90 degree twist in flat bar

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I"ve got a little project I am about to do and I need some help on the fabricating side.I have a series of flat bar (3/16 thick by 2") that I need to put a 90 degree twist in.See the attached jpg to see what I mean.What is the easiest way of accomplishing this?Glenn. Attached ImagesSign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Vice and a adjustable wrench..NO heat needed......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:I would put it  in my vice, slide on a good sized crescent wrench with a cheater on the handle and twist away.  If it was too hard to turn I'd heat the area to cherry red, then twist.  That might be more accurate (heating) at keeping the twist area tight and more accurate as you wouldn't need the cheater so you could be closer to the action..Good luckBobI see Zapster was typing the same time I was -- I just got too wordy!Last edited by caldwellcpl; 06-06-2010 at 12:36 PM.
Reply:Where did you get the close ups of that bale handler? Only pictures I have seen didn't show that much detail. I am right about what it is? http://www.rockymountainbalesweep.com/Never mind they added some pictures since I last looked
Reply:2nd the about choices. If you don't want to chance snapping your wrench, build a fork from a couple pieces of angle iron or 1/2" bar stock and a pipe handle. We cal them Tuning Forks. Twist away my man, twist away!200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Even better than a crescent wrench is an old school adjustable wrench...the ones that look like a pipe wrench with no grooves in the jaws.  Like Zap said no heat is needed but if you're doing a 90 degree bend that small you'd better have heat or one hell of a heavy bench with a heavy duty vice!
Reply:That's pretty good Riverfront.I liked the idea of the sweep rather than the conventional accumulator, so I"ve been kicking around the idea and trying to assess the level of effort necessary to build one.Their pricing seems to me to be extemely high to buy one.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:A Mapp Torch will work iffin' ya do need to heat up the metal- takes a bit but it will heat it up.Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Ok, I've looked at this sweep. Very interesting. This would speed things up a lot this summer.It appears the arms can be adjusted for level using the threaded portion at the end of the flat bar. Does this imply that the arm is pinned to allow a few inches of float? It would make sense to give it some movement so it wouldn't get torn up.
Reply:Originally Posted by StampederThat's pretty good Riverfront.I liked the idea of the sweep rather than the conventional accumulator, so I"ve been kicking around the idea and trying to assess the level of effort necessary to build one.Their pricing seems to me to be extremely high to buy one.
Reply:I have a friend with a grapulator.   He loads hay in regular box vans for cross country transport.  he says it paid for itself within the first year.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by DualieI have a friend with a grapulator.   He loads hay in regular box vans for cross country transport.  he says it paid for itself within the first year.
Reply:Had a brother-in-law back in the early 70's with one of the grapples as there were made then. He also had irrigated fields with typical 24" to 30" marks cut in so the turf wasn't smooth by any means. As a one man show himself he loved the thing and the concept except going across rows was heck on the grapple, on the loader arms and on the front end of the tractor. If he slowed down enough to take it easy on the equipment he ran out of time. For a one man show time is what you usually have less of than anything else.  All smooth turf it's probably a whole different ball game. He finally had to give it up and go with a harrow bed."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Originally Posted by riverfrontI really liked the idea when I first saw it for my one man operation, then I realized they would still have to unload by hand and stack in the barn. So I went looking at other solutions and I really like the WR long Grapalator http://www.wrlonginc.com/Grapalator.htm   I was looking at them from a cost vs. a conventional accumulator/grapple setup and thought the price was a little high on both but I like the idea of a grapple that I can stack with also obviously the hydraulics would add cost but would also add a lot of labor savings! As it ends up I am still square baler-less so i can offer no input other than the above.
Reply:Genetically Modified....big time!.....wait a minute.....how'd this thread go agricultural???????200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Those attachments are pretty cool.I always look at the business potential of nay postings and this might be a winner. My last acreage has 10 acres of hay. The big guys didn't want to buy / bale it because it was too small. It went as salvage hay when they go around to it.The Rocky Mountain Bale Sweep is perfect because it keeps the bales clean and up so they don't get torn apart on rocks.  The WR Long Hay Grapple is perfect for unloading from the field. They are perfect for small holding haying.
Reply:OK, this thread is about welding up the bale sweep. So it turns out it's both agricultural, welding and instructional.Further research into the bale sweep turns up the fact that it was originally invented and patented by A.J. Meyers of Fairmont? Montana. I actually have a soft copy of the patent and it shows some interesting details, being that the patent is from December of 1957.The Rocky Mountain guys seem to have taken this idea (since I believe the patent has expired by now) and modified it to work on a skid steer rather than just a tractor.If there is interest I will post the pdf of the patent application. The other interesting thing that the Rocky Mountain guys did was to use 2X3 angle. This way you can collect square bales lying on the string or quarter turned square bales. By the way I am also going to add a quarter turn shute (which is yet another welding project) to my square baler. Of course we all know that has should be stored with the string on the side not the bottom.I too much prefer the sweep over the accumulator. Here in East Texas we have a lot of sand and skidding the bales along causes them to pick up a lot of sand and soil. I do plan on adding a grapple later however for some moving operations. For now however the sweep will do the unloading just fine.I just bought a stick of 2X3X3/16" angle to do some mock ups to verify some dimensions.I just came in from welding pipe fence in the back behind the house. It is over 105 degrees today so for us old guys it gets just too hot. I do have to say however that my 35 year old tombstone and 6011 rod did a fine job before I gave out. Did I say that 35 foot lengths of 2 7/8" pipe are damn heavy in this heat???I'll get some pictures to post when it gets just a bit cooler.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:use angle iron rather than flat bar. Maybe same price with no head scratching involved.tractor,loader.dozer,backhoe,and all the tools to keep em movin
Reply:1-800Miner:I think your right. I'm going to rethink this and use angle as the other end has a bolt/piece of threaded rod welded to it to adjust the height.I'll have to notch it for the bend at the top so I can attach it to the frame. That is unless someone else has a better aproach to doing the top with the angle iron versus the 90 degree flat.Oops on second thought, the reason I believe that flat bar is used is that it will have a certain amount of give when riding over the pasture. If the tip hits a bump then the flat will act like a spring...........I think I need to do a protype and test this out.Last edited by Stampeder; 06-20-2010 at 11:11 AM.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Originally Posted by forhireIt certainly does a slick job of accumulating and loading. Can it be used to unload also? The video only showed loading. Because the grapulator has bars in the way, I assume I'd also need a separate basic grapple to unload.
Reply:I am also going to build a bale sweep. Found this site today and signed to to find out more information. I want to use it with a front end loader. I have an old bucket and can remove sides and bottom and attach frame work to rear section of bucket. It has the mounting brackets to fit loader arms. Is 2x3 correct for skids? What lenght should the skids be? Possibly square tubing could be used instead of the twisted flat iron. Trying to use material I have. Thanks Al
Reply:On the Rocky Mountain site they say their product is Patent Pending.Here is the Pending Patent. Attached Images10_570_183_Attachment_for_utility_tracto.pdf (118.4 KB, 204 views)
Reply:patents only mean you cant build them for resale.   you can build 50 for your own use.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by StampederFurther research into the bale sweep turns up the fact that it was originally invented and patented by A.J. Meyers of Fairmont? Montana. I actually have a soft copy of the patent and it shows some interesting details, being that the patent is from December of 1957.
Reply:The pdf I posted was not the right one.Last edited by RancherBill; 06-22-2010 at 01:25 AM.I see this is generating some interest, so I will post the original 1957 patent as soon as I can reduce the size of the pdf file to fit the upload restrictions.I think the Rocky Mountain guys took the original now the the patent has run out and updated it.Because it says "Patent Pending", it only means that they have applied for a patent. It doesn't mean that they actually have this patented. No matter, if you are building it for yourself like the above there's no problem.Some of the changes they made were for ease of manufacturing and cost reduction. The original did not use a skid steer quick change because those weren't available in the 50's.I also don't think that this will be a huge seller as most people now have go to feeding round bales rather than squares. Squares are mostly for horse people these days and a lot of them feed rounds as well.jd1ar:Look at my comments about using angle iron to see why square tubing wouldn't be as good. I believe that 2X3 will work just fine. I am going to be doing some sizing experimentation so will post pictures with dimensions when I have it done.Thanks so much for eveyones comments.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Get CutePDF writer (free), http://www.cutepdf.com/Products/CutePDF/writer.aspOpen up the original pdf in Acrobat, click print, select Cute PDF Writer as your printer, and Print pages 1 to 5 as FILEONE. CutePDF will print those pages as FILEONE.pdf.  Then print pages 6 to 10 as a second file. Voila you have TWO PDFs.
Reply:Originally Posted by StampederLook at my comments about using angle iron to see why square tubing wouldn't be as good. I believe that 2X3 will work just fine. I am going to be doing some sizing experimentation so will post pictures with dimensions when I have it done.
Reply:I watched the rocky mountain bale sweep video several times. The bales on the wagon are stacked loose and not straight . If several layers are stacked like that it makes a very unstable load. It looks like someone is needed on wagon to reposition bales.
Reply:Originally Posted by jd1arI watched the rocky mountain bale sweep video several times. The bales on the wagon are stacked loose and not straight . If several layers are stacked like that it makes a very unstable load. It looks like someone is needed on wagon to reposition bales.
Reply:Found 1957 patent in google type in bale sweep and half way down first page is patent 2817449
Reply:2817449  Patent 19573065866 Second Patent 1962
Reply:Thanks for posting the image forhire. I too like the simplicity of the bale sweep for a one man operation and the fact that it doesn't drag the bales. Around here we have mostly sandy loam soil so the bales fill with sand and dust real easy.Like you I'm thinking the bale sweep for accumulating them and a bale grapple for loading and unloading. This solves the spacing issue for me.Back to your drawing, I believe the angle iron part will work out to be about 60 inches. A stick of 2x3 is 20 feet so you would get four out of one stick. Also, from looking at the patent and the videos the width between the angle iron rails appears to be about 2 inches. Anyone one else have thoughts on this?I've been trying to figure out how to reduce the size of the patent pdf but have yet to come up with a method.Last edited by Stampeder; 06-26-2010 at 09:35 AM.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Thanks RancherBill, neat little technique on the pdf files.So here is the patent from 1957. Sorry don't have the 1962 one.I'll have to do it as two uploads. Attached Imagespart1.pdf (106.7 KB, 107 views)Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:For the second part I had to break the text into two files. So in total there will be three uploads. Attached Imagestext1.pdf (140.5 KB, 83 views)Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:And last but not least the last page. Attached Imagestext2.pdf (77.3 KB, 66 views)Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Sorry RancherBill I didn't realize that your posting was a hyperlink to the patents. Pilot error.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:I picked up some used 3X3 angle and built something tempary. Made it for 3 bales wide to hold 6 bales. Cut angle iron to 7 feet is lenght with one corner at 45 degrees and welded curved up flat bar on ends to prevent digging jnto dirt, Angle iron spaced 1 1/4 inches and 19 inches for bales. Set out a few bales and looks like it will work. Bales are last years hay and a little soft and were on grass cut by lawn tractor so they slid easy when picking up. You have to go at bales pretty straight or they will turn sideways and some speed helps to slide them in. Center part is hard to see over tractor hood. It is mostly bolted on for easy removal. Thinking about getting bale wagon.
Reply:jd1ar:Could you post a couple of pictures of you test setup?Why did you chose 7 feet for the length? Was that just what you happen to have in length?Did you set it up on a skid steer quick change mount?You said you went with 19 inches. I'm thinking of narrowing mine down from that a little. That way I can pickup not only bales with the twine on the bottom but also those turned 1/4 turn with twine on the side.Cheers.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Glenn   The metal I bought is 14feet in lenght so cut in half not to waste any. I mounted on front end loader bucket that is 5 feet wide. Equaly spaced make room for 3 bales wide. Single angle iron on each side and 2 double angle iron with 1 1/4 space between.The two double mounted equaly spaced in bucket. Reinforced top and bottom rear on bucket with angle iron to prevent bending bucket. Everything is bolted for easy removal. If it works well enough I can built permanent wider one as a winter project. It might not happen because I got a bale wagon yesterday which is also a winter project. I will try get gat pictures have not been very successful postiog pictures.
Reply:Got some fresh bales in field and what I built works quite well. Spacing should be 1-1 1/2 inches narrower. My loader hydraulics are not quite strong enough for heavier bales so should use larger tractor. I one I used is 25hp. After a little practice hitting bales straight was able to use fifth gear on 8 speed transmission.
Reply:jd1ar:Any updates on this? Any chance you could send me some pix of your setup?How long did you make the angle iron bale pickups?I just about got my baler running now and bales in the field so I have to cobble something together to pick them up. It's over a 100 degrees these days and no one wants to pickup bales by hand in this weather.Thanks.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:jd1ar:I was just looking at the pictures of the bale sweep and scaling them I get that they are 4 to 5 inches between the double angles. Seems a bit much between them. The overall width of the frame according to the website is 101 inches wide.If one leaves 19 inches for the bales then this would take the space between the double angle irons down to 3 to 4 inches.Are yours really 1 1/2"?Thanks.Glenn.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Glenn    Angle iron is 7 feet long. Used 2 single and 2 double angle irons. Mounted them on loader bucket 60 inches wide. one on each side and 2 doubles equally spaced inbetween at 19 inches. 3 spaces at 19 inches plus 1 1/2 spacing for the two double angles equals 60 inches. It is 3 bales wide and picks up 6 bales. It picks up good but does not stack very well. I shoud have a tractor with bigger loader. This was a tempoary setup with entensions of building better one as winter project. It may not happen as I have purchased a bale wagon.
Reply:picture posting attempt Attached Images