 50 of the rest of the posts.Thanks for the ideas.  I'll let you know how it turns out if I get the job...Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:If you have electricity and or air at the site at your disposal...Go to Home Cheapo and rent a jackhammer with a chisel bit..You will be done with these so fast.......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:How bout a corer?  Maybe a 12" piece of pipe 3 or 4 feet long and attached to the bobcat auger.  I mean remove the auger and put the corer in it's place.  Cut some teeth on the end of the pipe and spin it into the ground, then raise the whole thing up with the concrete inside.  Next trick will be to remove the core from the pipe.  Figure that out and you got it whooped.  It would leave you a nice hole for the new post at the same time.Last edited by Boostinjdm; 05-28-2010 at 06:27 PM.My name's not Jim....
Reply:I can think of a half dozen different ways to get this done. Unfortunately most probably are not cost effective in time or cost. The fast, simple way is to just get a backhoe or midsize trackhoe with a 12" bucket and scoop out each post footing. The down side is the residual mess it makes of the lawn. They do make a backhoe attachment for the skidsteer, but I've never been a big fan of them myself personally. Or better yet a bigger machine (15K+) with a grapple or thumb.One possible option might be an jackhammer compressor and an air drill. You can probably blow nice 2-3" holes right down what was once the center of each post with one reasonable quickly in cheap bag mix concrete and pour and set a new anchor plate that you can weld to. The rental place near me rents the drill and compressor for about $125 /day plus the cost of the bit (no clue on that right now). That's less than the skidsteer and auger /day..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmHow bout a corer?  Maybe a 12" piece of pipe 3 or 4 feet long and attached to the bobcat auger.  I mean remove the auger and put the corer in it's place.  Cut some teeth on the end of the pipe and spin it into the ground, then raise the whole thing up with the concrete inside.  Next trick will be to remove the core from the pipe.  Figure that out and you got it whooped.  It would leave you a nice hole for the new post at the same time.
Reply:That is a lot of posts! And I forgot that you'd mentioned the cracking apart of some of them from ice. That would null doing the mounting plate. Good luck what ever you come up with. Hope the client is at least understanding that it's a bit of a $hit sandwich and will cost accordingly. Sure would have been nice if they sleeved those posts.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.A friend of mine has the smallest Kobelco track hoe with steel tracks ( can pull it behind a 1 ton truck) and hydraulic thumb and it would have more than enough power to grab and pull them. Stubborn ones could be wiggled before pulling straight up.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:What other work are you going to use the Skid Steer for?  Maybe you are renting the wrong machine.  You could rent a 3.5 ton excavator and do your whole job.  A hydraulic post hole auger will mount on the excavator.   Get an excavator with a thumb and just grab the top of the concrete and yank them out of the ground.   If you are putting posts back in the same holes you don't need the auger.   Clean the old holes out by hand.  The auger won't work in the old holes unless you are going to go oversize on the auger.  I wouldn't bet/bid on all the holes being identical.   If you can't get an excavator with a thumb just use the bucket to wiggle the concrete and then wrap a chain on the concrete and pull it out.  You don't want to use the bucket to dig them out or the ground won't be firm enough around the new posts.  Then you would need a hydraulic hammer with a flat foot to compact the ground in the hole area.
Reply:If you drive the excavator correctly you will do less damage with the rubber tracks than a Skid Steer.    There is a way to turn the excavator that will do very little damage to the grass or whatever surrounding the area.
Reply:Another option is to dig around the concrete and then water them up depending on the type of soil that you have. After they have soaked for a few hours wrap chain around them and then lift them out with the bucket of the bobcat.Another option is rent a backhoe with a small bucket and with a couple of scoops they would be out.  A cat 426 should work.  We just rented one last summer and the rental company's were dying for business. I think it was 250 or 300 a day.  Had to rent a bobcat with the auger to dig 800 holes too, and i think it cost almost as much per day.  If you are going to have them delivered have them both delivered at the same time and then you should only have to pay 1 delivery fee.It was a  lot of holes!
Reply:no to utilities on site.  just what I have on the truck 3K power from the welder and 10-12CFM from the compressor.I'm really trying to avoid breaking up the concrete.  Not only is this more time, but it's also more hassle in cleanup.  I'd rather set 1 large chunk of concrete in a trailer for disposal, than a pile of fist-sized chunks. Originally Posted by zapsterIf you have electricity and or air at the site at your disposal...Go to Home Cheapo and rent a jackhammer with a chisel bit..You will be done with these so fast.......zap!
Reply:Thanks DSW.  No room on site for a larger excavator.  Many pine trees on the inside of the fence, and too close to the street and overhead power lines on the outside.I'm also responsible for restoring the landscape back to original condition, and I'm seriously worried about tearing up the grass and having to re-seed or sod around the area.  In my mind, this rules out using a large bucket excavator to scoop out the footings.  Just too much colateral damage to the site.I spoke with the client and the original posts were most likely set improperly.  No gravel under the concrete to allow for proper drainage.  So leaving the original footings in place and drilling them out is probably not going to fly.  I'll discuss this with them, as renting a coredrill and air compressor would be cheaper and faster than digging them out. Originally Posted by DSWI can think of a half dozen different ways to get this done. Unfortunately most probably are not cost effective in time or cost. The fast, simple way is to just get a backhoe or midsize trackhoe with a 12" bucket and scoop out each post footing. The down side is the residual mess it makes of the lawn. They do make a backhoe attachment for the skidsteer, but I've never been a big fan of them myself personally. Or better yet a bigger machine (15K+) with a grapple or thumb.One possible option might be an jackhammer compressor and an air drill. You can probably blow nice 2-3" holes right down what was once the center of each post with one reasonable quickly in cheap bag mix concrete and pour and set a new anchor plate that you can weld to. The rental place near me rents the drill and compressor for about $125 /day plus the cost of the bit (no clue on that right now). That's less than the skidsteer and auger /day.
Reply:Novel idea Boostin(not Jim   )But I have one word for you.  ROCKS.  This area is lousy with rocks.  1" gravel up to large boulders.  My yard at home is full of head-sized stones just below the surface.This is one reason why I want to just auger out the original holes, making sure they're deep enough for the fence. Originally Posted by BoostinjdmHow bout a corer?  Maybe a 12" piece of pipe 3 or 4 feet long and attached to the bobcat auger.  I mean remove the auger and put the corer in it's place.  Cut some teeth on the end of the pipe and spin it into the ground, then raise the whole thing up with the concrete inside.  Next trick will be to remove the core from the pipe.  Figure that out and you got it whooped.  It would leave you a nice hole for the new post at the same time.
Reply:I still haven't passed on this idea yet; as a temporary fix.  I'm going to look at adding weep holes to the fence posts.  I also want to look for a novel fix to keeping water out of the posts.  The fence construction method leaves holes for the rails to pass through the fenceposts.  I most likely have to maintain this.New posts that I install will be hollow all the way down to a gravel/crushed limestone base.  This should allow moisture that gets inside to drain away.I've been day dreaming about some kind of urethane foam to fill the posts with as a way to keep moisture out.  If I can find a realistic solution like that, then maybe I can use your 'foot' idea to patch the rotten posts.  Then I can plan to replace all the other posts next year.  I think this might work for the client, as this will give them time to find the money to cover the cost for a proper fix. Originally Posted by bert the welderThat is a lot of posts! And I forgot that you'd mentioned the cracking apart of some of them from ice. That would null doing the mounting plate. Good luck what ever you come up with. Hope the client is at least understanding that it's a bit of a $hit sandwich and will cost accordingly. Sure would have been nice if they sleeved those posts.
Reply:This was my first thought, but I'm having trouble locating a modest sized piece of equipment with a thumb, in my area.  I'm also not a heavy equipment operator by trade, so whatever I find needs to be easy to learn to use on the fly... Originally Posted by RaptorDunerA friend of mine has the smallest Kobelco track hoe with steel tracks ( can pull it behind a 1 ton truck) and hydraulic thumb and it would have more than enough power to grab and pull them. Stubborn ones could be wiggled before pulling straight up.
Reply:The simplest, easiest, most cost effective solution would be to cut the existing posts off at the level of the concrete footings, fill the remaining underground post inside with concrete, dirt, rocks, sand, whatever you have available, dig new post holes about a foot from the originals and set the new posts in concrete in the new holes.  All fence posts would move about one foot to the right or left of the originals on the same fence line.  One end fence panel would be a foot shorter than original and the opposite end panel would be a foot longer than original.  This saves the customer much money and saves the installer much work to get the job done.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Agreed.  I've also considered laying plywood sheeting to work on, but this runs the risk of just killing large rectangular patches of grass....shudder...which I'd have to estimate the repair cost and build that into an already problematic quote... Originally Posted by burnandreturnIf you drive the excavator correctly you will do less damage with the rubber tracks than a Skid Steer.    There is a way to turn the excavator that will do very little damage to the grass or whatever surrounding the area.
Reply:Do not let a lack of planning and organization on the clients part become a problem for you.If they don't have the money to do the job right, walk away.   It is not your fault if the fence was built incorrectly the first time.  Sounds to me as if they have Champagne taste with a beer budget.For me it would be simple.  Figure out what you need to do to do the job right.  If they have no money tell them to fix the damn grass themselves.These kind of jobs are a wreck looking for a place to happen.  Quote the job how you think it needs to be done.   If they don't go for it you are better off than to try to Mickey Mouse the job.
Reply:No doubt.  I'm not back up against a wall or anything.  I don't lowball work, and then figure out how to turn a profit.  The quote I submit will be for doing the job correctly while earning me a profit for my time and effort.I am looking at options that will solve the customer's problem(the fence is falling down), and enable me to do the job correctly, in the minimum time, with the smallest amount of effort.  I'm just one guy.I probably will (better than 50/50) lose this job to a dedicated fence company. One that already owns the necessary heavy equipment, and can bring 6 guys to the site to do the manual work.The only (long)shot I figure I've got is if I can bring some integrity to the project, and come up with a novel solution that saves the customer money.The client is nobody's fool, and knows what it takes to construct a proper fence.  I believe the existing fence was installed before the client was around.  Otherwise, it would have been done correctly in the first place.  So don't assume anything about why the existing fence is falling down.My whole purpose in posting this topic was to see if anybody else had a novel solution for making this type of job faster, easier, more efficient.  I've seen some interesting ideas, and mostly had my own opinons confirmed.  In the end, I'll go over everything with the client, and layout a quote that does the job correctly, at a fair price.Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and ideas. Originally Posted by burnandreturnDo not let a lack of planning and organization on the clients part become a problem for you.If they don't have the money to do the job right, walk away.   It is not your fault if the fence was built incorrectly the first time.  Sounds to me as if they have Champagne taste with a beer budget.For me it would be simple.  Figure out what you need to do to do the job right.  If they have no money tell them to fix the damn grass themselves.These kind of jobs are a wreck looking for a place to happen.  Quote the job how you think it needs to be done.   If they don't go for it you are better off than to try to Mickey Mouse the job.
Reply:Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_doAgreed.  I've also considered laying plywood sheeting to work on, but this runs the risk of just killing large rectangular patches of grass....shudder...which I'd have to estimate the repair cost and build that into an already problematic quote...
Reply:Weld a couple links of chain to the very bottom of the post, than go get a cherry picker and jack the cherry picker up attached to the chain. The remnants of the post will up root with little to no effort. Josh
Reply:If it were the homeowner, I would have the fence builder just return the ground to level when done and then I would return the landscaping to what I wanted if money was an issue. You may do a quote both ways. "100% complete" and "Ground returned to level". If he can get a better fence with the second option, he may be willing to go for the latter. Just an idea.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:Just some more parting thoughts. Folding shop crane set on plywood. Or build a tripod and use a come along or chain hoist to lift. I guess you can't get in with your truck. If you could , I was thinking a bed mounted crane might work. I think I'd leave the grass up to the client. If you put down plywood and it kills the grass, which I doubt as you won't be in one spot that long, it will grow back. It's nice that, from what you've indicated, the client is one that is realistic and wants to do the job correct. How did the client respond, if you asked, to the idea of just moving the posts left or right as I and Dessert suggested?Best luck. Let us know how it turns out!Regards,Bert200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:If the concrete isn't cracked, and you don't want to dig around to wrap a chain, perhaps you can drill a hole and use a concrete anchor to pull. The expanding type concrete anchors are cheap and will likely have enough pull-out resistance to lift a few hundred pounds of concrete out.  Go to McMaster.com and look on page 3290. The taper type anchor bolts are good for thousands of pounds in tension. Even if one fails, you are only out a few dollars. Use a cordless hammer drill to drill the hole, install the anchor, put a chain over the bolt, fender washer, nut and lift out with skid steer. With a decent hammer drill you can put a 3/8" hole 2" deep in less than 30 seconds.
Reply:Tri-Pod with a 2 ton come-a-long and a chunk 'o chain...Use plywood for the legs so you don't damage the property......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Save $$$$$, use a come-a-long with a 3x3x4 mini gantry setup. Light enough to be mobile on the jobsite, just pluck and move.Last edited by eliteiron; 06-08-2010 at 09:27 PM.
Reply:Don't underestimate the power of even a small bobcat.  Something like an S180 will deliver a righteous bit of muscle.  If you need to worry about the turf go with a T series (rubber tracked) - but bear in mind that you will probably damage the grass anyway.  A few sheets of 3/4" plywood will reduce the trauma to the grass.As has been written earlier, dig down 4-6" and wrap a tow chain tightly around the concrete and use the forks to pull them straight up.  20' tow chain with binder hooks (grade 70 DOT) is at Lowes for $36, load rated at 4500lbs.Practice controlling the bobcat in a non-critical area first - a quick flip of the wrist and you destroy things.Hobart LX235Victor 250 Oxy-Acetylene Rig (welding and cutting)Bobcat 773F-350, 1999, 4x4, 16' 10K# trailerOutdoor Wood Burner - 10 cords/year
Reply:how about a big pair of log skidders dig some dirt away from your concrete put the skidder tongs on either side of the concrete and lift.  I am betting the holes are not as deep as you anticipate.www.burdettenetworks.com