lets talk about youth and employment

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Okay guys and gals if theirs any on this fourm im a younger man in a local welding program and have noticed that a lot of young welders fresh out of welding programs have extreme difficult times finding jobs so how hard is it for a motivated young welder fresh out of school to find a welding job or a welders helpers job that can lead into a welding job? i hear a lot of older welders complain about young welders and to hear everyone talk young welders have an extremely small chance of finding a job another thing i hear most jobs wanting 3 to 5 years experience will companies overlook the experience factor when dealing with young welders? any comments welcome good or badLincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:I see the same thing, every job wants 3 to 5 years experience and not that great of pay... Im finishing up my last semester so I am hoping companies will overlook my lack of experience. I will let you know if a few months- Christian M.C3 Welding & Fabrication - CNC Plasma Cutting-Mobile Welding-Custom welding and fabwww.c3welding.com
Reply:Well, not to turn this into a political hijack, but it is regarding "employment" and can give you an idea of where both young and old (tenured) workers stand in this country.  As of today, obamacare kicked in officially.  With that and over the next three years, looks for less and less available work (increased job competition) and tenured full time employees getting cut to 29hrs or less per week.  I'm afraid for our "under 40" crowd, still looking for a career with full time weekly hours and benefits.  Thanks to obamacare, kiss a lot of "career- opportunity" good bye.Lincoln Power Mig 216Lincoln AC/DC-225/125Miller  625 X-Treme PlasmaMiller 211 Forney 95FI-A 301HF 91110Victor Journeyman O/PMilwaukee DaytonMakita  Baileigh NRA Life Member
Reply:I am afraid you are correct, obama is a total nut case, work is going to come back big time as soon as we can get rid of jugeared fool, energy and we got it we bring us back
Reply:i have no political knowledge or preference so i wont talk politics but im taking it with the health care law my job chances are shrinking? also im figuring companies want welders with certs, blueprint reading experince and fab skills so should i focus on those mainly?Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:hey flux core joe, what is your location?I'm also interested in this topic because I am in my first semester of a welding course. I will get my 3G and 4G certs. It does seem like a lot of people have difficulty finding work (not to mention work that pays well!!), which is confusing because I am constantly hearing about or reading about the shortage of welders and the large numbers that are retiring or will be retiring soon.
Reply:I have little experience in welding but with 30-years in the single most "old-boy" fraternity in the US, I can chime in. I started out as a grip; IATSE Local 80. That's the equivalent of a welder's helper or whatever they're called suffice to say we were the base construction grunts that traveled set-to-set to build or move whatever the older guys didn't want to. Working 6am - 2:30pm, I spent every other hour hanging out doing all the jobs the older guys didn't want to do in every other production departmnent I could find. They weren't happy to have a young kid around that might be after their job and yes, times were different in those 1970-days but they sure let a lowly grip hang around, especially when I was getting coffee, taking out the trash, running errands from one end of the lot to the other and doing every other lowly errand there was to do. Some saw the dedication and finally started teaching me. Others didn't but I was there so much, I just soaked it in. Bottom line is do the work no one else will do, be dedicated to your craft and beg, borrow, con, steal or finesse your experience through tenacity but in the end, there's no better adage out there than the one the entertainment industry lives by; "It ain't braggin' if you can do it." I might be either completely wrong or wholly off when it comes to applying what worked for me in the entertainment industry to welding and if I am, there are so many other people here who can comment on what I'm saying but as someone who's retiring at 50 from a career I loved like you have to love welding if you're going to succeed, I can tell you perserverence through the love of what you do will always pay dividends. I never asked, "How much does it pay?" or "How long will it take me to make 'x' amount of dollars a year?" I always found a way to learn and you can too, especially with the help you'll get here. Experience comes in many forms and, when you're young, your best tool to acquisition of that experience is selflessness, willingness and ingenuity. Just the humble but learned experience from one of those "old guys" who hopes something I say helps. Good luck.
Reply:If you really want a job, tell them you'll work for a week to prove your worth, without pay. BUT if they keep you, you get paid for that week. I got 2 different jobs that way.
Reply:I would concentrate more on pipe welding, then learn how to lie on an application till you can get a foot in the door somewhere.
Reply:Originally Posted by gimpyrobbIf you really want a job, tell them you'll work for a week to prove your worth, without pay. BUT if they keep you, you get paid for that week. I got 2 different jobs that way.
Reply:What difference does it make if they're not gonna hire you cause you got no experience? You wanna be a Boy Scout or you wanna make some money?
Reply:In the current economy, there are often experienced people readily available.  So when a company wants to hire someone, it's an easy choice for them.It helps a lot if your school has a program working with local industry to find jobs for graduates.  Some companies work with local schools to make sure that they train people to meet their needs.  Of course, just like real estate: location, location, location!   Some places have a shortage of welders, other locations have a surplus.
Reply:I don't want to get in an argument, but here is some more advice from an old guy that never had a day without a job.I know you want to weld, not write essays, but read your posts. Four long lines with no capitalization or punctuation except 2 question marks. It is hard to figure out what you are trying to say. If you applied for a job working for me, I wouldn't hire you because you don't have or don't use basic writing skills. That indicates you probably do not have adequate math skills either. How you present yourself and your first impression on the guy hiring you usually determines whether you get the job or not. Think about it. I hire people based on if they are going to cause problems with everyone else or not.And if you lie on an application, you would never get a job with me. Even if you get the job and it is discovered you lied on the application years later, you are subject to termination.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:My son got his first welding job because of a job fair/expo type deal they had at the community college.  He wasn't even finished with TIG class, let alone the associate degree.  Showed the shop manager some of his practice tickets and they said "I got to get me some of this".    Mind you, this was Alstom, a huge company and they were interested in apprentice type programs and community relations. No reason you can't inquire about jobs or apprenticeships long before you graduate."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:The problem in the country isnt the affordable healthcare act..  Most companies that hire, dont want to invest time in training a new employee, they want boots on the ground that can produce and make them money, they dont want to spend 2 or 3 yrs training someone.. I talked some sense into my nephew, he wanted to be a welder..  I told him to learn to weld, but use it as a secondary skill, he went to work part time for a small heating and a/c company and started on his state hvac certification and just went to work full time for a nice sized plastics company that has good benefits and pays for his continued education..Last edited by brucer; 10-02-2013 at 10:18 AM.tackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:Flux Core Joe,How do you become a "good old boy"?  Be a good young boy.  If you start contacting people early, but not annoying them, maybe they will remember you in the near future.  I got my first (summer) job at 16 years of age.  I always seemed to get respect because I was responsible and serious. Or if not serious, at least enthusiastic and willing. And reliable."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Flux Core Joe,About 25 yrs. ago my nephew attended a vocational school in the Naples area.   <(that's a period son , it goes at the end of a sentence.)  If I recall correctly after graduation they were able/invited/accepted to the shipyard in Bath.  I don't know if the program is still available but it's worth looking into.  Yea, I know it's one hellva commute from your place to Naples but there may be others closer to you.Good luck
Reply:I think the problem with young welders is that they focus so hard on getting their certs and when they're done with class that's all they can weld. I got back in school after I was already employed as a welder and was amazed at how many of the people in the advanced classes simply just couldn't weld. I could quit my job today and have another tomorrow making more money, Guaranteed.  I love what I do and where I'm at which is worth way more that a few bucks an hour at a job I could possibly hate. Companies want employees who know how to read a print and make a part with little to no clean up and in tolerance every time. The companies who hire entry level welders generally are not as successful as companies who employ experienced welders. I've seen 3-4k parts full of porosity welded by 10/hr welders that actually made it past final inspection and went out to customers and I'd be willing to bet they'd never use that company again.Millermatic 210 & 300Miller 330 a/bp w/Miller coolmate 3Lincoln 225 ac/dc buzz box200amp Hobart 16hp portable welderCarbon arc torch, oxy/acy, plasma cutterCNC plasma table
Reply:My kid was doing reconditioning of gas generator turbine blades.  Build up the worn tip areas.  Strict inter pass temperatures, full purge box, Inconel and Hastelloy.  Not bad for a first job.  Those things are worth a few thousand $ each in some sizes. He mostly got crap from the grinder guys who were too lazy to grind much off.  They wanted the buildups to be perfect so they didn't have to take much off."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Originally Posted by wb4rtI don't want to get in an argument, but here is some more advice from an old guy that never had a day without a job.I know you want to weld, not write essays, but read your posts. Four long lines with no capitalization or punctuation except 2 question marks. It is hard to figure out what you are trying to say. If you applied for a job working for me, I wouldn't hire you because you don't have or don't use basic writing skills. That indicates you probably do not have adequate math skills either. How you present yourself and your first impression on the guy hiring you usually determines whether you get the job or not. Think about it. I hire people based on if they are going to cause problems with everyone else or not.And if you lie on an application, you would never get a job with me. Even if you get the job and it is discovered you lied on the application years later, you are subject to termination.
Reply:Originally Posted by TimmyTIGI would concentrate more on pipe welding, then learn how to lie on an application till you can get a foot in the door somewhere.
Reply:Originally Posted by flux core joeOkay guys and gals if theirs any on this fourm im a younger man in a local welding program and have noticed that a lot of young welders fresh out of welding programs have extreme difficult times finding jobs so how hard is it for a motivated young welder fresh out of school to find a welding job or a welders helpers job that can lead into a welding job? i hear a lot of older welders complain about young welders and to hear everyone talk young welders have an extremely small chance of finding a job another thing i hear most jobs wanting 3 to 5 years experience will companies overlook the experience factor when dealing with young welders? any comments welcome good or bad
Reply:Originally Posted by akpolarisMost applications have a statement at the bottom letting you know that if you misrepresent (lie) anything you are subject to termination.  Honesty is a must. Dishonesty is a slippery slope! Most companies want a proven experienced hand that has demonstrated their craft and can make the firm some $$$  The problem you have is an age old problem of a young worker wanting to "break in".  If you can make personal contact with the job foreman or owner instead of just a piece of paper you are much better off.  Don't answer you cell phone while talking to them, Look clean and neat, be polite. Yes sir / no sir does not hurt.  Expect to do the grunt work. Be on time or early and stay as late as necessary. Do not have the cell phone in your pocket turned on until break time!.  That is 1 of the biggest detractors of the new worker. 1 hand on phone at all times, bad stuff. Have patience, finding a good job is not easy. But take what you can and if something better turns up give fair notice to your present boss.  As you work you are building your reputation. Make it a reputation that when your name is brought up in reference checks the respondent has good things to say about you.
Reply:I LOVE that analogy!!! Vacuum gauges, a magnetic compass you had to check with a calendar and a St. Jude medal hanging from the visor. RDF, eye-ballin' and scud-runnin! Those were the days. When I was flyin' it was just my REO named "SLAG" (Screams Like A Girl) and me (Flipper cause I couldn't hold the ball) but Rojo's right; every pilot I'll fly with started on vacuum and juice. Not much different in anything!
Reply:Hey Flux Core Joe.Your reply in post #20 impresses more than anything else you wrote. If you can take criticism/critique, adjust, and move on, that is a great step forward. I actually expected a long flame (without punctuation) about how you are a welder, not an English teacher. These guys are giving you some invaluable advice. Your welding skills are important, but I would expect everybody that applies for the job can weld. You have to distinguish yourself from them with your attitude, appearance, self-discipline, no drama, attendance, AND do not lie on the application!I have a young guy working for me (not welding). He's had the job since he was still in high school 2 1/2 years ago. He started at minimum wage, now is making about twice that, and he is prepared to make much more money in the future. I still give him the grunt jobs because he is the newest guy, but then I help him to show we all have to do whatever is necessary. New guys have to "pay their dues" if you will. Meanwhile, I am watching his reaction and attitude with the grunt jobs to see if he is ready for more responsibility.Best of luck Flux Core Joe! With a good attitude, I'm confident you will find a job (hopefully a good one, but you can learn a lot from a bad job, too), work hard and look for things that need to be done, and your boss will notice.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.comOriginally Posted by jlamesI have little experience in welding but with 30-years in the single most "old-boy" fraternity in the US, I can chime in. I started out as a grip; IATSE Local 80. That's the equivalent of a welder's helper or whatever they're called suffice to say we were the base construction grunts that traveled set-to-set to build or move whatever the older guys didn't want to. Working 6am - 2:30pm, I spent every other hour hanging out doing all the jobs the older guys didn't want to do in every other production departmnent I could find. They weren't happy to have a young kid around that might be after their job and yes, times were different in those 1970-days but they sure let a lowly grip hang around, especially when I was getting coffee, taking out the trash, running errands from one end of the lot to the other and doing every other lowly errand there was to do. ...
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI see a lot of "kids" today that don't want to do this. They feel it's beneath them to do "menial" labor. I partially blame the school system that has brain washed them into thinking this way. It used to be that almost everyone started at the bottom and worked their way up. Sadly today most kids expect to walk out of school and start their 1st job at least 1/2 way up the ladder making mid to high 5 figure  salaries.  Schools have conditioned them to expect this from day 1.I have to agree this economy sucks and it won't get better until the government buts out of business.
Reply:Originally Posted by gimpyrobbIf you really want a job, tell them you'll work for a week to prove your worth, without pay. BUT if they keep you, you get paid for that week. I got 2 different jobs that way.
Reply:Originally Posted by ShortbusWelderDSW, how many your students are going on the pipeline when they are done with your course? At least half of mine thought they were,until I enlightened them on the important details they didn't know.  I tell my students it took me years to get where am at, and it wasn't easy. Now the kids want instant gratification,  and they think they deserve, which is the sad part.   .
Reply:To the OP's starter. I would suggest you read as may posts here as you can. Take a look at how many of the members here are far more than welders. They have a mastery of mechanics,engineering,design,layout,carpentry,elec  tronics and so on. It's not only their welding skill that is being sought after and paid for, it's their ability to think on their feet,identify problem and come up with viable alternatives. If they don't know something I'll bet they have connections that do or know were to go for the answer. They have EXPERIENCES that help them identify trouble before it happens. It's these traits as well as their welding skill, that make them an asset to a company or successfully self employed. Not to say your not capable, I'll venture you are. But do you believe you could stand up against the journeymen you see here? Obviously not. It takes time and exposure to may different disciplines to become as well rounded. That's not to say you can't get there too,maybe even in record time. But unless your some kind of prodigy it's going to take time before your as much of an asset to a company as these members are. "Pay is commensurate with skill,experience and indispensability". I'm like "grimmpyrobb", I worked for minimum wage for two months to get my foot in the door! I made a deal with the owners that if they kept me I would be paid the difference of the going rate and the minimum rate I was paid. It took  18 months to become foreman of that shop. I took on every responsibility I could. In short I made myself indispensable.  Sure there are things that you won't be paid for but that's the cost of constantly proving yourself to a company to advance. Good reputations are BUILT, bad reputations are given freely.Stay strong ,be an asset,learn and you'll be successful!Best of luck! Gizzmo
Reply:There are just too darned many smart people here. Listen to what Gizzmo says. No more true words were spoken in a way that, if you don't get it, your trouble goes way deeper than youth and inexperience. ;-)
Reply:[See my last sentence for cliffnotes if this is too long]As another young welder finishing school next spring, this topic is always on my mind.  We always hear about the shortage of welders ect. ect.. But as stated, people want the welders with experience.  So although there may be plenty of jobs out there.  There is not plenty of jobs for young welders(except the crappy ones{I'll address that later}).  Everyone is in a tough situation.  Employers cant afford/aren't willing to spend money on training which means the young welders cant get the experience needed to get a job.  There is going to be an over saturated market of under qualified welders who have no way of "breaking in".People say, "Take a not so good job so you can get experience.  You cant expect to get a good paying job right away."  Which is true, but flawed.  Because to get that good paying job employers want experience in that area.  Take pipe for example: Without 3-5 years experience you  might as well not even apply to pipe jobs.  But they are looking for 3-5 years pipe experience.  Not 3-5 years welding experience.  Which means that 3-5 you just spent at the crap job to gain experience gained you nothing, and more than likely barely paid the bills.Currently I am a concrete laborer.  I like to think that as a trainable young welder, who is used to long hours and hard work in the construction field, who wants to work as many hours as possible, and is willing to go anywhere in the USA, I would be the ideal candidate for a fresh employee.  But even still, our(the young generation) is solely relying on the older generation to open up and invest.  Be willing to take the time and train, and train well, so that the welding trade can keep going in the next generation.  If the current welders and welder employers refuse to take nothing but experience, they will eventually run out of candidates.  They will be left with plenty of welders who don't know a thing about the trade, because no one took the time to teach them.  Be it greed and selfishness or unable to afford to train, if infield training does not happen the quality and craftsmanship of the welding field is going to deteriorate immensely once the current group retires.I realize this ties in with the general growing gap between good/crap jobs and the elimination of the middle class(wont get into that), and I realize this post is drawn out and probably too long.  But I guess the point I'm trying to make is: for all the hype of "needing welders" and the "future shortage", it still does not increase a young welders chance for a job
Reply:I have had very good luck trying to connect with an employer, leave an impression and keep my face around often enough for them to remember me. This is especially true if there are any jobs or shops near you that you are especially interested in working at. When I just got out of school I wanted to ride dirtbikes and work on them. I started hanging out at the dirtbike shop next to my house whenever I wasn't doing anything better. I would hang out and talk to the girl at the front desk and chat with the mechanics and owner when they didn't look busy. This takes some level of being able to read people. If it's the wrong day, if they are busy or just don't want to deal with you this will put them off real fast. If on the other hand they are in a good mood and good people you can usually start a conversation. From there it's all about shared interests and if you are a welder looking for a job at a weld shop you better be able to find some shared interests. In the conversation learn as much as you can about what they do and how they do it. If you can practice on those areas when you have time so those skills are honed when you get the opportunity to prove yourself you have that little extra edge. Later in life this same technique worked for me when I wanted to get into composites. I was in Eugen OR with a lousy economy, no jobs and one boat shop that I really wanted to work at. I probably went in a couple times a week. If they weren't busy I got tours of the shop, talked to the owner and workers and even got some free supplies that I was able to take home to play around with a little on my own. I had read a ton of books, watched a bunch of composites videos and learned as much as I could on my own. When I talked to them I was able to talk about composites with some knowledge and ask valid questions that showed I had a good fundamental understanding of the process.  When they got busy I was the one they called.Lincoln precision TIG 275Millermatic 140 MIG
Reply:Some people just don't get it.Now I know your going to take this the wrong way but here is what an employer would here if he read your post: Originally Posted by Cheesehead[See my last sentence for cliffnotes if this is too long]As another young welder finishing school next spring, this topic is always on my mind.  We always hear about the shortage of welders ect. ect.. But as stated, people want the welders with experience.  So although there may be plenty of jobs out there.  There is not plenty of jobs for young welders(except the crappy ones{I'll address that later}).  Everyone is in a tough situation.  Employers cant afford/aren't willing to spend money on training which means the young welders cant get the experience needed to get a job.  There is going to be an over saturated market of under qualified welders who have no way of "breaking in".
Reply:Originally Posted by CheeseheadPeople say, "Take a not so good job so you can get experience.  You cant expect to get a good paying job right away."  Which is true, but flawed.  Because to get that good paying job employers want experience in that area.  Take pipe for example: Without 3-5 years experience you  might as well not even apply to pipe jobs.  But they are looking for 3-5 years pipe experience.  Not 3-5 years welding experience.  Which means that 3-5 you just spent at the crap job to gain experience gained you nothing, and more than likely barely paid the bills.
Reply:I greatly appreciate the advice and I will be honest my plan was to be a helper then move up to welders position and then start the business so this is one kid who would actually like to be a helper!Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:Depending on where you live, I would recommend applying for an apprenticeship with the pipe fitters, boiler makers or iron workers union.  That is typically going to get you the highest wages short of underwater welding.  I got out of school in 99 so take my advice with a grain of salt.  When I graduated, I was a mig monkey working late shifts.  One thing I found out real quick is nobody I worked with gave a s**t that I went to school.  I have been a union chemical operator for 10 years but I can tell you for a fact that the fitters, boilermakers and iron workers in the plant all make more per hour than I do.  If you can't get a apprenticeship, I would focus on tig because you can find a higher paying job.  Just my .02.
Reply:I think anyone on this board can relate to what joe and cheesehead are saying.  It doesn't seem like either one of then are expecting to get out of school and land a job right off the bat making top wages.  From what I read, they both seem to have a pretty good perspective off the job market today.  You do often hear about all of the baby boomers who are supposed to be retiring and how there will be a shortage of "insert occupation here".  In my experience, it's not what you know, it's who you know.  When we hire operators here at the plant, we have 500+ applicants for 6-8 jobs each time.  9 times out of 10 the person who gets hired is a friend or relative of someone that already works here.  Fair?  Debatable.  But I guess the theory is that nobody is going to recommend a poor worker or problem worker as that would reflect poorly on them.
Reply:Gizzmo,  No offense taken by the way you perceived my comments. IMO Its good to hear feedback on how comments come across so you can write differently if needed.  What I was saying wasnt meant to be a complaint.  Im fully aware that you need to bust butt and work extra for no extra pay.  What I was trying to convey was the idea that the "welder shortage" bit is probably what is used the most to get younger people into welding.  Its what you will hear in every high school and every tech school. What they dont tell you is the things you will have to do to get there.  Again, Im not wishing there were cush jobs for every person who wants to be a welder.  Just pointing out that the "welder shortage" is only part of the story.  To be honest, Im glad the good jobs require the hard road, because I know I can do that, and I  know that puts me ahead of the people who just want a 9-5.  And my last sentence/main point of that still holds true IMO.  Agree or disagree?
Reply:Great posts guys.... keep em coming. The amount of information on these forums is mind boggling!! To think most, if not all of it is free...
Reply:I'm going to base my post on actually being a recently graduated student, who is employed by a power plant as a pipe welder. It may be beneficial. Maybe not. I'm not good at advice. Or stories. This is going to be long, so check the last end for my point if you don't want a story.When I decided to go to welding school, it wasn't because I needed or wanted a high paying job. I had a decent job at a hotel, doing easy work, and probably would have stayed there forever. I was a recent army vet. I worked on helicopters as a structural mechanic for 3 years, had been deployed twice, and was pretty much on the top of my game at the time. When I got out I was offered a similar job as a civilian contractor working for my unit. I declined it because, frankly, that job SUCKED. 18 hour days, half of the time sitting on my behind, the other half working that soft behind to death. I said thanks but no thanks and ended up a maintenance guy for a hotel. I was told about the welding school and thought, shoot, that would be fun. So I enrolled. Quit my job, moved, and went to school.Now welding is nothing like working on choppers in a maintenance depot. We used aluminum for the most part, and riveted everything together. The only similarities I can think of was working with metal.. and working in tight tolerances (up to 1/64" in the army, to 1/8" welding... easy. For me). The first few months I had trouble. Finally had that lightbulb moment and my skills took off. I excelled the most at tig welding and stick on pipe. Structural welding never really came to me. But I digress. This is just a preface.The last week of school I went to my last few instructors and asked to use them as references. I worked my behind off during the pipe phases and earned top honors in every pipe course of the program. I mean I came to school for my class, stayed through the next class, and even some of the third class. 12-15 hour days was the norm for me, and the instructors saw that. They knew me so they agreed to put their name behind me. I got my three favorite guys as references (tig, stainless tig, and advanced pipe instructors). This is partly what got me my first job. My work ethic, and the fact that it was backed up by the guys who taught me. Guys who (luckily) had a decent name in the welding field and especially at the places I applied to. With that said, I applied to the three companies those instructors had worked for before coming to the school, knowing that if I used them as a reference, I would get my resume LOOKED AT. Not picked, but at least seen by some human being. I was politely turned down for all three jobs because I had ZERO welding experience. Even with my prior service as a chopper mechanic. After all, I wasn't applying to be a fabricator. I was applying for a PIPE WELDER job. I then applied to other national/international companies. Zachry, BAE, Newport News Shipyard, Trinity Industries, Performance Contractors, etc. for pipe welding jobs. I was also politely turned down for every job due to lack of experience. I switched my tactic thinking, shoot, if I can weld pipe I can sure as heck weld structural. So I started applying for those jobs. Was also turned down. Started to think, how the heck am I supposed to get that experience in the first place? I had a long chat with one of my instructors and finally asked, "how did you start welding?". Lucky for him, he knew a guy. But he said that first job he got was a helper. He worked that job for a year and a half handing rods to his welder, holding pipe to be tacked, running leads, changing the machine settings, fetching tools, etc. all the while practicing his welding on breaks, lunch time, and after work on scrap metal. So I went back and started calling up the places I already applied to. I asked if they were looking for apprentices or helpers. If they weren't, I asked if they were looking for laborers. Some were, so I noted them and thanked them for their time. The one company that was looking for a helper (a shop hand they called it) was a waste management place. So I told them I just finished welding school and really want to be a welder, but would love to take the helper position to get some real world experience. They said ok come in on Monday and we'll check you out. I showed up and they actually gave me a weld test. I passed. Easy test, but that's not the point. They said, well there are no openings for welders but if you're interested, we'll take you as a hand and when a spot opens, you'll be the one we pick. I spent two months emptying and cleaning dumpsters to be welded on, putting small pieces of pulleys together and tacking them, sweeping floors, getting coffee, answering phones.. and one welder ended up leaving for greener pastures. Sure enough, my boss called the same day and asked if I was ready to weld. I spent the next 8 months welding those **** containers together. After about 10 months I applied for a bunch of shipyards, because most of us know, for some reason, shipyard work is booming these days. I applied as a pipe welder because, after all, I am a pipe welder. With zero experience welding pipe outside of school. I got calls back from 3 out of the 10 companies I applied to. I got past two interviews (the last one, I didn't mesh with the interviewer and ended up walking out) and tested for both. Newport News Shipyard and BAE. Both gave me job offers. Welding pipe. After 10 months working on dumpsters. I politely turned down both offers (stupid, I know) and applied with a contracting company that started their pipe welders at $30/hr no per diem. They gave me a weld test off my 10 months of crap welding. I passed (because I'm awesome), and am set to start in Louisiana at Acadia in two weeks as a combo welder.Anyway, the point is, like most everyone has already mentioned. Take those low paying crap jobs. Take ANY job you can get out of school. Whether it's mig welding in a production facility or tacking up structures for "real" welders. Whether it's shoveling **** out of the way for the welders to lay on clean ground. Once you get your foot in, it's 10x easier to get your hood on. And once you get your hood on, there's only one way to go. Up. Don't slack off. Show up every day ready to work. Do the work you're supposed to and then some. And let people know you can weld as well. Maybe the top 10% get into the welding field out of school as welders. 50% lose hope and quit. The last 40% work their way up.This is a field that requires long hours of hard work, and people ready and willing to do it. Showing that ethic will put you ahead of all the B class welders that do enough to get paid. There's nothing wrong with getting $12-14 an hour for a year because you're building a reputation.
Reply:I am 18, and going to school for welding. From what I have heard is a lot of people in my class are going to go get a job being a welder making top dollar right out of school. Not many of them are willing to work there way up the ladder. They all seem to think a good job will be handed to them. As much as I would like to walk out of school and be top notch welder, I don't think it works that way. To me I think it takes time to learn not just in school but on the job. The shop ime at now usually has me do all the grunt work, but I think its part of the learning process. The hard work I do now is just shaping me for my future, that's how I look at it.PROUD   AMERICAN
Reply:Originally Posted by CheeseheadGizzmo,  No offense taken by the way you perceived my comments. IMO Its good to hear feedback on how comments come across so you can write differently if needed.  What I was saying wasnt meant to be a complaint.  Im fully aware that you need to bust butt and work extra for no extra pay.  What I was trying to convey was the idea that the "welder shortage" bit is probably what is used the most to get younger people into welding.  Its what you will hear in every high school and every tech school. What they dont tell you is the things you will have to do to get there.  Again, Im not wishing there were cush jobs for every person who wants to be a welder.  Just pointing out that the "welder shortage" is only part of the story.  To be honest, Im glad the good jobs require the hard road, because I know I can do that, and I  know that puts me ahead of the people who just want a 9-5.  And my last sentence/main point of that still holds true IMO.  Agree or disagree?
Reply:The employment world has changed tremendously over the years.   When I got out of school in 1967, I scheduled four job interviews and had three good job offers.   At that time, there were plenty of jobs available in the technology areas.  But over the years since then, jobs have not been so plentiful.   But getting an education and skills still means a lot.   Of course, picking training and having an interest in the right areas helps a lot.  The other thing I believe is that getting additional training shows an potential employer that you are willing to go the extra mile, even if it doesn't fit the job itself.   It shows the ability and interest in learning.  I never really directly used the training that I had in school, but I would have never gotten the interview without the schooling.  (Just for clarification, my actual training was in electronics technology.  My 34 year career was in computer programming and support.)
Reply:You sound just like me 18 in school and looking for a start glad to hear their is more of us out their!Also many guys dislike mig welding jobs I fancy mig,flux core,and dual shield i understand wire welding in shops contains some younger people out of tech schools. I'm not saying that wire welding is so easy a monkey can do it but to bust into the welding field either a helpers job or mig welding job sounds like the best path.Last edited by flux core joe; 10-05-2013 at 12:14 PM.Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:A big shipyard or a fab shop is your best bet, they will let you practice on your own time and move you up when you're ready.
Reply:Locally their are no shipyards so fab shop or rig welder helper seems to be the best bet.Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools
Reply:The best way ti get a welding job as a young man in my opinion is this: You should choose one of your favoritr t-shirt, the one that say a really sexist message, then wear a pair of shoes that you look confident in, i suggest you a white color with velcro strap on, from eal mart, every young workers looks good in them, then go to the shop of your choice, then ask for a job a show your welding skills, then when you're in the shop floor, grab the MIG gun, put a distance about 12"-13/16 (325.4mm) between a piece of thick sheet metal (1/4 and over) go play in the machine settings and put both wire and voltage at maximum, then (without any personal protections or helemet) look your boss right in the eyes, then push the trigger (don't forget the 12"-13/16 distance between the contact tip and the metal piece) Then look at the wire that came red, be proud of it, and shake the hand of your future boss
Reply:LOL!extra
Reply:Question to everyone which field hires more welders field welders or shops? I have a feeling this will be based on location but I would like to hear everyone's opinions about this.Lincoln pro core 125 14''chop saw7 inch grinder,2-4.5 inch grinders,electric die grinder.Half inch drillAnd alot of hand tools