Rate my Weld PLEASE!!

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Please tell me what you think because my teacher just nods at me and says good job. First pic is my root weld for a 3G(MIG). Second pic is my finished product after 1 cap and 1fill. Thank you Attached Images
Reply:*nods*  Good job.  No, actually that IS a good job, looks nice and even.  Have you tried cutting it apart to check for root penetration?
Reply:Thanks! I did a few more in class and we bent them. One of them broke because I wasn't hot enough on my fill pass and didn't achieve fusion. It is a groove weld so I could see that the root went through to the back, but some of my subsequent passes were just not hot enough. Gotta keep practicing...
Reply:Looks nice. Looks like half way you stopped to change positions? What school you go to?
Reply:Thanks! Ya- I stopped to check and see how it looked, just because I want to make sure that I am on the right track before I finished. It helps me get the feel for what I need to be doing. If I can get used to the right motion, then I can usually go without stopping to finish. I go to NAIT in Edmonton. Just a pre-trades welding course for now-I LOVE IT, and I am hoping to pursue an apprenticeship.
Reply:Ya I went to TSTC and loved it. But ya you look like your on track, i'm no inspector tho. Lol I had a spray MIG job once tho that required me to weld 24" with out stopping. I usually placed my body in position at the end of the joint I was welding, then brought my hands to the start point and eased into the path towards the end. It worked well since the struggle was to hold the position at the begging befor I got tired. Then the weld increasingly became easier
Reply:Cool! thanks for the tip!
Reply:is that uphill or downhill?safety last
Reply:Root is down and fill and cap up.
Reply:for someone just learning i think its very good.i know senior's in my major, agriculture mechanics (we build a lot of trailers) that cant weld anywhere that well. keep up the practice and youll have it in no timeI break things for a living...
Reply:Root looks good, speed up on your cap though your spending way too much time in the middle of the bevel. watch the edges of the plate and pause on each edge of the bevel then quickly across the middle and you will get alot smoother caps. With it being mig and its high deposition rate watch that you dont take your filler pass right to the edge of the bevel, have it so your filler pass is even 3/32" below the plate and that will aid in keeping your cap smaller. Once you get into testing height of the cap, and width are very important to keep in mind.
Reply:agree
Reply:what does the back side look like?Have we all gone mad?
Reply:They're teaching you to drag your root? o.OThat's easy...Should go vert up on roots with Short circuit.Waaayyyyy the hell better penetration.Kinda weird that a school would teach that way though imo.I'd get shot (well, fired anyway) if I ever welded mig vert down... on anything, lol.Spray or Short circuit.even if it's a fill/cap.edit;p.s.faster across the middle.
Reply:Originally Posted by HassThey're teaching you to drag your root? o.OThat's easy...Should go vert up on roots with Short circuit.Waaayyyyy the hell better penetration.Kinda weird that a school would teach that way though imo.I'd get shot (well, fired anyway) if I ever welded mig vert down... on anything, lol.Spray or Short circuit.even if it's a fill/cap.edit;p.s.faster across the middle.
Reply:**taking lotsa notes on this thread .... figures since I do MIG myself, couldn't hurt to know as much as possible about what I'm doing and should be doing ....**
Reply:its all about having a steady hand, the more u practice the better u get. btw looks alot better than when i startedlincoln weld pac 100Hobart handler 120Lincoln  "BuZZ box"Lincoln Precision Tig 225
Reply:not to be mean, and my eye site is going...but I see porosity in the root, it is a nice looking root, but has porosity. This needs to be ground out before continuing with fill or cap. Good advice I think? If I'm wrong, I apologize, but if not, we should not give false praise. This person is learning, we should teach....no false praise.Last edited by wagin; 10-21-2009 at 03:42 AM.Reason: misleadingMiller TrailBlazer 251Miller HF-250-1Miller MaxStar 150 STLHyperTherm PowerMax 380 plasmaLincoln PowerMig 180Millermatic 252Miller Diversion 180
Reply:Originally Posted by waginnot to be mean, and my eye site is going...but I see porosity in the root, it is a nice looking root, but has porosity. This needs to be ground out before continuing with fill or cap. Good advice I think? If I'm wrong, I apologize, but if not, we should not give false praise. This person is learning, we should teach....no false praise.
Reply:it may be a little shallow in some spots but i dont see any porosity. Although i agree totally with false praise theirs too much of that, that goes on here on this forum. When i was being apprenticed the pressure welder i was working under had no problems telling me "that cap is absolute ****" he knew it was satisfactory but it pushes you to do better and adjust to make it perfect. Thats exactly how i teach my apprentice and its already showing in his skill set, going to be an amazing pipe welder one day for sure! give praise where praise is due. But telling someone somthing is "great" when you know its not is wrong and will teach them bad habits.
Reply:Thank you for all of your feedback! I am not looking for any false praise that's for sure lol! It's just that I don't know too many people in the industry, and it would be nice to get some constructive criticisms and different opinions, as I haven't found work in a shop yet either...thanks again and I will post some more pics as I go along
Reply:Guess my eyes are worse than I thought.. I would swear that those little black dots in the first pic are pin holes, the pattern even matches. I've been putting it off but maybe I will go see the eye doc.Miller TrailBlazer 251Miller HF-250-1Miller MaxStar 150 STLHyperTherm PowerMax 380 plasmaLincoln PowerMig 180Millermatic 252Miller Diversion 180
Reply:Originally Posted by waginGuess my eyes are worse than I thought.. I would swear that those little black dots in the first pic are pin holes, the pattern even matches. I've been putting it off but maybe I will go see the eye doc.
Reply:Originally Posted by waginGuess my eyes are worse than I thought.. I would swear that those little black dots in the first pic are pin holes, the pattern even matches. I've been putting it off but maybe I will go see the eye doc.
Reply:...actually it isn't porosity at all...I MAY be just a beginner, but I have been lucky enough to have not experienced any ..yet! (fingers crossed) And why would it hurt my "feelers"? You are the one looking at old women with G-strings on that go up thier butts! Yikes...How many plates have you ran? If you just started on it, it doesnt look too bad but like stated above slow down on the edges and pass over the middle faster it always helps me to kinda count in my head as i go side to side but thats probably just me lol.also whats the back of your plate look like are you getting enough penetration?
Reply:Originally Posted by sn0border88So you spray vert up with MIG?  That id like to see.Honestly, vert down MIG is very common and works great in a variety of applications.
Reply:Originally Posted by smackdaddyNo need to see the doc those black dots are porosity filled welds. And not to be a dck but the cap looks like a G string going up a old womans butt. Like said before on here the heat needs to be turned up and you need to slow it down on the edges. Your going to fast and the weld puddle cant ketch up to you when you get to the edge. Hope this helps.......to not hurt your feelers.
Reply:Originally Posted by HassNo sir, that's what cranes are for.Lay it down If it's a pipe, that's what positioners are for.and if it's horizontal, that's what pulse is for!But if there's no way around it, short circuit vert up.Which... I don't really there ever being a time when something couldn't be laid out in the flat/horiz :]Might take some extra time, but well worth it.annnnddd if it's an immobile pipe, tig/stick. (another topic!)Don't you get next to zero penetration going downhill?Since.. the puddle is kinda just falling down and not going through the plate.
Reply:Originally Posted by learning_girl...actually it isn't porosity at all...I MAY be just a beginner, but I have been lucky enough to have not experienced any ..yet! (fingers crossed) And why would it hurt my "feelers"? You are the one looking at old women with G-strings on that go up thier butts! Yikes...
Reply:Honestly, I am not sure what the black dots are...when I went back to school, I looked at the plate that I did my weld on. In my school, they tell us to use the plate as many times as we can, so after we do a weld, we have to cut it and use the plates again. I think that I had used that plate about three times already! Could it be just some junk on the metal? Who knows-the picture does look a little different from the actual plates. I am going for an interview for a shop-bitch job today! My first ever...so hopefully I will be able to get some experience eventually, as my school is almost over
Reply:Ps. keep the tips coming. I have been trying to incorporate as many as I can when practicing...thank you again!  Oh, and we started stick the other week, is it weird that I like it better than MIG?Last edited by learning_girl; 10-27-2009 at 01:41 PM.
Reply:*laffs at the shop-bitch comment*  Good luck on geting the job, learning_girl ........
Reply:Originally Posted by learning_girlPs. keep the tips coming. I have been trying to incorporate as many as I can when practicing...thank you again!  Oh, and we started stick the other week, is it weird that I like it better than MIG?
Reply:Got it!!!!!!!
Reply:I enjoy mig but growing up in a family owned earthmoving biz we ran all heavy iron and anything done in the field was always done off a Big 40 and then a Bobcat.  Stick welding just comes second nature to me, even though I'm not a full time weldor.  Somtimes I just enjoy doing it cause there are many that are lost when it comes to buring rods.  L_g, glad to see a woman in the welding trades, I have a friend that now works for John Deere and is highly regarded as one of the best, all shifts.  As one of my "teachers" always said when I was(and still am daily) learning the art of moving dirt.  "Only way you are going to learn is to put your *** in the seat and do it."  For you only way you are going to become a good weldor is to burn rods and wire and practice.  Good luck.Trbo
Reply:Amazing how many replies that a woman can get!
Reply:. o O Shaddup, we're witing for her to post up a picture of herself next ..........)
Reply:AW HELL, THEY SUCK"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:39 replies Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:You're a mean farmer Samm!
Reply:I just finished some welding classes at SAIT, and I'm running into the same problem: The Bobblehead instructor. I think they just nod and say yes and hope we go back to burning more metal and leaving them alone.I'm glad these forums are around, and if it takes a girl writing in to get some feedback that's just fine with me.
Reply:Originally Posted by NotthatlowHonestly i dont like mig at all i would rather burn a rod anyday but wait til you do tig....tig is so much nicer goes in smoother and comes out cleaner IMO.
Reply:assssssi hate the censors
Reply:Okay....Since No-one has been able to reply to Hass in a fashion he understands, I guess I will give it a go.Please pay attention:This weld is NOT to teach newcombers how to weld GMAW DOWNHILL.  It is meant to teach the up an coming welder puddle control.The weld is very, very simple:3/8" x 6" plates bevelled on one side. Arranged into a 3G groove weld, Open Root. - 60° Included angle.Ballpark of 16.5V and 175 IPM with ER70S-6 0.030" or 0.035"Root Pass is Vertical Down - The key is to stay ahead of the puddle while still ensuring proper weld re-inforcement on the backside of the coupon - no more than the thickness of a dime.  Staying ahead of the puddle is easily done by consiously running a deliberate upside down U pattern, and pulling the wire almost out of the weld.If you do not develop puddle control - the puddle will run you over, and you will not have proper fusion, or proper re-inforcement, and you will bust out on a root bend.Fill pass is done vertical up.Cap pass is done vertical up.I cannot tell much from the photos of the Root Pass - looks like Silicon Islands, but not sure.  Even re-using coupons that are flame cut, you should still have clean welds, with NO porosity.As mentioned, you are getting too much buildup across the center.  You need to hold the sides a touch longer, and keep your speed up across the center.I typed up an explanation on this weld on one of these forums... To save typing it all again, I will either link to it, or cut and paste it for you.Now again, to adress Mr Hass.... There is absolutely nothing wrong with learning this weld, nor learning puddle control.  Taken in proper context of this thread, your comments are unneccessary, and counter-productive.  I agree with some of what you have to say on the sense of "The Bigger Picture"....., but none of it is relative to this discussion.  If you are not able to get proper penetration using GMAW Short Circuit Vertical Down, then the problem lies with you, and not the process.  Kindly refrain from telling this young lady that this weld cannot (or SHOULD NOT) be done, based solely on the fact that you are not competent enough to do it properly.Last edited by Black Wolf; 11-09-2009 at 11:05 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:3G GMAW Open Root.  Pass specific information:Root Pass - Vertical Down:Upside down "U" pattern, taking care to stay ahead of the puddle, and also to ensure proper weld re-inforcemnent on the backside.  Pull wire down out of the puddle, almost to the point of losing the arc, and feeding wire into the air - Best way to learn to stay ahead of the puddle. Weld re-inforcement should be no more than the thickness of a dime.Fill Pass - Vertical Up:Slightly wider than 1st. These I do in a layed down "U" motion. Start higher out on the bevel, away from the joint... As I travel towards the Root, I am following the bevel (away from me) and into the groove, until I reach center, then follow the bevel back out of the groove (towards me) to approx the same spot on the opposite bevel. On paper, it might look more like a "V" because of the bevel, but the motion should be rounded off to a "U" for best results. I pass quickly across the center, and slow down slightly at sides to allow for fusion - I really don't "pause" on the edges per se, just decelerate before changing directions. Each time across center, I try to raise up in the joint approx 1/2 of the wire diameter.... So essentially, it looks like I am running back over my previous pass, when in fact, I am just slightly above it. Think of it as a very tight zig-zag pattern.When you get it down pat, you will end up with a second pass that is basically flat, and gives you a very nice surface to run your cap pass over.Cap Pass Vertical Up: Straight weave side to side without any in or out motion (as compared to Fill Pass) Speed is slightly increased to minimize metal deposition as almost all of this should be done by Fill Pass.  The Cap Pass is just to be a thin cover over the Fill Pass that ties in one side of the groove with the other.Now, when you are done, you should have a narrow, nicely stacked pattern that is basically flat side to side with no undercut at edges, or voids in the deposit. Also, when viewed from top or bottom, weld deposit should be flat to slightly convex... Again. weld re-inmforcement should not exceed the thickness of a dime.This is a fairly simple weld to get the hang of.  I would caution you to really concentrate on the Root Pass.  If it is junk, the rest of the coupon is junk.  If you cannot pass the Root bend, you need to take more time to get it down pat.The Fill and Cap passes will come with slight changes to your technique, but they will not cover for a poorly ran Root Pass.Last edited by Black Wolf; 11-09-2009 at 11:07 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:Great explanation of the process Black Wolf.I too have learned something today.  Thanks
Reply:that guy is right a few of those spots do resemble a little porosity. it looks to me like it could have been the lighting hitting spots of the weld where silicon deposits popped off due to the weld cooling of a chipping hammer. whoever said the speed was wrong is correct too. if i were you to make it better (while its not bad but not outstanding) would be to tighten your weave up a bit on your cover pass by not advancing in the upward position so quickley and to give it a better smoother profile pause on the edges where your weld meets your base metal and go across the center of the face faster than you currently are. i might even drop it down half a volt or so this way your puddle stiffens out for ya on your first try doing this. i can see the skill is there and u almost have it. try that out and post some pics.
Reply:Originally Posted by learning_girlPlease tell me what you think because my teacher just nods at me and says good job. First pic is my root weld for a 3G(MIG). Second pic is my finished product after 1 cap and 1fill. Thank you
Reply:Originally Posted by learning_girlPlease tell me what you think because my teacher just nods at me and says good job. First pic is my root weld for a 3G(MIG). Second pic is my finished product after 1 cap and 1fill. Thank you