20cf or 40cf cylinder?

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Hey guys.  I'm finally getting a cylinder of shielding gas for my Pro Mig 175.  I can get a 20cf filled and shipped for $100ish and a 40cf filled and shipped for$150ish.  I dont have much welding I'll be doing.  Mainly some practice to get MIG down (I've only done flux core, except on a few occasions) and then welding in some steel taillight fillers on my truck.So how long woudl a 20cf bottle last, in hours I guess.  1 or 2 hours welding time?  Or will it depend on how the flow is set?Put it this way, I'm trying to minimize my budget for this, so I'm leaning towards the 20cf, but if it wont last long then I guess I'll hit the 40cf.  I also dont want to run out right in the middle of tackign in my fillers either.Lincoln Pro-Mig 175Harbor Freight cart and accessoriesAnd learning...
Reply:Multiply your flow rate by how long you will be actually welding and that will get you the time it will last.I would like to point out that a 20cf bottle will only cost a couple dollars less than a 40cf bottle to fill.  You will save money in the long run getting the bigger bottle.
Reply:See, each time I've used a mig the flow rate was set for me.  I didnt pay attention to it.  The guy was always adamant he had enough gas, so that was where my worrying stopped.I have never had to set that on my own.  And I may be way off, but I'm assuming its set at cfh?  So if I'm flowing 20cf per hour (maybe a horrible example, I dont know, lol) then it would last an hour of welding?Please correct me if I'm wrong.  The flow and stuff is really new to me.Lincoln Pro-Mig 175Harbor Freight cart and accessoriesAnd learning...
Reply:Go to a local gas supplier. I have a 90cf. It cost 155 filled with pure argon. $40 refills it. For steel use c25, for alum use argon 100%, stainless use 98/2 argon/oxy. I havn't ever heard of delivery on such a small quanity. Thats where your paying extra money. I would go and get the largest bottle that you have storage for. The more you buy the less it costs. If you have plans for any more than one project get a big bottle. You are right with cfh. Thats actual arc time. The gas will only flow when the trigger is pulled on the gun You only need to be 2% smarter than what you are working on.Lincoln pm140hacksawa big hammer
Reply:Just get the biggest bottle you can comfortably carry. For a mig machine, an 80cf bottle will keep you busy for about 1/2 a roll of wire. It sucks to go to the gas shop every Saturday when you run out of gas in the middle of a project.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:Originally Posted by RojodiabloJust get the biggest bottle you can comfortably carry. For a mig machine, an 80cf bottle will keep you busy for about 1/2 a roll of wire. It sucks to go to the gas shop every Saturday when you run out of gas in the middle of a project.
Reply:If the question is should you get a 20 or a 40, get at least an 80. PS: no matter what size bottle you have, you will always run out of gas just as you are running that last critical bead on a nicely done piece.  That's Murphy's third law of gas.Favorite right now is a Miller Syncro 200.Tons of tools and I blame at least one of them when things don't go right.
Reply:If you are worried about weight, there is not a significant difference between a 40 and a 60 cft bottle.  I have a bad back, so I didn't want to get a big bottle.  The LWS convinced me to get a 60 instead of a 40, and I am glad they did, because even the 60 doesn't last long. I strongly recommend going and looking at thebottle size at a LWS, because 20 is positively tiny.I would strongly recommend going to the LWS instead of buying over the internet, because you might end up with a bottle that no one will refill.  What is teh proof-test date on the bottle? Do you have anybody besides airgas close by (becuase I think they will only reill airgas-branded bottles, so then you will be SWOL with an empty bottle with no means to refill it).You probaly will not save enough money by buying over the internet to be worth the trouble that this might cause for a gas bottle.For comparison, I bought a 60 cf bottle at Airgas (filled) for $157, so I don't think that internet price is that good a deal.Tim
Reply:Get an 80CF tank definitely! I asked the guys that gave me mine and he said it should last 3 hours for mig welding. I set my flow rate at 10psi. Welds are fine at that flow rate (75/25 mix). It's not heavy either!
Reply:the last small bottle i bought was a 160cf got it at linweld it cost 160 filed for 75/25
Reply:I sold welding supplies for 40 years and I am amazed at the prices that people pay for gas and cylinders go to all of the suppliers and shop for cylinders and gas I have seen argon sold for 14.00 a cyl and 85.00 a cyl for 330 cu ft of gas if they want a sale you can get a good price it does not matter whos gas it is alot of the time its all the same manufacturer 150.00 should get an 80 cuft cyl
Reply:SHOP AROUND!!!! I called most of the LWS in my area and I got all sorts of different prices on cyl., and gases. 75/25 was about twice as much from two different LWS.
Reply:80cf tank... it should only run you $120 - $150, shop around.
Reply:Well I know you guys said shop around, but I've been working some long weeks and just havent had the time to do that.  Seems work at work comes up when I've got little projects for the truck planned.  ALways happens like that.  Hell, I've had the welder for months and havent had time to look.  And believe me I'd tried to 'make time'.  However, part of it has been money.But I'm not gonna use that as an excuse for spending more on an internet bottle.  It seems easier right now, and I need it right now, rather than waiting for an opportunity to look around when I possibly dont have the money.  I went 40cf, btw.  I dont weld everyday and I dont plan to.  I just need it to get these little shaving projects done and bodyworked so I can paint them.  ANd I greatly appreciate you guys input.  The site is  a huge help.  I know this probably wont be the last cylinder I'll buy, so I'll keep all those points in mind if I ever get a second, larger cylinder.Lincoln Pro-Mig 175Harbor Freight cart and accessoriesAnd learning...
Reply:Originally Posted by trwatksI sold welding supplies for 40 years and I am amazed at the prices that people pay for gas and cylinders go to all of the suppliers and shop for cylinders and gas I have seen argon sold for 14.00 a cyl and 85.00 a cyl for 330 cu ft of gas if they want a sale you can get a good price it does not matter whos gas it is alot of the time its all the same manufacturer 150.00 should get an 80 cuft cyl
Reply:it costs me 75 for a refill of argon for a 330 cf ..so ya 75 for a 150 seems high
Reply:Originally Posted by JD270it costs me 75 for a refill of argon for a 330 cf ..so ya 75 for a 150 seems high
Reply:I know they are pricey, but I think I will try to get two bottles, even if they are both 40s, as all the welding and gas suppliers around here are closed Sat and Sun. Bring it, Murphy, I got a spare! Happy Welding,Kirk
Reply:I prefer 125 cylinders over 80's.  They're the same diameter and about a foot taller so they fit on the same cart.   They're not all that much heavier to carry, but hold about 50% more gas (80 x 1.5 = 120) and don't cost but a couple bucks more to fill.  Therefore, 125 is much more cost effective than 80.As for how long the gas will last, at a regulator setting of 20cfh, a 20 cf bottle will last one hour of arc time.  A 40cf will last 2 hours, an 80 last 4 hours and a 125 last 6 hours.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:Originally Posted by DesertRider33As for how long the gas will last, at a regulator setting of 20cfh, a 20 cf bottle will last one hour of arc time.  A 40cf will last 2 hours, an 80 last 4 hours and a 125 last 6 hours.
Reply:This doesnt answer the 20/40cf cylinder question but goes towards co$t effectiveness,Look into Co2 tanks, good shielding gas leaving nice welds and cheaper! SQUARE WAVE 175 TIG   DUAL MIG 151
Reply:How long will a 40 last, at 15cfh, 2.6 hours at 20cfh 2 hours.Indoors, of course, you should be safe with 15cfh.Then adjust for changing conditions.
Reply:Hah, I recommend at least scanning over the post dates and content of every thread you visit.  This guy bought his tank long, long ago.  I am sure that everyone understands that in most circumstances, buying in bulk will give you a savings per unit of whatever you are buying.Miller 330 a/bp water cooledI believe in gun control, I hold my gun with two hands.  If you want to know why, click here.Buy American or bye America.
Reply:The answers of "arc time" quoted in this thread are optimistic.  Here is why: in between arc strikes, there will be some additional gas used up.  IE: some get gets "stored" under 30-50psi or so in the gas line connecting the regulator/flow meter to the solenoid, and when the solenoid is opened in anticipation of the next arc initiation cycle, the stored, pressurized gas suddenly gets released... "whoosh!"  This might be only one second worth of gas, or it might be several seconds, depending on the equipment being used.  In addition, gas will be used without arc being struck during pre and post flows stages.  (Time when gas is flowing before and after the arc is lit.)  Between all those factors, one might find their gas bottle is running down much more quickly than anticipated!