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I'm designing a handstand table for a hand balancing performer. He wants the table to be light weigh and portable. I'm trying to choose the best aluminum alloy for this table. My needs for the alloy weldability, strength, and good for threads.I've attached images of a table that is similar to what I want. I'm not trying to steal or copy their design, it's just close to what I want. I've been looking into different aluminum alloys and have been suggested to use 5052, but after my own research I've been leaning towards 6082. I'm new to aluminum and my first question is what do you think is the best alloy for a table that is going to have to hold a person performing acrobatics on it. Also I want the legs to be detachable for transport. So what alloy aluminum would be best out of the 5052 or 6082 to hold threads? Or is there a better alloy or better way to attach the legs (see picture).Thanks for any help.
Reply:Originally Posted by circus_artsI'm designing a handstand table for a hand balancing performer. He wants the table to be light weigh and portable. I'm trying to choose the best aluminum alloy for this table. My needs for the alloy weldability, strength, and good for threads.I've attached images of a table that is similar to what I want. I'm not trying to steal or copy their design, it's just close to what I want. I've been looking into different aluminum alloys and have been suggested to use 5052, but after my own research I've been leaning towards 6082. I'm new to aluminum and my first question is what do you think is the best alloy for a table that is going to have to hold a person performing acrobatics on it. Also I want the legs to be detachable for transport. So what alloy aluminum would be best out of the 5052 or 6082 to hold threads? Or is there a better alloy or better way to attach the legs (see picture).Thanks for any help.
Reply:Your already not the right guy for the job if your new to aluminum. Buy the one in your pictures. Imagine "look Mom One Handed Handstand" and then it breaks and he's drinking out of a straw for the rest of his life, thanks to you. Get it! no hard feelings, well maybe one or two, but it's the truth!I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:I'm designing it not welding or fabricating it.
Reply:Thanks, I did notice that and reposted it.
Reply:Originally Posted by circus_artsI'm designing it not welding or fabricating it.
Reply:Isn't the point of these forums to learn.
Reply:Mike must be off his meds......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeYour already not the right guy for the job if your new to aluminum. Buy the one in your pictures. Imagine "look Mom One Handed Handstand" and then it breaks and he's drinking out of a straw for the rest of his life, thanks to you. Get it! no hard feelings, well maybe one or two, but it's the truth!
Reply:Yes that is the purpose of this forum, there's a lot of very skilled Welders and fabricators that I'm sure will chime in. As for me and my aluminum experience all I have worked with was 6061. So I can't really help yoh
Reply:I also appreciate the need to make someone aware of a correction needed or to tell them what they are trying to do is dangerous. But it would be nice if they first read the post completely and with some level of comprehension. The first thing I said was I'm designing it. Therefore I need to call out to the fabricator what alloy of aluminum I want them to use. I'm sure I can ask the welder I'm working with what he recommends, but I like to learn and would like to know the reason behind what material to choose.
Reply:One concern is availability. While a grade may look great on paper, you may not be able to source small quantities. For instance, you'll be hard pressed to find 6082, but 6061 is everywhere.Disclaimer - I'm not necessarily suggesting that 6061 is the correct choice.
Reply:I was going to include that in my question. That was a concern of mine and I did notice that 6061 is very common. I was told somewhere else that 6061 is a viable option for this project, but that 6061 will need to be head treated after welding.
Reply:You might get some help here. http://www.eng-tips.com/Dont pay any attention to meIm just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Thanks. I will take a look at that.
Reply:An aluminum fabrication may not be the best idea for this anyway. I don't like the idea of any live load on that table without center support or some truss arraignment. Too many parties with broken tables in my past I guess...There's a good chance Ed Conley, (username Broccoli1 here) would know, or maybe know a stagecraft type with better info. Give the thread some time or you could PM him.Good luck,Matt
Reply:I did find this information on 6061 on wikipedia Welding6061 is highly weldable, for example using tungsten inert gas welding (TIG) or metal inert gas welding (MIG). Typically, after welding, the properties near the weld are those of 6061-O, a loss of strength of around 80%. The material can be re-heat-treated to restore -T4 or -T6 temper for the whole piece. After welding, the material can naturally age and restore some of its strength as well. Nevertheless, the Alcoa Structural Handbook recommends the design strength of the material adjacent to the weld to be taken as 11,000 psi without proper heat treatment after the weld.[citation needed] Typical filler material is 4043 or 5356.Is heat treating something that most shops do? An 80% loss of strength is a lot.
Reply:Originally Posted by circus_artsI also appreciate the need to make someone aware of a correction needed or to tell them what they are trying to do is dangerous. But it would be nice if they first read the post completely and with some level of comprehension. The first thing I said was I'm designing it. Therefore I need to call out to the fabricator what alloy of aluminum I want them to use. I'm sure I can ask the welder I'm working with what he recommends, but I like to learn and would like to know the reason behind what material to choose.
Reply:Thank you for the information. I will defiantly give him a try.
Reply:I have talked to the person who made the table in the picture and he said it was made of 2024 aluminum. English was his second language, so not sure if something got lost in translation, because everyone I talked to said 2024 is un-weldable.
Reply:Originally Posted by Matt_MaguireAn aluminum fabrication may not be the best idea for this anyway. I don't like the idea of any live load on that table without center support or some truss arraignment. Too many parties with broken tables in my past I guess...Good luck,Matt
Reply:Here is an image of the current table he is using. This table has a solid 3/8" aluminum plate in the shape of a pentagon. Around that it has a frame of 5" x 1" rectangular tube. Not sure of the wall thickness. It then has 5 legs that are aluminum tube with a steel threaded sleeve in the aluminum tubes that adjustable feet screw into. With that there are support pieces of sheet on the legs. Then in the plate on top there are three steel inserts that bolt in and the sticks fit into that. Here is another better picture Just so you can see what the table is used for and what were working with now. Not sure of what alloy any of this table is.
Reply:I did notice on that particular table after you unfold it, 2 bolts go through the 2 center pieces to help support that center seam. Not sure if that adequate, but thought I'd mention it.You can see here
Reply:Hang in there, circus arts.......endure the insults and resist the impulse to spit back.There are many here and those yet to come who will read this tread eventually for the info it offers.
Reply:6061 will work fine, 700X would be better, although I would probably go for a thin wall 4130 Chromoly frame myself.Done right, it wouldn't be much heavier than aluminum, & would be a lot more durable.Buy American, or don't whine when you end up on the bread line.Originally Posted by circus_artsI'm designing a handstand table for a hand balancing performer. He wants the table to be light weigh and portable. I'm trying to choose the best aluminum alloy for this table. My needs for the alloy weldability, strength, and good for threads.I've been looking into different aluminum alloys and have been suggested to use 5052, but after my own research I've been leaning towards 6082. I'm new to aluminum and my first question is what do you think is the best alloy for a table that is going to have to hold a person performing acrobatics on it. Also I want the legs to be detachable for transport. So what alloy aluminum would be best out of the 5052 or 6082 to hold threads? Or is there a better alloy or better way to attach the legs (see picture).Thanks for any help.
Reply:As mentioned 6061 will work- just need a solid design.These simple work platforms are a good example of KISS http://www.homedepot.ca/product/20-work-platform/967863Ed Conleyhttp://www.screamingbroccoli.com/MM252MM211 (Sold)Passport Plus & Spool gunLincoln SP135 Plus- (Gone to a good home)Klutch 120v Plasma cutterSO 2020 benderBeer in the fridge
Reply:Originally Posted by Broccoli1As mentioned 6061 will work- just need a solid design.These simple work platforms are a good example of KISS http://www.homedepot.ca/product/20-work-platform/967863
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveSounds like you've asked almost every question that the designer would be answering.Since you are new to aluminum, how would you design it in steel? Size, type, thickness, attachment, etc.Then your question would be "what aluminum matches the performance of the steel table I've drawn?"
Reply:Originally Posted by circus_artsI'm in one of those situation where the more information I gather, the more I realize how little I know about aluminum. Thus making it harder to choose the correct material for the table.
Reply:Originally Posted by circus_artsVery good point. I'm in one of those situation where the more information I gather, the more I realize how little I know about aluminum. Thus making it harder to choose the correct material for the table.
Reply:Looking at what he is using now I see a couple of things. The upside is whatever complex vector he could couple down thru those poles will never kick that base in any direction (kicking things out from under him). It's also going to be near as stiff as sticking a pole in a concrete foundation...The downside is it's heavy! The 3/8" ally top is about 5 1/4 to 5 1/2lb per square foot. The 1 x 5" box doesn't need a lot of section to be very stiff so not much weight there. The legs and stiffeners maybe 30 to 40 lbs without the feet. All totaled one fella isn't going to like moving it around much. A lift truck would be nice, in fact I wouldn't prolly worry about setting a small one on top of that table...There is no way, "even with a removable center support" that a folding arrangement that's easy to carry would be as stable when loads try to slide things sideways out from under you.You could build a good roller dolly, or go to a thinner top with box section underneath (could drop maybe 40+lbs using 3/16" plate).If he is determined to have a folding table be prepared for a lot of tweaking, maybe over an extended period of time.Good luckMatt |
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发表于 2021-8-31 23:23:58