|
|
I've got a pair of projects coming up where I'm going to need small quantities of steel and it would be better for me if I didn't have to get them cut by my supplier (I'd only have to butt weld them back together) -- and I'd rather not pay the fee to get them delivered. Instead, I've been thinking about building some kind of side or top rack to carry the steel with my old Jeep.I've done a little bit of research online, and the California laws (seem to) say it's all right to have a load ahead of the vehicle so long as it doesn't 'extend more than three feet beyond the foremost part of the front bumper.' For the rear, the code says 'the load shall not extend to the rear beyond the last point of support for a greater distance than that equal to two-thirds of the length of the wheelbase.'I'm reading this all to mean that I can add 36" ahead of the Jeep and 61.5" behind it (since the CJ-7 wheelbase is 93.5". My initial idea is to build a rack with stops on both ends, to make tying down the stock safer and a little easier. But with a vehicle that's only 144" long, this gives me 241.5" of total legal length, which is going to just barely cover 240" lengths, since they're often a little bit longer than an even 20 feet.My first thought was to put the rack on the passenger side, affixing it at three or four points on the Jeep (with a permanent red warning flag on the back). But maybe it makes more sense to put the whole rack up top? I'm open to any suggestions and ideas.I've never seen a rack like this on a Jeep. Has anyone else? Again, this would be for small loads of steel (1" square tubing or less, only like 6-12 pieces), moved for the less-than-10-mile trip between my supplier and my garage.Last edited by Jack Olsen; 06-01-2010 at 01:29 AM.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:I have never seen anything like that on a jeep before. My suggestion if you go overhead which would prob be the safest as far as other drivers etc would be to mount some type if I beam to the front and rear bumpers which extend over the roof.Looking at your jeep you could probably make 2 I type beams out of 2x2 sqr tubing that could bolt on to the front and rear bumpers so that its removable.Otherwise if you go for the passenger type mount it could be 2x2 tubing extending to the passenger sides from the bumpers and then have a 2 uprights that would keep the tubing from hitting the body and cradle the metal like a U shape and then have the tubes stacked side by side and on top of one another.
Reply:Have a friend with a pickup truck and lumber rack? Even with a rack the overhang your proposing is pretty dangerous, especially on a short wheelbase vehicles. You make a sharp right hander and you end up taking out the roof of the van next to you. Anything past 3' of the taillights requires at min a 12"x12" red flag during daylights and 3 red marker lights space a min of 6" apart at night.Not to mention the whip from that much overhang on the material your talking about would bend the loving snot out of them if not kink them over completely. You might just look into a supplier that would deliver with a min quantity order.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Ggarner has it right; make a rack to support the lengths at the bumpers. I have a 1983 CJ7. I have carried a few full length pieces on top. The Jeep is so short, and squat that even a small load like that will make it react VERY different than normal. Pitch forward on the brakes, and side wallowing are going to be an issue with only 100 or so lb. of weight on it. Cornering will be scandalous unless you are driving really slow, and you just can't react quickly at all, or you WILL not like the ride you go on...........And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:Hey Jack, how much steel are we talking here? most places would deliver (free, usually next day) if your order was over $150. If your order is too small, maybe you can stock up on some other materials while you're at it?
Reply:Boat trailer.....Or jet ski trailer with an extended tongue. Thought about this one myself a time or two.My name's not Jim....
Reply:I've hauled lots of wood on top a like that...how about a extension ladder(for a rack)tie each end to the bumper then tie your steel on top of that.
Reply:Sunbelt rentals. Rent a 12ft. or 14ft. trailer. The last time I did it cost less than $70.00 for 24 hours. Oh yeh, buy the extra insurance for a few more bucks. Very nice jeep, why risk trashing it?Last edited by wagin; 06-01-2010 at 06:07 AM.Reason: moreMiller TrailBlazer 251Miller HF-250-1Miller MaxStar 150 STLHyperTherm PowerMax 380 plasmaLincoln PowerMig 180Millermatic 252Miller Diversion 180
Reply:Originally Posted by Jack OlsenI've done a little bit of research online, and the California laws (seem to) say it's all right to have a load ahead of the vehicle so long as it doesn't 'extend more than three feet beyond the foremost part of the front bumper.' For the rear, the code says 'the load shall not extend to the rear beyond the last point of support for a greater distance than that equal to two-thirds of the length of the wheelbase.'I'm reading this all to mean that I can add 36" ahead of the Jeep and 61.5" behind it (since the CJ-7 wheelbase is 93.5". My initial idea is to build a rack with stops on both ends, to make tying down the stock safer and a little easier. But with a vehicle that's only 144" long, this gives me 241.5" of total legal length, which is going to just barely cover 240" lengths, since they're often a little bit longer than an even 20 feet.
Reply:Weld up a hitch receiver for the front and it can also be used for a winch / bike / cargo / whatever mount... make a receiver for the back if you don't have one already...then make supports that pop int the front and back receivers... good for canoes/kayaks/lumber etc.. the idea of a ladder for middle support is good also.Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with years of experience.
Reply:I have planned for awhile now to put front and rear receiver hitches on my short bed reg cab Ranger pickup to haul 20' and 24' lengths. I have a cab-high T-riser from another truck that goes into a reciever hitch and I will build a second one to use on the other end, then build a headache style rack behind the cab so the load is supported in 3 places. This will save alot of gas money not having to use the big welding truck to make runs to the metal supply for shop fabrication projects. With the front and rear T-risers removed, the only thing defining the truck as a 'work truck' would be the headache rack, which isn't too obvious, like a full lumber rack would be.Last edited by DesertRider33; 06-01-2010 at 08:09 AM.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Borrow a truck with a rack or a trailer.UA Local 598
Reply:The Yeep may be the last vehicle that could haul the lengths of tube underneath the chassis and still have road clearance. Three straps and go.Don't forget where they are. Good LuckLast edited by denrep; 06-01-2010 at 11:20 AM.
Reply:Borrow a truck or trailer - I 2nd (3rd) that. It's probably worth the looking around or even the rental if you're not too far out in the woods. Saves you from spending time and risk on stuff not directly helping with the project, keeps you mind on the project at hand.If you gotta, well.. Lose the windshield and then bolt low center racks on to the bumpers. Put REAL BIG warning placards especially at the rear, maybe wrap the extended length in something bright. This lowers the CG and is much safer to drive but it puts the rear extension right at windshield height and most people are not paying attention to small solid things hanging in mid air 3-1/2' above the pavement directly in front of them. Or put on side racks (again, bolt to bumper). But cover the whole thing with glitter, spinners, playboy pics, anything to prevent people from just walking/coasting into it. Most of us travel on autopilot and stuff like this is NOT in the program! I myself have walked into my own material when circling my own vehicle!!!Rufus
Reply:I was thinking about the car cling on mythbusters, but just scaled down. Hook it up to your receiver hitch. I was going to do it to my civic.... thought it would be funny to see that going down the street. Attached ImagesThe Lord has declared, "This is my work and my glory--to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man" Moses 1:39Link: My name is John, and I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.-- ColdCreekWorks.com --
Reply:Obviously some people have no concept of "moment of inertia".Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Please forgive my crude MS paint drawings.I think you should build an over head rack. Over top of the passenger side (similar to the ones on the ford truck posted above).Your front bumper looks a little flimsy, I would probably stiffen that up a little. Also, I think should should make your rake "boltable" (i'm 95% sure I just made that word up) to the bumpers, that way you can remove it when you're not going to need it.I'm not sure how strong that "hoop" is in the TJs but I think for support in the middle you could just make a bracket and bolt the rack to the center support using a couple u-bolts.I hope that made sense.
Reply:Originally Posted by SundownIIIObviously some people have no concept of "moment of inertia".
Reply:Originally Posted by pandinusWeld up a hitch receiver for the front and it can also be used for a winch / bike / cargo / whatever mount... make a receiver for the back if you don't have one already...then make supports that pop int the front and back receivers... good for canoes/kayaks/lumber etc.. the idea of a ladder for middle support is good also.
Reply:Thanks, guys. It would be convenient to have something I could bolt on for the times I need to pick steel up. Renting a truck is expensive when you're only buying a $30 load of steel.I looked at some ladder racks, and think I'll end up building something along the lines of this:This rack doesn't use anything other than those straps (and the rigidity of the steel itself) for fore-aft movement. If I tie mine into my cage, I think I can make one that's considerably stronger than the one in the picture (although it's admittedly more flexible, allowing for the spare and the hard top). I can extend the support out behind the Jeep like DSW suggests so that the cargo isn't sagging/swaying like crazySo, I'm thinking something that attaches to the fore and aft bumpers (either bolts or 2" receivers), tied into the main hoop of the cage, even if it's just with ratcheting straps, and an extension out back with a diagonal for support.I've got a couple of ideas for a stop up front. I agree that the cargo can't come loose in a panic stop. I'll include loops for ratcheting tie-downs. Originally Posted by Eric NPlease forgive my crude MS paint drawings.I think you should build an over head rack. Over top of the passenger side (similar to the ones on the ford truck posted above).Your front bumper looks a little flimsy, I would probably stiffen that up a little. Also, I think should should make your rake "boltable" (i'm 95% sure I just made that word up) to the bumpers, that way you can remove it when you're not going to need it.I'm not sure how strong that "hoop" is in the TJs but I think for support in the middle you could just make a bracket and bolt the rack to the center support using a couple u-bolts.I hope that made sense.
Reply:I also like the receiver on each end. Easy on & easy off !!! Besides you could make the rear rack "lean" back a couple of feet to stay within the letter of the law. MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:I think you hit it right on the head. My only modifications would be to center it (which I think will reduce the load's impact on the car's handling), and a longer rear extension/support like DSW mentions.
Reply:dont forget you can also mount it under the car. get creative with some rope and you wont have to build anything. and you dont have to worry about flipping bc of extra weight
Reply:some of the iron workers that would come out and tie our iron have racks that fit beside their trucks like running boards. they mount a square tube to the frame and have a telescoping tube that holds the steel. on the end is a 1 foot catch so the steel doesn't roll off on to the road. they have four arms. one in the front and back and two spaced over the middle. When it is fully loaded they all have to climb in the driver's side. I have seen them full load both sides and crawl through the window. they would flag the steel.I once saw a one ton carrying an H-beam strapped to the bottom of his one ton.
Reply:Many people are doing this to haul their hang gliders (typically weigh 40 to 80 lbs each) on everything from a Civic to dually 4x4. Lots of jeep drivers. Most people start with an aluminum ladder on the roof rack braced to rear bumper. Better is to brace to front bumper too. Some build their braces / racks out of lumber. Most guys move up to a fabricated rack for their application when its affordable. Actually, the ultimate is if you can find a 12" pvc irrigation pipe. Provides stiffness and weather protection.Cheers,JasonI built a rack. Here's how it went together.Welding:Testing to see what a 20' length would look like on it:Permanent front mount (since hitches cost money, and the budget for this was, well, zero.):Rear mount -- same deal:Then paint -- you can see how the crossmembers attach:It's not pretty, but it'll carry steel:The whole deal -- scaring the neighbors:Eight wingnuts hold the whole thing together, and it stores flat:Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:The rack turned out nice. How well does it ride? Are you planning on adding the support ratchet straps like the canoe rack?
Reply:Thanks. I haven't driven it with anything loaded up there yet. With the rack in place, I just have to be aware that I'm 15' long, not 12'. With lengths of steel up there, I'll ratchet strap it in front and at the roll bar hoop. I'm going to watch for lateral movement in back, and add a strap down to each rear corner if needed.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:Looks real good, Jack !! Light and doesn't take much room to store. And can be supplemented w/ straps when and if needed. MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:I don't see any tie down loops anywhere. More welding. You can use chain links, 3/8ths bar bent into loops, lots of things for tie down hooks. You can't have too many. Steel on steel is slick and carrying mixed lots makes it even worse. Think slamming down on the brakes at a light and having a piece of oiled cold rolled tubing oozing out of the pack two feet forward. about three of those and you have to pull over and re-tie. The rack looks good tho, just needs those tie down loops/hooks."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Nothings worse than watching a guy pick up the contents of a pipe bundle that landed in the middle of an intersectionVantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Not to be a party-pooper, but is the tube heavy enough wall thickness? And are those 1/4" bolts and wing nuts? Just being the voice of caution, but it doesn't look like it will carry a whole lot of weight. What about adding a stop plate to the front in case of heavy braking?I really like the design though. Looks great!200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:This is only designed for light loads. My supplier will deliver larger orders.But the 1" tubing has 1/8" thick walls, so it's pretty stout. And my thinking with the 1/4" bolts doubled up and set in double shear (with 1/4" thick steel on either side), was that the upright itself would kink and bend before the bolts gave out. And the load gets ratchet tied to the car's main roll hoop, so there's not a lot of actual load for the rack to carry.But I'm a novice at all of this. So I'll take any advice or criticism offered. That's why I'm posting here.On tie down hooks, I have some that I could use, but I'm still trying to get my head around the best way to tie stock down to keep it from sliding forward in a panic stop. Can anyone be more specific with the best way to use a ratcheting strap in a way that minimizes the chances of pieces breaking from the herd and sliding forward? A rigid stop up front is tricky, because it would have to be 30" ahead of the leading edge of my rack. But I obviously don't want to be scrambling around the intersection retrieving pieces. Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:Originally Posted by Jack OlsenThis is only designed for light loads. My supplier will deliver larger orders.On tie down hooks, I have some that I could use, but I'm still trying to get my head around the best way to tie stock down to keep it from sliding forward in a panic stop. Can anyone be more specific with the best way to use a ratcheting strap in a way that minimizes the chances of pieces breaking from the herd and sliding forward? A rigid stop up front is tricky, because it would have to be 30" ahead of the leading edge of my rack. But I obviously don't want to be scrambling around the intersection retrieving pieces.
Reply:I'm trying to think of a way to loop it where any forward movement would 'tighten the noose,' as it were. My initial thought was that a ratcheting strap could go around the spine tube, since the roll bar would then limit forward movement. For one or two sticks, I assumed the kind of rubber tied down with hooks on either end would work. For more, I ordered one of these:But if welding in anchor points makes sense, I'll definitely do it. I wish I could see some examples of lengths of steel tied down to overhead racks.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:I like to use a gut wrap when tieing loads to a rack. think of the breast cancer awareness ribbon. the load passes through the eye and the tails get connected to the truck. On longer heavier loads i use three 3' ratchet straps. For what your wanting to do you might get away with using 2 x 2" ratchet straps.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Local rules, for one man and a Jeep, probably parallel federal commercial law. Basically, for this type of load that's two tie-downs for the first 10' and one more for each additional 10'.Good Luck
Reply:It's the ones that slip out of the middle of a bundle that stink. Have a choker both ends, follow the cars with the boom boxes and surf boards.MattYou're OK Jack, I'm just reminded of a '76 Ford Pinto with a Cat 642B ring gear on a skid banded to the top of the car through the windows... Yep... At least it was summer.
Reply:What's a choker? Do you just mean a ratcheted strap at each end?Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:Originally Posted by Jack OlsenWhat's a choker? Do you just mean a ratcheted strap at each end?
Reply:Jack, just take some pieces of 1x lumber that will fit between the uprights and use them for stickers under and between pieces of iron. That should raise the coefficient of friction considerably. MikeOl' Stonebreaker "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:Originally Posted by Jack OlsenWhat's a choker? Do you just mean a ratcheted strap at each end?
Reply:All right, I've downloaded some 'how to tie a constrictor/strangle knot' videos. Now I need to know what a clovis is. It seems like a compressible material (that isn't slippery) could also be inserted into the bundle before it's tightened up. Old towels are one idea that comes to mind. This would improve the coefficient of friction, as mla2ofus suggests.Jack OlsenMy garage website
Reply:You could use bed liner in a can to spray the contact area to reduce slippage.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:http://www.animatedknots.com/knotlis...matedknots.comThe Trucker's Hitch is another valuable Knot to learn- it allows you to really tighten down the the line.With those two Knots you can secure just about any load and not be lost without a Ratchet.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Sure knots are all good if you can tie them.I would just use a small strap but wrap it one time around the load.When you tighten it,it will squish it all together
Reply:Hi Jack. Just a thought.......If your ends are higher than your middle, and you tighten down, with method of your choice, in the middle, this will create a bow in the bundle. This will help prevent sliding.Also, re: the end cap I previously mentioned. How about instead of a plate stop, do a retaining cup( better words escape me). Kinda like a sling shot. Make a pouch that pockets each end of the load and use a strap, or what ever, to pull them tight, horizontally, towards each other. The pouch straps would be connected to the rack up-rights at each end. Quick and simple and easy to stow away when not in use. You could even use chain instead of straps. Know what I'm gettin' at? I'll draw it if it sounds like something you want to use.Bert200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Originally Posted by denrepLocal rules, for one man and a Jeep, probably parallel federal commercial law. Basically, for this type of load that's two tie-downs for the first 10' and one more for each additional 10'.Good Luck
Reply:Originally Posted by DualieUnfortunately most securement laws only apply to when your hauling comercially.
Reply:Really??? So a cop can't pull you over for an "unsecured load"???That's pretty nuts.200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack. |
|
发表于 2021-8-31 23:51:51