Welding Rifle

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I have some tig work to do on rifle. Broke flange on Winchester 94. I plan to reblue after welding any idea what tig rod would be best for weld that would hold good and would reblue good? Thank You for your input.
Reply:You need to find out what its made of. Could be sintered steel  or investment cast for all I know. There is probably a '94 website.DavidReal world weldin.  When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:Location on the gun will also play a role in this. The tab to hold the stock isn't critical, but some receiver areas are. You might effect the base steel if you weld.Really need more info overall. Also keep in mind the liability issue with something like this especially if you weld on any "critical" parts of the weapon. As soon as you touch it you are "it" if something should go wrong. In general, most times firearm issues have come up, the general consensus of guys here who were gunsmiths is to NOT touch it if you do not know exactly what to do if the weld needs to be done on any critical part ( bolt, barrel, receiver etc), for many reasons. Yorkiepap will probably chime in at some point. He was a gunsmith for years and will probably say exactly what I just said..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:+1 DSW -  As a former smith and dedicated gunny your best course of action is to find someone local with a good rep.   A lot of gun "welding" is done with silver solder to reduce the HAZ.  A 30-30 is rather anemic in most lists but it is still allowed up to 42,000 psi by SAAMI regs.  Thats a lot of umph awfully close to both your booger hook and your brain box.When any government, or any church for that matter, undertakes to say to its subjects, "This you may not read, this you must not see, this you are forbidden to know," the end result is tyranny and oppression, no matter how holy the motives.
Reply:I have one of the old '94s with the octagon barrels. Broke the top flange that holds the stock on way back when I was a kid. Gunsmith fit it back like a surgeon and silver soldered it. The line was so thin so as not to be terribly obvious tho you can see it if you know where to look, other than that it fits in with all the other character marks and dings. As far as strength tho it has held up. Give this site a go. You'll have to register. Scroll down to the 'gunsmith' section. Been ages since I've actually been over there till the gunsmith question came up here. http://www.chaski.org/homemachinist/index.php"The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Brownell's has the rod you need to weld that up. It has a higher nickel http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/cid=0...ch=welding_rodIt is not cheep but works great its the only rod I use on anything I want to reblue.
Reply:.FWIT and in case you haven't been lurking here long, just a bit of good advice:We Need Pictures!Not only of the work, but anything else of interest...which a 94 should be. What vintage and caliber is it, too!BTW, Welcome to the site
Reply:It's been my experience that no matter what you weld it with, it's going to have a red tint to it in that area after it's blued.Two turn tables and a microphone.
Reply:Hope pics work.It is a Winchester 94/ 30-30Don't know the year for sure but I think from the 70'sSome guy tried to braze it. What a messI used a drimmel to clean it up.The receiver is empty. I planned on wet rags inside and out on receiver2 tacks on top then v bottom and tigthen do the same to top.I got some 680 tig rod for dissembler metal which has nickel in it.I am open to suggestions. Thank You.
Reply:Here is where I am At
Reply:After looking at the pictures, I'd put a good tack on the top side with ER70s-2, then flip it over and put about 30 -50% V Groove on the back side and fill it to flush.  Dress that flat for your block to make good contact to guarantee flatness, then v the top side heavy to the tang side and finish it off. That rifle will never win any beauty contests after all that but you might make it look pretty good with a matte finish. I had an old 742 Remington with pitting that I had matte (bead blast) finished and blued and it look pretty danged good compared to the slick finish with rust pits.Good luck and post pics when you are done.Two turn tables and a microphone.
Reply:For a filler metal that is used for gun repair and mods by people that need the welded area to accept the bluing, look up Tartan G which is distributed by Rockmount/Nassau . They will show several different types of Tartan rod, but I believe they are all the same for Gas, Tig, etc. I guess the reason for the G, B, etc designations is to simplify the filler specification qualifications.
Reply:Deep  grooving.  Strong clamps.  Tig only.  Use Brownell's Heat Stop  AND wet rags.  Keep the welding time short to keep heat down. Use multiple small welds and wait between for cooldown.It does not take much to ruin the heat treat on the guns.   I would be more worried about the damage to the temper that occured from the amateur brazing.  There is a reason Gunsmiths use silver solder as much as possible.  Strength, and reduced possibility of heat damage.When I would see a job like that brazing come into my shop, I would start cussing under my breath and tell the customer that I would only work on it if they paid for me to do a rockwell test on the reciever frist.   If it was bad,  I refused to do a repair unless they wanted me to do a full heat treat.  They never took me up on that since that costs more than the guns  do new.Last edited by Housedad; 01-13-2012 at 12:18 AM.Victor Oxy weld/cut Setup Meco Midget Torch outfitEverlast 2016 250EX & Power Cool W300Lincoln Power mig 210MP  w/amptrol and Spool GunEverlast Powerarc 200 Hypertherm Powermax 45Bandsaw, Lathe, grinders, press, Bridgeport, etc.
Reply:Originally Posted by SRO1911+1 DSW -  As a former smith and dedicated gunny your best course of action is to find someone local with a good rep.   A lot of gun "welding" is done with silver solder to reduce the HAZ.  A 30-30 is rather anemic in most lists but it is still allowed up to 42,000 psi by SAAMI regs.  Thats a lot of umph awfully close to both your booger hook and your brain box.
Reply:Originally Posted by HousedadDeep  grooving.  Strong clamps.  Tig only.  Use Brownell's Heat Stop  AND wet rags.  Keep the welding time short to keep heat down. Use multiple small welds and wait between for cooldown.It does not take much to ruin the heat treat on the guns.   I would be more worried about the damage to the temper that occured from the amateur brazing.  There is a reason Gunsmiths use silver solder as much as possible.  Strength, and reduced possibility of heat damage.When I would see a job like that brazing come into my shop, I would start cussing under my breath and tell the customer that I would only work on it if they paid for me to do a rockwell test on the reciever frist.   If it was bad,  I refused to do a repair unless they wanted me to do a full heat treat.  They never took me up on that since that costs more than the guns  do new.
Reply:Originally Posted by HousedadDeep  grooving.  Strong clamps.  Tig only.  Use Brownell's Heat Stop  AND wet rags.  Keep the welding time short to keep heat down. Use multiple small welds and wait between for cooldown.It does not take much to ruin the heat treat on the guns.   I would be more worried about the damage to the temper that occured from the amateur brazing.  There is a reason Gunsmiths use silver solder as much as possible.  Strength, and reduced possibility of heat damage.When I would see a job like that brazing come into my shop, I would start cussing under my breath and tell the customer that I would only work on it if they paid for me to do a rockwell test on the reciever frist.   If it was bad,  I refused to do a repair unless they wanted me to do a full heat treat.  They never took me up on that since that costs more than the guns  do new.
Reply:With mine, the fact that it broke clean with no bending or rolling of the edges indicate that it was fairly hard or brittle metal. Broke in that very same spot BTW. Right there where the hammer rolls back under. Kind of a weak spot I guess."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Originally Posted by David RYou need to find out what its made of. Could be sintered steel  or investment cast for all I know. There is probably a '94 website.David
Reply:Ditto the Tartan TIG. 90,000 # rod and is blueable. I think it runs about $25 per pound, standard order is 11 pounds. If you want a rod or two shoot me a PM.