Limited to 50 AMP breaker, need TIG purchasing advice

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Hello,Like so many here, it seems I am in need of tig purchasing advice.  After realizing that the cost of upgrading my breaker box to 200 amps would be more exspensive than a top of the line new TIG, I decided to go the adequete route and jack in some copper wire into an already existing but unused 50 amp breaker and run that to the attached garage.  No it's not up to code, I am armed with a fire extinguisher.My problem is that, since I am limited to 50 amps, I need to find a welder or 5 that match.  So far all I can find are chinese pieces of junk, but at the moment it would seem that it is possible that even miller and lincoln are made by asian slaves so I might just go that route even though I -really- don't want to.  I have a question: Does square wave TIG make it so high frequency is only used for a moment at the start?My concern is that high frequency could cause problems for other electronic devices locally, or so I have been told?  I don't know, I am not too worried about it right now, but it is a question I have.  My budget for the TIG maxes around $2,000 (that's US dollars)Hmm, I think that's it for now.Thanks!
Reply:I feed my wood shop and my garage  which have a dynasty 200dx and mig welder and a 5hp compressor with 220v 40amp feed from my home. I have yet to trip the breaker in the house..those who tell you that you need 200 amp service for a modest home are well nuts.
Reply:I run my Thermal Arc 185ACDC tig on a 50 amp breaker and it works great.  I use the HF start on it all the time and it doesn't affect anything.   For $2K, you can get the whole TA185 tig package, with machine, stick leads, foot pedal and air cooled tig torch.  If you want to water cool it, add about $500 for a cooler and a little more for a water cooled torch.  I got a Dynaflux Tig'r cooler and a CK Worldwide CK20 torch for mine.The Dynasty 200DX run about $3K for just the machine by itself.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:I would recommend a miller syncrowave 200 or lincoln 224. I have used smaller machines like the hobart tigmate which appears indentical to the miller econotig. Always wanted a little more power.My miller 200 is on a 60 amp breaker but a 50 will probably work. My manual says at max output it should draw 54 amps.I don't have any experience with the small inverter machines. They maybe worth looking into.IanMiller Syncrowave 200
Reply:Originally Posted by TEDI feed my wood shop and my garage  which have a dynasty 200dx and mig welder and a 5hp compressor with 220v 40amp feed from my home. I have yet to trip the breaker in the house..those who tell you that you need 200 amp service for a modest home are well nuts.
Reply:I'm running my Miller sync 200 on a 50 amp breaker and have had no issues so far even at max. I got mine for about $2K.A Dynasty would use even less power but probably be over you budget. If you don't need AC the Maxstar's would fall in your budget range IIRC..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I was in the same situation when I started looking for a tig. I only have a 50amp, but was told i can go as high as 70amp on a 124 or 125 amp box. Just need to look at if you will need top run your welder while running washer or Dryer, microwave, or anything that draws high amps. I have decided to go with a SW250 so I will have all the power I need if needed or wanted. The inverters are to much For  a decent size (amps). After talking with people the SW250 does say 110amp at max power unless it has that not sure what it is caller that only needs 80amps at full power. Again full power is like 300 or so amps(not sure) I will not need that much as of now and will be moving in a year so will make sure new house has 200 amp service, With that I will just not turn my welder up so it will work with the 50amp. A lot of guys on here have run there SW250 on 50 amp breakers for years with no problem. Just do not turn it all the way up.
Reply:Originally Posted by speedyshark1 After talking with people the SW250 does say 110amp at max power unless it has that not sure what it is caller that only needs 80amps at full power.
Reply:Thanks for the name. I am going to pick up my new to me SW 250 tomorrow  and will look to see if it says that on it. If not oh well still good at $1,500 with everything including water cooler and torch. Picking it up at a LWS talked the guy to get it checked by pro before I buy at that price. For the price and what you get I would look at a used SW250 if you have room. I would advise anyone new to welding or not who is buying a used machine, Get it checked by a LWS. Around here TX it was $75 and PO is paying fore it. Spending $1,500 I would have paid for it if I needed to. If you are looking at a used unit and the guy will not take to a shop or let you take it and he ride with you then something is wrong or he just not to interested in selling it.
Reply:Originally Posted by TEDI feed my wood shop and my garage  which have a dynasty 200dx and mig welder and a 5hp compressor with 220v 40amp feed from my home. I have yet to trip the breaker in the house..those who tell you that you need 200 amp service for a modest home are well nuts.
Reply:Originally Posted by pinjasHello,Like so many here, it seems I am in need of tig purchasing advice.  After realizing that the cost of upgrading my breaker box to 200 amps would be more exspensive than a top of the line new TIG, I decided to go the adequete route and jack in some copper wire into an already existing but unused 50 amp breaker and run that to the attached garage.  No it's not up to code, I am armed with a fire extinguisher.My problem is that, since I am limited to 50 amps, I need to find a welder or 5 that match.  So far all I can find are chinese pieces of junk, but at the moment it would seem that it is possible that even miller and lincoln are made by asian slaves so I might just go that route even though I -really- don't want to.  I have a question: Does square wave TIG make it so high frequency is only used for a moment at the start?My concern is that high frequency could cause problems for other electronic devices locally, or so I have been told?  I don't know, I am not too worried about it right now, but it is a question I have.  My budget for the TIG maxes around $2,000 (that's US dollars)Hmm, I think that's it for now.Thanks!
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI'm running my Miller sync 200 on a 50 amp breaker and have had no issues so far even at max. I got mine for about $2K.A Dynasty would use even less power but probably be over you budget. If you don't need AC the Maxstar's would fall in your budget range IIRC.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldwadeThere are many GTAW Tig machines out on the market, I am sure you have been looking at many of them. Stay away from the cheap wannabe welders you will regret it! Buy a solid name in the industry and that can be other than Lincoln or Miller. My small Tig machine is a Dynasty200dx. This machine is an inverter and uses only 15.8 amps 230V AC input power at rated full load. This machine will probably suit any hobbyists welding needs. Cost may be a factor with it though, you should be able to get the machine with everything you need to Tig/Stick for under 2.5K if your LWS will make you a good deal. Talk to these people and see what kind of smoking deal they can make you on something that will fit your needs. The best advice is to get more output than you think you will need within your budget because more than enough power now may become not enough as you progress in later years.Some of the new Tig machines with advanced squarewave arc do not use continuous HF. The best bet if you are worried is to drive a full 6' ground rod and ground all your equipment to this ground. I have never had a problem with HF messing up my computer, I do have a good ground grid in my shop and the computers are in the office about 20' away.Look on Craigslist, ebay etc... You can find really good deals there. I bought an XMT 304 CC/CV with optima and 22A feeder for 1K on Craigslist! keep an eye out for good deals. I have seen many engine driven machines like Bobcats and Rangers for well under 2K on these sights. These machines are AC/DC CC/CV machines that you can mig, stick and tig with add on's. Make sure it has AC output if you go this route and want to weld Aluminum. When I first started out I had a Bobcat225 and used scratch start Tig because I could not afford a HF arc starter at the time. Do the best you can with what you have, be resourceful and never stop learning. My rule has always been buy something name brand with good service. Just my .02Wade
Reply:Does anyone know of the miller syncrowave 200 uses continuous high frequency?It seems the dynasty DX does not use continuous high frequency, I almost feel that is essential, 'advanced square wave'.  Does the thermal arc 185 have the same feature?  I have done a lot of reading on the topic but the answer seems to elude me with ease.What about the lincoln 205v?
Reply:I also just purchased a Thermal Arc 185 (TA185).I bought a floor model for $1700.00. Came with a 3/5 year warranty. Came with argon regulator, stinger(rod holder), ground clamp,Abitig 26 air cooled torch with nice switch and ampcontrol,extra cups,collets,back caps, new inverter ac/dc stick/tig welder, and manuel. I bought a lotus foot pedal off ebay for $69 and ordered different plug from digi-key.com for $18.This is an awsome unit. I use pulse and HF for finer welding jobs. There is a hot start feature that you can adjust from 0amps to 70A. Hot start works with stick and tig to strike an arc.pre flowhot startinitial currentup slopepulse peak currentpulse base currentweld current/tig/stickspot timepulse widthpulse frequencyAC frequencywave balancedown slopecrator currentpost flowHas 5 pre set parameters to have five different welding settings so all you have to do is save each setting to a number 1-5. Then later load the number for the determined weld setting, so you dont have to go through all the processes(sequences) to find the right parameters to weld.It seems like alot but it really is easy once you know the sequence.Between this web site and the manuel you should have no problem. I used to weld with a syncrowave 350, it took up alot of space and electricity.The TA185 is small and uses very little electricity. I like this welder. Make sure you get a warranty with any machine you buy.Good luck!THE OLDER I GET! THE  SMARTER MY DAD WAS!Thermal Arc 185 inverter Tig welderABITIG 26  tig torchLotus foot pedalLincoln 225 stick welderClark 185SG Mig spoolgunwelderVictor torch/regulatorsHF36" shear,bender,roller.
Reply:Just because a welder is rated for higher than 50A input, doesn't mean you can't still run it on 50A.  You will just be limited to lower settings.  I only have 60A down to my shop and keep the welders on a 50A breaker, even though they want 110A.  Eventually I'll get more power down to the shop, but for now they are fine for TIG as long as I keep the power out to less than 50%.  I realize that there isn't much point in spending money for more machine than you will use, but sometimes the larger machines show up cheap from industrial or school auctions, and you CAN use them if you want.Just remember to keep your wiring upgraded should you ever move up in amperage.EMT-P, USN (retarded), part-time blacksmithLTEC & Linde Heliarc 250 HF, Millermatic 185,Victor/Uniweld O/A and propanelathes/mills/shapers/power hammers/etc
Reply:Originally Posted by weldwadeYou can find really good deals there. I bought an XMT 304 CC/CV with optima and 22A feeder for 1K on Craigslist! keep an eye out for good deals. Wade
Reply:Originally Posted by DesertRider33That's a SMOKIN' deal on an XMT304 with an Optima and a 22A feeder for one G!!   I've never seen a deal that good.  Hope  you checked the serial numbers before you bought it!   I got my XMT used for $1500 and that was a very fair price.   My Suitcase 8VS feeder I bought used for $500 and that was very good deal.  Unfortunately, it was stolen soon after I bought it and it cost me $2000 to replace it with an 8RC.   I just bought an Optima used for $400 and that was a good deal too, assuming the seller actually sends it (hasn't got here yet).
Reply:Glad it wasnt hot!  Yeah sometimes it's better to part ways.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Originally Posted by pinjasI was looking at millers website, http://www.millerwelds.com/products/tig/ and I was trying to figure out what the 'dash' is referring to under some of the columns.  I suppose it means it is a feature that isn't available.How does the sync 200 do on aluminum?  I am considering that TIG right now, good price.Someone just put up at dynasty 300 DX for 800 dollars.  The case looks scratched up, there doesn't seem to be anything but the box, and it is being sold 'as is'.  I am a bit hesitant about that one.  http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/for/1342049664.html
Reply:In DC, the HF is start-only on just about any tig with HF.  There's no reason for it to stay on in DC.   On most, in DC you can choose to start with HF or scratch or whatever other start feature the machine has available (lift start).   On non-inverter tigs, in AC the HF is continuous.  If it wasn't, the arc would extinguish immediately after starting.   Some inverters have fast enough switching to not need continuous HF in AC.Last edited by DesertRider33; 08-26-2009 at 08:08 PM.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Originally Posted by DesertRider33In DC, the HF is start-only on just about any tig with HF.  There's no reason for it to stay on in DC.   On most, in DC you can choose to start with HF or scratch or whatever other start feature the machine has available (lift start).   On non-inverter tigs, in AC the HF is continuous.  If it wasn't, the arc would extinguish immediately after starting.   Some inverters have fast enough switching to not need continuous HF in AC.
Reply:I went and checked out the miller syncrowave 200, it seems to come with everything the runner package comes with.I didn't test it though, we plugged it in, messed with the knobs, all that looks fine, but I didn't actually test it, think I should?  I know where the guy lives and all.  He says he has only used it around 3 hours and he bought it in 2007, 1200 sounds like a great price.  Do you think I should bring out some aluminum and try and play with it a little?  What about looking inside of it?  Or maybe should I bring someone who knows lots more about this?
Reply:I agree, I'd buy that no problem..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI agree, I'd buy that no problem.The warranty is good for 3 years from purchase date on most Miller welding machines.   You don't need any paperwork.   Miller knows by checking the serial number when it was first sold and what dealer sold it.  They will also know who is the registered owner of it, if the original owner filled out the registration card and sent it in, or registered it online.   I would get a bill of sale from the seller.   If he has the owner's manual and dvd or video tape that comes with the machine when new, all the better.   You can call and check the serial number with Miller to ensure the machine has not been reported to them as stolen.  Call 1-800-4-A-Miller  and the answering service people will direct you to the Syncrowave service dept for serial number check.I don't know about your HF interference question.  I've not had a problem with it but I could just be lucky too.I'm not up on the pricing of used Syncrowave 200's but if 7A749 and DSW both agree that's a great deal, I would go for it, if the machine fits your needs.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op